Germany, June 17, 1975
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Prabhupada: What is there? He is
digging? [break] Just see the fun.Devotee: Of all the four pillars of sinful
activity, is meat-eating the worst?
Prabhupada: Everything is worst. Sinful is sinful. Disease is disease. This body, either it is living or it is dead, it is not very important thing. Now see. And the whole world is after this body. Krsna says, "The body, either dead or alive, it is not a subject matter for serious consideration." Now see. And what the world is going on? Simply for bodily... Body means senses. It is very difficult to the, for the western people to understand that body is not important thing; the soul is important thing. First of all, they do not know what is soul and then consideration of importance. This is their position. And if one cannot understand what is soul, what he will understand about God? Soul is a minute particle of God. If one cannot understand about this minute particle, then what he'll understand of the Supreme? In the laboratory, if you can test a little sample, just like take a little sea water, analyze, you chemically test, then you can understand what is the composition of the sea water. But if you have no knowledge even a small drop of sea water, how you'll understand the sea, what... That is their position. They do not understand even the sample of spirit soul, as we are. Simply they are trying to cover it. "There is no soul. There is no soul. Life is generated from matter." Although they cannot prove it. A fool's paradise. The fools, rascals, they are explaining the living force in some way, and other fools are accepting. This is the position of western countries, Europe and America. It is a fool's paradise. It is paradise, certainly. Very, very, big, big building and advancement, but all rascals and fools. Fool's paradise. (pause) And if you call a fool a fool, he'll be angry. Murkhayopadeso hi prakopayati na samyati (?). (pause) [break] ...so many, so much production, but if nature's law can stop this production, then the question of over-population. If the nature likes, it can produce three times, four times this production. Prakrteh kriyamanani gunaih karmani [Bg. 3.27]. After all, nature is producing. We do not know how to deal with nature. Therefore there is scarcity, and we say, "over-population." There is no question of over-population. There are so many hundreds and thousands of birds within this forest, other animals. They have no problems of over-population. Eh? (pause) All these men, who are living in these villages, so what is their means of livelihood? Agriculture or industry? Or service?
Hamsaduta: I think mostly they work at some... Well, some service, yes.
Prabhupada: Factory.
Hamsaduta: Employed at some factory. But very few people actually work on the land. And we can see so much land. No one is working. 'Cause by machine, they can work so quick on the land. [break]
Prabhupada: This should be exemplary, that our community shall live in this way and save time for spiritual advancement of life. This example should be shown to the whole world, that "Here is a community. They have no problem, and they are simply interested in Krsna consciousness." This will be the idea. Is it possible?
Hamsaduta: Yes.
Prabhupada: Yes. "They do not do any industry. They do not kill cows. They do not go to cinema. They do not have illicit sex. They don't drink. No problems. Simply they're eating very nicely and chanting Hare Krsna." Show this example. At least, in this fool's paradise. They are thinking it is paradise. And the paradise is lost every ten years or fifteen years by the bombing. German bombs the France, and France bombs the... This is their paradise. So let them understand that "You are all fools. You are fool's paradise. This is life, what we are doing." Teach them so that the fools will understand what is life. They are manufacturing atom bomb. Russia is hiding himself.
Devotee: Now they've found out, Srila Prabhupada, that India has been, over the past few years, spending crores of rupees to develop the...
Prabhupada: Hm. And people are starving for want of. There was a cartoon that some public came to some minister: "Sir, we are starving. Give us our food." So the reply was: "Of course, that's a problem, food problem. But I can assure you that from next week you'll have television." (laughter) These rascals are like that. "Next, from next week, you'll have television, atom bomb. Never mind. Starve." (laughter) So that is also becoming fool's paradise. Jada-vidya jato mayara vaibhava. In this way, the more we increase sense, sense gratification by advancement of material..., the more we forget Krsna. And more we forget Krsna, we are more fools. (aside:) Don't come so near.
Devotee: In England and America now, more and more there is a big movement for birth control and contraceptives...
Prabhupada: Yes.
Devotee: ...as their means to conquer over the so-called over-population problem.
Prabhupada: No, it is not over-population. They don't want to take care of children. This is their problem. It is not the question of over-population. They want to remain free and enjoy life, that's all. No responsibility. That is the hippies. That is the hippy movement.
Devotee: I have seen in all the big colleges and universities in England that I have been to, that this, amongst the students, the boys and girls, it is becoming so free. It is just like a hippy commune, the universities and colleges.
Prabhupada: Yes. They are indebted in so many ways. Therefore human being should be responsible. But the modern civilization is teaching to become irresponsible.
Hamsaduta: [break] ...there, on the sun.
Prabhupada: So suppose if your heat increases, what happens to you?
Hamsaduta: I get sick.
Prabhupada: That's all. [break] ...samudvigna, always full of anxiety. Sada samudvigna-dhiyam. Intelligence is always absorbed: "Enemy may not come. Let me discover this, discover this atom bomb. This will save me. This will save me." This is their position. Sada samudvigna-dhiyam asad-grahat [SB 7.5.5]. Why this anxiety? Because they have accepted something false as truth. Asad-grahat. They have accepted sense gratification is the truth. Indriyani parany ahuh. Indriyani means senses. Para, supreme. This is supreme. And then, if somebody is little advanced, indriyebhyah param manah. Then the mental speculators, psychologists, philosophers, another, better class of rascals... This is the third-class rascal, and they are second-class rascal. Indriyani parany ahur indriyebhyah param manah, manasas tu para buddhih [Bg. 3.42]. Then the intelligent class. They consider, "What is this nonsense? They are all suffering here." In this way, one who becomes actually intelligent, wise, then he understands, "Krsna is everything." Bahunam janmanam ante jnanavan mam prapadyate [Bg. 7.19]. So that highest position we are giving by Krsna consciousness. We are not training them to be first-class fools, second-class fools, third-class... No. First-class intelligent. Krsna yei bhaje sei bada catura. Without being first-class, intelligent man, nobody can take to Krsna consciousness [break] ...drink everything. And why they fight? What is the cause? Suppose father gives all necessities of life to the children. Why they should fight? Simply ignorance and foolishness. That's all. Where is the cause of fighting? Just like Pandavas, to settle up their misunderstanding, Krsna said, "All right, they are ksatriyas, They cannot take up the occupation of vaisya or sudra. Give them five villages so that they'll be happy. They'll rule over, each one on the village." "No, Sir. Not a piece of land holding the tip of the needle can be spared without fighting." This is the world. The German, German war, First World War, what was the cause? The cause was that the Britishers will not allow the Germans to trade all over the world. They captured everything. And they'll purchase from Germany goods and cheat people...,
Hamsaduta: And sell...
Prabhupada: ..."Made in London," and sell it fifteen times higher than the Germans. This was their business. And that was the cause of... Is it not? Those who have studied history... This is the cause. So all this nonsense thing can be solved if we take it: "This is Krsna's property." And if you know something, you are manufac..., that's all right. You do it. I do something else. Or even if I do it, where is the cause of fighting? Because they do not know what is Krsna. (end)
Prabhupada: Everything is worst. Sinful is sinful. Disease is disease. This body, either it is living or it is dead, it is not very important thing. Now see. And the whole world is after this body. Krsna says, "The body, either dead or alive, it is not a subject matter for serious consideration." Now see. And what the world is going on? Simply for bodily... Body means senses. It is very difficult to the, for the western people to understand that body is not important thing; the soul is important thing. First of all, they do not know what is soul and then consideration of importance. This is their position. And if one cannot understand what is soul, what he will understand about God? Soul is a minute particle of God. If one cannot understand about this minute particle, then what he'll understand of the Supreme? In the laboratory, if you can test a little sample, just like take a little sea water, analyze, you chemically test, then you can understand what is the composition of the sea water. But if you have no knowledge even a small drop of sea water, how you'll understand the sea, what... That is their position. They do not understand even the sample of spirit soul, as we are. Simply they are trying to cover it. "There is no soul. There is no soul. Life is generated from matter." Although they cannot prove it. A fool's paradise. The fools, rascals, they are explaining the living force in some way, and other fools are accepting. This is the position of western countries, Europe and America. It is a fool's paradise. It is paradise, certainly. Very, very, big, big building and advancement, but all rascals and fools. Fool's paradise. (pause) And if you call a fool a fool, he'll be angry. Murkhayopadeso hi prakopayati na samyati (?). (pause) [break] ...so many, so much production, but if nature's law can stop this production, then the question of over-population. If the nature likes, it can produce three times, four times this production. Prakrteh kriyamanani gunaih karmani [Bg. 3.27]. After all, nature is producing. We do not know how to deal with nature. Therefore there is scarcity, and we say, "over-population." There is no question of over-population. There are so many hundreds and thousands of birds within this forest, other animals. They have no problems of over-population. Eh? (pause) All these men, who are living in these villages, so what is their means of livelihood? Agriculture or industry? Or service?
Hamsaduta: I think mostly they work at some... Well, some service, yes.
Prabhupada: Factory.
Hamsaduta: Employed at some factory. But very few people actually work on the land. And we can see so much land. No one is working. 'Cause by machine, they can work so quick on the land. [break]
Prabhupada: This should be exemplary, that our community shall live in this way and save time for spiritual advancement of life. This example should be shown to the whole world, that "Here is a community. They have no problem, and they are simply interested in Krsna consciousness." This will be the idea. Is it possible?
Hamsaduta: Yes.
Prabhupada: Yes. "They do not do any industry. They do not kill cows. They do not go to cinema. They do not have illicit sex. They don't drink. No problems. Simply they're eating very nicely and chanting Hare Krsna." Show this example. At least, in this fool's paradise. They are thinking it is paradise. And the paradise is lost every ten years or fifteen years by the bombing. German bombs the France, and France bombs the... This is their paradise. So let them understand that "You are all fools. You are fool's paradise. This is life, what we are doing." Teach them so that the fools will understand what is life. They are manufacturing atom bomb. Russia is hiding himself.
Devotee: Now they've found out, Srila Prabhupada, that India has been, over the past few years, spending crores of rupees to develop the...
Prabhupada: Hm. And people are starving for want of. There was a cartoon that some public came to some minister: "Sir, we are starving. Give us our food." So the reply was: "Of course, that's a problem, food problem. But I can assure you that from next week you'll have television." (laughter) These rascals are like that. "Next, from next week, you'll have television, atom bomb. Never mind. Starve." (laughter) So that is also becoming fool's paradise. Jada-vidya jato mayara vaibhava. In this way, the more we increase sense, sense gratification by advancement of material..., the more we forget Krsna. And more we forget Krsna, we are more fools. (aside:) Don't come so near.
Devotee: In England and America now, more and more there is a big movement for birth control and contraceptives...
Prabhupada: Yes.
Devotee: ...as their means to conquer over the so-called over-population problem.
Prabhupada: No, it is not over-population. They don't want to take care of children. This is their problem. It is not the question of over-population. They want to remain free and enjoy life, that's all. No responsibility. That is the hippies. That is the hippy movement.
Devotee: I have seen in all the big colleges and universities in England that I have been to, that this, amongst the students, the boys and girls, it is becoming so free. It is just like a hippy commune, the universities and colleges.
Prabhupada: Yes. They are indebted in so many ways. Therefore human being should be responsible. But the modern civilization is teaching to become irresponsible.
Hamsaduta: [break] ...there, on the sun.
Prabhupada: So suppose if your heat increases, what happens to you?
Hamsaduta: I get sick.
Prabhupada: That's all. [break] ...samudvigna, always full of anxiety. Sada samudvigna-dhiyam. Intelligence is always absorbed: "Enemy may not come. Let me discover this, discover this atom bomb. This will save me. This will save me." This is their position. Sada samudvigna-dhiyam asad-grahat [SB 7.5.5]. Why this anxiety? Because they have accepted something false as truth. Asad-grahat. They have accepted sense gratification is the truth. Indriyani parany ahuh. Indriyani means senses. Para, supreme. This is supreme. And then, if somebody is little advanced, indriyebhyah param manah. Then the mental speculators, psychologists, philosophers, another, better class of rascals... This is the third-class rascal, and they are second-class rascal. Indriyani parany ahur indriyebhyah param manah, manasas tu para buddhih [Bg. 3.42]. Then the intelligent class. They consider, "What is this nonsense? They are all suffering here." In this way, one who becomes actually intelligent, wise, then he understands, "Krsna is everything." Bahunam janmanam ante jnanavan mam prapadyate [Bg. 7.19]. So that highest position we are giving by Krsna consciousness. We are not training them to be first-class fools, second-class fools, third-class... No. First-class intelligent. Krsna yei bhaje sei bada catura. Without being first-class, intelligent man, nobody can take to Krsna consciousness [break] ...drink everything. And why they fight? What is the cause? Suppose father gives all necessities of life to the children. Why they should fight? Simply ignorance and foolishness. That's all. Where is the cause of fighting? Just like Pandavas, to settle up their misunderstanding, Krsna said, "All right, they are ksatriyas, They cannot take up the occupation of vaisya or sudra. Give them five villages so that they'll be happy. They'll rule over, each one on the village." "No, Sir. Not a piece of land holding the tip of the needle can be spared without fighting." This is the world. The German, German war, First World War, what was the cause? The cause was that the Britishers will not allow the Germans to trade all over the world. They captured everything. And they'll purchase from Germany goods and cheat people...,
Hamsaduta: And sell...
Prabhupada: ..."Made in London," and sell it fifteen times higher than the Germans. This was their business. And that was the cause of... Is it not? Those who have studied history... This is the cause. So all this nonsense thing can be solved if we take it: "This is Krsna's property." And if you know something, you are manufac..., that's all right. You do it. I do something else. Or even if I do it, where is the cause of fighting? Because they do not know what is Krsna. (end)
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Morning Walk -- June 17, 1974, Germany
© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International.
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