"Sankirtan Movement (NOT ISKCON) Is Incarnation Of Krsna"

"The editors of this particular lecture gave it a misleading title. Prabhupada never actually said ISKCON is an incarnation of Krishna. The Sankirtan Movement of Lord Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu is an incarnation of Lord Krishna. As much as ISKCON participates in and follows the orders of the founder acharya it may be admitted to be an amsa or vibhinamsa of the Lords incarnation. However as much as ISKCON deviates from the orders of its acharya it cannot be called even a partial representation of the Supreme Lord. At best it is a shadow only, Namabhasa."
- Joshua Hawley

Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.3.28
October 3, 1972, Los Angeles

Srila A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

Pradyumna: (leads chanting, etc.)

ete camsa-kalah pumsah
krsnas tu bhagavan svayam
indrari-vyakulam lokam
mrdayanti yuge yuge
[SB 1.3.28]

Translation: "All of the above-mentioned incarnations are either plenary portions or portions of the plenary portions of the Lord, but Lord Sri Krsna is the original Personality of Godhead. All of them appear on planets whenever there is a disturbance created by the atheists. The Lord incarnates to protect the theists."

Prabhupada: This is confirmed in Bhagavad-gita:

yada yada hi dharmasya
glanir bhavati bharata
abhyutthanam adharmasya
tadatmanam srjamy aham
[Bg. 4.7]

paritranaya sadhunam
vinasaya ca duskrtam
dharma-samsthapanarthaya
sambhavami yuge yuge
[Bg. 4.8]

So everything is property of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So this material world is also the property of Krsna. Because here the people do not care for Krsna, that does not mean that it is not the property of Krsna. Just like in the prison, within the prison walls, the prisoners, they say, "We don't care for the government." They say like that. But it does not mean that the prison house does not belong to the government. It is government property. But these rascals, they are being forced to live in the prison house, and still they say, "We don't care for the government." This is rascaldom. You are under my control, and as soon as you are in wrong, I am kicking you on your face, still, if you say, "I don't care for you..." You can say that. But there is force that you say, "Don't care," but I force you. You have to care.

This is material world. They are saying "Don't... There is no God. We don't care for God. We are, everyone, God." But maya, the police force, is there, kicking on the face. And they are subjected to so many tribulations, miserable conditions of life. Especially birth, death, old age and disease. Now you don't care for God. So why don't you stop your death? You stop your death. Krsna says in the Bhagavad-gita, mrtyuh sarva-haras ca aham, "To the rascals and the demons, I am death. I take away everything." Sarva-harah. Sarva-harah means these rascals are trying to possess so many things: cars, motorcars, skyscraper building, bank balance, big family, big friends, big empire, and so many things. But when death comes, he cannot protect himself, what to speak of protecting other things. You see? So he's under full control, the demons. And every moment, he's under control. Suppose I have got money. I can eat so much. But as soon as you eat little more, immediately you are under control; you cannot eat for three days. Indigestion, immediately. And still, the rascal says that "I am not controlled." If there is little pain here, he immediately becomes: "Where is doctor, where is doctor, where is doctor?" And still he says, "I'm not controlled," and "I am God."

He does not know what is the meaning of God. God is never controlled by anyone. That is God. That is the definition of God. If you are God, then why you are being controlled? Because they're rascals, demons, foolishly speaking something nonsense. But we should know that God means controller. He's not controlled. And when God was present on this planet, He showed what kind of God He is. Paritranaya sadhunam vinasaya ca duskrtam [Bg. 4.8]. Anyone, any demon who tried to imitate God, they were all killed, all killed. The Kamsa, his only policy was to kill Krsna. "As soon as Krsna comes, kill Him." So many plans he made. He... Krsna happened to be his sister's son. So he imprisoned the sister and brother-in-law so that "He may beget children, but in my front... I must remain... As soon as children, child is born, I shall kill."

So this is the policy of the demons. Therefore, indrari-vyakulam lokam. When people become, the inhabitants of all different planets, they become very much perturbed on account of these demonic... In this Kali-yuga especially, the demons are so large in number that people are actually in harassment. Every year, they are presenting taxation bill. And wherefrom the taxation will come? The taxation will come from your pocket and my pocket. They will charge income tax, and the storekeepers will increase the value of commodity. So you have to pay. So you are, we are complaining, "Oh, the things are going high price." But why? Because the demons are levying taxes. The... It is not the scarcity of goods. There is sufficient commodity, sufficient. But they have made a economic plan. Just like in your country, the government said that "You don't produce more." Why? If one can produce... Krsna has given food. You have to simply little work and produce your food. But in order to keep the balance of price, they say, "Don't produce." Why not produce? So many people are, they are... If actually we produce foodstuff in the ordinary way, then we can produce foodstuff so much that ten times of the whole population of the world can be fed. Ten times. There is no question of scarcity or poverty. There is no question. We create. These demons, they create.

You have no experience. I have got experience. Or some of the Indians who are present... In 1942, the government created artificial famine, artificial famine. The government began to purchase. The poli... That time, the war was going on. So Mr. Churchill's policy was that "Keep the people in scarcity, and they will, they'll voluntarily come and become soldiers." That was the policy. "You have no money. So..., and the another venue is opened. Yes, you become a soldier. You get so much money." People, out of poverty, would go there. That was the policy. So this policy was executed that government began to purchase rice and, I mean to say, commodities which are daily necessities. And... Any price, any price they can offer. Because the currency in their hand. They can print the so-called papers, hundred dollars, and pay you. And you becomes satisfied: "Oh, I have got hundred dollars." But it is a piece of paper. The cheating is from the government. Why the people will not learn how to cheat?

So this is going on. This is called demonic. Demon means for their own sense satisfaction, they are prepared to do anything wrong. Just like this Kamsa. Kamsa, the elder brother of Krsna's mother, and as soon as he heard an omen from the sky that "You rascal Kamsa, you are taking your brother and sis..., brother-in-law and sister in your chariot to their home in their marriage ceremony, but you rascal do not know this sister's son will kill you." "Oh, my sister's son will kill me?" Immediately caught up sister: "Finish my sister." Vasudeva saw. "What nonsense you are doing? You are such a big king. And your sister, younger sister, and she is married in this auspicious moment. Why you are killing?" "No, she is the cause of my death." Then, "Your sister is not the cause of your death. Her son. That's all right. But I promise, all the sons will be delivered to you." Because it is the husband's duty to give protection. So someway or other, he saved the situation.

So this is the demon. He did not consider that "Here is my poor, younger sister. She's just now married. In jubilation she's going at her husband's home. How auspicious ceremony." And he was personally driving the chariot. But as soon as he heard that "Oh, there is danger from my sister," he did not care anything, no relationship, no ceremony, no auspicity, nothing. This is demon. Demon means for his self-interest, he can do anything nons..., nonsense. That is demon. And demigod means he'll consider thrice before doing anything. Just like Arjuna. Arjuna was insulted in so many ways by the other party, his cousin-brothers. His kingdom was taken. They were sent to forest for thirteen years. His wife was insulted. So many things. But still, he was considering, "Whether I shall kill my kinsmen? The other side, they're all my brothers, nephews, brother-in-law. Whether I shall fight and kill them? Krsna, I don't wish to kill them. Let them enjoy." This is demigod, In spite of the other party, aggressor in so many ways, he was thinking. And here you see Kamsa, simply for the news that in future his sister's son will kill him, immediately he was prepared to kill his sister. And in the marriage ceremony. This is the distinction between demigod and demon. Just try to understand. A demon has no consideration.

So in this age, Kali-yuga especially, demoniac, everything, demons, godless. Demon means godless. Indrari. Demons means Indra, or indrasya ari. Ari means enemy. Indra is demigod. And his enemy, that is demon. Indrari. Just like you are, when you go to preach Krsna consciousness, you have got so many enemies. They do not act directly, but they are very much envious: "What these nonsense are chanting Hare Krsna?" You see? They want to disturb. Just like we have to close this door because the demons will disturb. You see? So demons means enemy of the demigods, enemy of the devotees. Those who are God conscious, those who are abiding by the orders of God, they're demigods. God. Demigods means they're also God, but subordinate to God. They don't say, "I am God. I am completely." No, a Vaisnava will never say so. He knows that "I am eternal servant of God." Therefore demigod. Otherwise, their qualification is godly.

So indrari-vyakulam... Indra. Indra is demigod. He's the king of the demigods. So indrari-vyakulam. When people become very much disturbed by this demonic government and demons... So dharmasya glanih. Dharmasya glanih means discrepancies in the matter of executing religious principles. In Kamsa's time... Just like in Russia, you cannot chant Hare Krsna mantra. What to speak of chanting in the street, you cannot chant even in private. That is their law. So that law is coming gradually everywhere, godless. In China, I've heard, anyone teaching about God, next life, he'll be shot. Is it not? Somebody said me. Anyone teaching "Next life and God," he'll be shot down. So your country is still very nice because you are not shooting Krsna conscious people, but there is possibility. Demons are increasing. Demons are increasing. But don't be afraid. Krsna is there. Just like Krsna's mother and father were so much, I mean to say, harassed by Kamsa. But at the end, Kamsa was killed by Krsna.

So we may be harassed for the time being, but Krsna will save. This is saranagati. Avasya rakhibe krsna visvasa palana. The saranagati means, surrender means that "Krsna will save me. I, I'll not do anything against the devotional service. Even there is torture..." Just like Prahlada Maharaja. He was tortured by his father. He had... Krsna's mother was tortured by his brother. Not outsider. So the demons are so rascal, they don't care for son, sister, mother. No. "As soon as it is against my personal sense gratification, I must finish this." But be sure that Krsna will save. We have got so many instances. As Prahlada Maharaja was saved by Hiranyaka..., by Narasimhadeva from the hands of his father, Hiranyakasipu; Devaki was saved, Vasudeva was saved from the hands of Kamsa; so you will be also saved. Because there is promise in the Bhagavad-gita: kaunteya pratijanihi na me bhaktah pranasyati. Krsna says, "Make it a declaration throughout the whole world that anyone who is My devotee, he'll never be annihilated. He'll be protected. I'll give him protection." Samo 'ham sarva-bhutesu. Samo 'ham sarva-bhutesu na me dvesyo 'sti na priyah. Krsna says in the Bhagavad-gita that "I am equal to everyone. Nobody is My enemy, nobody is My friend." Ye tu bhajanti mam pritya. "But those who are devotees, engaged twenty-four hours, I give them special protection. I give them special protection." So the demons will be there, and they will always give trouble to the demigods, or the devotees, but you don't stop your function, devotional service. Don't be afraid of the demons. Indrari-vyakulam lokam mrdayanti. This mrdayanti means "giving protection" Yes. Give protection.

So this sankirtana movement, Hare Krsna movement, is also incarnation of Krsna. Nama-rupe avatara. Krsna can become incarnation in sound form also. Not even a physical form. Physical form also there; everything is there. But especially this age, Krsna is incarnated in His name. The name of Krsna is not different from Krsna. So nama-rupe krsna-avatara. So Krsna is already there. The whole world is now demonic, anti govern..., anti-God, anti-matter or anti-God now. So the incarnation has already come. Those who will take shelter of this incarnation of Krsna's name, they will be never annihilated. Take it for granted. Yes. So incarnation. Krsna's name and Krsna, no difference. That is omnipotency. Omnipotency. Omnipotency means everything is Krsna's energy. So the same potency in the energy and the energetic. This is omnipotency. God is omnipotent; He can give you protection when you take shelter of His name. Because His name is nondifferent from Him. Abhinnatvan nama-naminoh. Nama-krsna. Nama cintamanih krsnah, purnah suddho nitya-mukto 'bhinnatvan nama-naminoh. Don't think this Krsna's name is less efficient than Krsna. No. Purna. As Krsna is perfect, similarly, this name is also perfect. Purnah suddhah. As Krsna is pure, without any material contamination, apapa-viddham, no, nothing sin, sinful can affect him... You have read it in the Isopanisad. Just like sunshine. Infection cannot infect sunshine. Some disease can infect you, me, because we are less potential. But it cannot infect the sum. Rather, the sunshine will sterilize the infection. So anything infectious, anything sinful, cannot infect Krsna. Rather sinful activities in touch with Krsna will become purified. This is the process.

There are many instances. Just like Prahlada Maharaja, you can see. Prahlada Maharaja is standing, and his father is being killed before him. This is sinful. Can you tolerate? Suppose if somebody comes to kill me, and you will see and laugh? You'll do, will you do that? Why? That is sinful. So here Prahlada Maharaja is seeing. It is not protesting. Prahlada Maharaja is not protesting, "Why you are killing my father?" No. He's seeing. So why Prahlada Maharaja is worshiped? Why he has become a mahajana, authority? You can say, "Oh, he's a most sinful. He has seen in his presence, his father is being killed, and he did not protest." You can say so. But because it is in connection with Krsna, Prahlada Maharaja is the most exalted devotee. He's not sinful. The gopis. The gopis, they were wives, householder's wife, sister, daughter. So they went at dead of night to dance with Krsna. This is sinful according to Vedic injunction. No young girl can go to any young boy without being married. That is Vedic injunction. So practically it was sinful. And... But because it was with Krsna, in connection with Krsna, they went to dance with Krsna, the gopis are worshiped more than any devotee in the world. Caitanya Mahaprabhu... Gopis, exalted. Ramya kacid upasana vraja-vadhu-vargena ya kalpita. So actually, they did sinful acts, action, by leaving their father, brother or husband and went to Krsna at dead of night. They were all young girls. That is, according to Vedic injunction that is sinful. But they are worshiped.

Caitanya Mahaprabhu, such a big sannyasi, who never allowed any woman to come near to offer respect... He was so strict. They would offer respect from distance. He says, ramya kacid upasana. He says that the worship, the method of worship conceived by the gopis, that is, there is no comparison. Ramya kacid upasana vraja-vadhu-vargena ya kalpita. Now, He was so much strict about women. Why He is praising the external sinful activities of the gopis? Why? Because it is in connection with Krsna. There are many instances. Just like Bali Maharaja. Bali Maharaja gave up the connection with his spiritual master. Why? His spiritual master said, "You don't give to Krsna." He was thinking that "If this rascal, everything gives to Krsna, then how I shall live? I am living at his maintenance." Just like you sometimes give me maintenance, I live. So you stop the maintenance, I shall die. So he thought like that, that "He's my disciple, and he's going to..., everything to Krsna. Then I'll not get my maintenance. Then I shall die." He stopped him: "Don't give to Krsna." But Bali Maharaja said, "Oh, you are stopping me to give to Krsna? I give up your relation. I don't want." He became a mahajana. Prahlada Maharaja became a mahajana. Gopis became the most worshipable.

So Krsna is so powerful that even in the ordinary ways it looks sinful, but if it is actually done for Krsna's sake... The same thing, Arjuna. He was thinking that "Killing of my family members, it is sinful." He argued with Krsna. Therefore this Bhagavad-gita is there. He was simply arguing that "I'll not fight. I'll not kill my grandfather, my teacher, my brother, my nephews, my brother-in-laws. No, no, I am not going to... It is sinful." But at the end he did it, because he understood, "Oh, it is for Krsna. All right. I shall all, take all the risk. That's all right." So as Krsna..., the devotee takes all the risk of life, similarly, Krsna gives all the protection to the devotee. Don't be afraid.

So indrari-vyakulam lokam mrdayanti yuge yuge. He's always giving protection to the devotees. Don't be afraid. And another thing is that ete ca amsa-kalah pumsah. Pumsah means the person, the Supreme Person. So the Mayavadi rascals' theory is that the Absolute Truth is impersonal, and when He comes to be present before us as person, He accepts a material body. This is their theory, maya, Mayavada, that Krsna's body is also bone and skin. That is their theory. They accept, "Yes, Krsna is God, but He has accepted a body of flesh and bone." This is Mayavada theory. But the sastra does not say. Krsna Himself says, avajananti mam mudha manusim tanum asritam: [Bg. 9.11] "These rascals, they also consider Me like one ordinary human being because I have come here just like human being." He, He has said, mudho nabhijanati: "Deride at Me." This is their... To consider Krsna's body as made of flesh and bone, that means minimizing the value of Krsna. Dr. Radhakrishnan has done it. No. Krsna, the Absolute is, Absolute Truth is always person. Pumsah, here it is said. Ete camsa-kalah pumsah [SB 1.3.28]. The incarnation... When some incarnation comes, He's expansion of the person, not that He accepts this material body. Ete ca amsa-kalah pumsah. The, all the descriptions of the incarnations have been given before this verse. So therefore, it is concluding that "All these incarnations, they are expansion of the spiritual body of the Supreme Personality of Godhead." Not that the Absolute Truth is imperson, and He, He's accepting a form with material body. No. That is not. That is not. Just like here, Deity. He is also expansion, arca-vigraha. Arca-avatara. Don't think that it is made of stone or metal. It is expansion of Krsna. You want to worship. Krsna has expanded Himself to come here to accept your service. Don't think it is made of stone. So ete camsa-kalah pumsah krsnas tu bhagavan svayam [SB 1.3.28].

So bhagavan svayam, the Absolute Truth is Bhagavan. Bhagavan means person, with six opulences. And why He comes? Indrari-vyakulam lokam mrdayanti yuge yuge. People are harassed by these demons. Therefore, He comes to give protection. Paritranaya sadhunam. He comes to give protection to the sadhu. They are very much anxious to be... When they are in danger, they pray for Krsna. So just to satisfy them, Krsna comes. Not even for killing the demons. But when He comes, He also executes this service also, to kill all these demons. Otherwise, for killing demons, He does not require to come. He, He has got many agents. So many demons can be killed within a second. For this purpose, killing purpose, Krsna does not come. He comes especially for the devotee. Just like Prahlada Maharaja. For give darsana personally to Prahlada Maharaja -- he has suffered in the hands of his father -- He appeared. Otherwise, to kill Hiranyakasipu, oh, it is not very big business. Indrari-vyakulam lokam mrdayanti. When a devotee is very much harassed, so He comes in, as incarnation. So you stick to remain a pure devotee, and Krsna will give you all protection.

Thank you very much. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.3.28 -- Los Angeles, October 3, 1972