"Modern Civilization Vs. Model Civilization"

74/04/04 Bombay, Bhagavad-gita 4.15



Pradyumna: (leads chanting): Translation: All the liberated souls in ancient times acted with this understanding and so attained liberation. Therefore, as the ancients, you should perform your duty in this divine consciousness."

Prabhupada:

evam jnatva krtam karma
purvair api mumuksubhih
kuru karmaiva tasmat tvam
purvaih purvataram krtam

Now, in this verse three times, four times, the word has been used, purvataram, purvatamaih. Kuru karmaiva tasmat tvam purvaih purvataram krtam. Purva, purvataram, purvatama: comparative, superlative, and positive. So this is the process that we have to follow the previous acaryas. That is Vedic system.

In the very beginning of this chapter Krsna said, evam parampara-praptam imam rajarsayo viduh [Bg. 4.2]. We haven't got to make any research, modern understanding. There is no question of modern understanding. We are all following the old, ancient understanding. Now, even from ordinary platform, the eating, sleeping, mating, and defending, is that modern? It is not modern. Formerly also, all living entities were eating, they were sleeping, they were having sex intercourse and they were defending. The main business is...

Nothing is modernized. You can say, "modernized," but the principle is the same, old system. Nobody can change. And people are dying also. Janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi [Bg. 13.9]. That is also the old system. Everyone is taking birth, everyone is growing, everyone is falling diseased, and everyone is dying. Can the modern system stop this? The modern system can say, "Now you do not require to eat, you do not require to sleep," or "You do not require to have sex,"or "You do not require to defend?" No. The same system. "The old wine in a new bottle."

Similarly, janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi, five thousand years before, Krsna said... This is real problem: janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi-duhkha-dosanudarsanam. "The same problem is still going on. So it is useless to say that modern time, modern ways, modern things. There is nothing modern. The old thing is going on. So if we follow systematically the previous acaryas, previous system, as Krsna is advising... Krsna does not advise, "Modern." Five thousand years ago He instructed Bhagavad-gita. Still, He was saying purva purvataraih, purvatamaih. Evam parampara-praptam imam rajarsayo viduh [Bg. 4.2]. This is intelligence. We have to accept the real truth and follow it. It does not mean modern age or previous age, past age. That is not Vedic system.

The old system is going on, everything. The sun is also the old. The sun is rising as it was doing in olden times. The moon is also rising. The years and season are changing. Everything is going on. Why we should not accept the system of Vedic knowledge, the oldest of all in the world? There is no history. That is intelligence.

So Krsna advising here, evam jnatva krtam karma purvair api mumuksubhih. What Krsna said? That the karma should be divided according to the quality of the person. There are three qualities -- sattva-guna, rajo-guna, tamo-guna -- of the material world. Guna-mayi maya. Daivi hy esa guna-mayi mama maya [Bg. 7.14]. So guna-mayi. Guna means the three qualities: sattva-guna, rajo-guna, tamo-guna. And guna, another, means rope. Just like strong rope, three, three ropes. You take three ropes and wind it, it becomes very strong. That is also guna-mayi. So Krsna advised, catur-varnyam maya srstam guna-karma-vibhagasah [Bg. 4.13]. So guna-karma-vibhagasah, guna, quality, is there. Now you act according to the quality. Don't be idle.

Now at the modern age, in every country all over the world, there is unemployment. Why unemployment? Because people do not know how to divide the population according to guna and karma. One is qualified as a sudra, and he is engaged in the business of a ksatriya. There is problem. The people are educated as sudras, and when they are called for recruiting for the armies, they are afraid. The problem is very acute in America. Nobody wants to join military department. Why they will join? They have been trained up as sudra, and why they will be like the business of ksatriya? That is the problem. Everyone wants to avoid. Actually, the hippy movement is started on account of this, what is this?

Devotees: Draft.

Prabhupada: Draft, yes. Young men, they want to avoid it, and they are forced. Therefore they take the part of madman or lunatic, in this way. This is going on, to avoid it. So that is the problem.

People should be trained up according to quality and work. There must be institution to train first-class men. There are first-class men, intellectuals. They should be trained up as brahmanas. That is the system. Second-class men, they should be trained up as ksatriyas. Third-class men, they should be trained up as vaisyas. And fourth-class men, means below third-class, they should be engaged as sudras, workers, and below them, candala. That I have already explained. So nobody should be left alone. Everyone should be engaged. That is Krsna consciousness. Everyone should be engaged in Krsna consciousness business. Then there will be no unemployment.

First-class men, let them become scholars, philosophers, preachers, instructors, brahminical business. Pathana pathana yajana yajana dana pratigrahah. These are the six businesses for the brahmana class. They should be highly educated, pathana, highly learned, and pathana, and they should educate others also. But if he is not educated, how he will educate others? Pathana pathana yajana yajana. He should be worshipper of the Supreme Lord, yajana, and yajana, he should instruct others also.

sri-vigraharadhana-nitya-nana-
srngara-tan-mandira-marjanadau
yuktasya bhaktams ca niyunjato 'pi
vande guroh sri-caranaravindam

Sri-vigraha. This is yajana yajana. Sri-vigraha. This is Sri-vigraha, Krsna's arca-murti. Krsna has taken, advented, as avatara, arca-avatara. Arca-avatara means made of stone, wood, metal, jewel, or coloring, painting. There are eight kinds of arca-avatara. So Krsna has consented to descend before us to accept our service in a manner which we can do. If Krsna remains in His virad-rupa, then it will be very difficult to capture Him. Krsna remains in virad-rupa, but He becomes arca-vigraha, a small deity, so that everyone can worship Him at home. It does not take much time, it does not take much place. To make dress of Krsna you can utilize little cloth. Krsna is agreeable to accept your service. And offering? Patram puspam phalam toyam yo me bhaktya prayacchati [Bg. 9.26]. At any means you can worship Krsna, and that is the business of brahmana and Vaisnava.

Brahmana... Brahma janati. One must know what is Krsna. Param brahma param dhama pavitram para... [Bg. 10.12]. Brahma. Brahma janatiti brahmanah. One who is aware of Krsna, what is Krsna, he is above brahmana. Brahmana qualification is already there. Because a brahmana means one who knows Krsna, Parabrahman. That is brahmana. Brahma janatiti brahmanah. Veda-pathad bhaved vipro brahma janatiti brahmanah. Janmana jayate sudrah samskarad bhaved dvijah, veda-pathad bhaved vipro brahma janatiti brahmanah. This is the process.

Janmana, by birth, everyone is sudra or candala. Those who are satisfied that "I have taken birth in my brahmana family, so now my business is over." No. Janmana jayate sudrah. The birth by the father and mother, that is sudra, that is not brahmana. Samskara. If a man is born brahmana, then why there is necessity of sacred thread ceremony? No. That is the samskara. Samskara means the sacred thread is the symbol. It is offered by the acarya. It is the certificate that "This boy has been trained up as a brahmana."

Therefore the sacred thread is a symbolic presentation. Not that to purchase one two-paise worth sacred thread and one becomes brahmana. No. Now, of course, in Kali-yuga... Vipratve sutram eva hi. In Kali-yuga this will go on. Vipratve. A brahmana, ksatriya, sudra, brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya. Simply purchase one thread from the market and get it on your body and you become.... Vipratve sutram eva hi. No, that is not actually. It is a qualification and it is certificate. One who has got the sacred thread, that means...

Just like in our Vedic system, one has got the red mark on the forehead, one woman. It is to be understood that she is married. Similarly, one who has got the sacred thread means that he has approached qualified acarya, and the acarya has recognized him as brahmana. This is sacred thread, not that purchase one sacred thread and get it and become a brahmana. No. This is very important thing. And then divide. First of all educate. Where is that education? Of course, this is meant for...

At least in India, Indians should be educated as brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sudra. That is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission.

bharata-bhumite haila manusya-janma yara
janma sarthaka kari' kara para-upakara
[Cc. Adi 9.41]

This is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission. Anyone who has taken birth in India, he must take the Vedic culture.

The Vedic culture is described here by Krsna, the master of the Vedas. Vedanta-vid vedanta-krt caham. That supreme Vedantist. Krsna says in the Fifteenth Chapter that vedanta-vit: "I am the knower, supreme knower of the Vedanta." Vedanta-vit and vedanta-krt: "I am the compiler of the Vedanta." So wherefrom you'll learn Vedanta? From Krsna. Vedais ca sarvair aham eva vedyah [Bg. 15.15]. This is the formula. So one who knows Krsna, he is vedanta-vit, because he has learned the Vedanta philosophy. What is that Vedanta philosophy? Veda means knowledge, and anta means the end. So Vedanta means the end, the end of all knowledge.

What is that end of all knowledge? Bahunam janmanam ante jnanavan mam prapadyate: [Bg. 7.19] "After many, many births, when actually one is wise, Vedantist," mam prapadyate, "he surrenders unto Me." Vasudevah sarvam iti sa mahatma su-durlabhah: [Bg. 7.19] "Such kind of mahatma is very, very rare, one who knows," vasudevah sarvam iti, "Vasudeva, Krsna, is the origin of everything."

aham sarvasya prabhavo
mattah sarvam pravartate
iti matva bhajante mam
budha bhava-samanvitah
[Bg. 10.8]

These are the knowledge. One who knows that Krsna is the origin, cause of all causes... Govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami **.

isvarah paramah krsnah
sac-cid-ananda-vigrahah
anadir adir govindah
sarva-karana-karanam
[Bs. 5.1]

Cause of all causes. When one is fully aware of this, he is brahmana Vaisnava. Brahma janatiti brahmana. This brahma janati means param brahma is Krsna. One who knows what is Krsna, "Krsna is the origin. He's the original cause of all causes," sarva-karana-karanam [Bs. 5.1], so he is brahmana. He is Vedantist. He knows everything. And if he acts like that, then what to speak...

That is advised here. Evam jnatva krtam karma purvair api mumuksubhih. Evam jnatva. First of all it is the business of brahmana to understand. So if you cannot understand, then you do the business of ksatriya. If you cannot do that, then do the business of a vaisya. And if you cannot do that, then remain as a worker. Assist others. Assist the brahmana, the ksatriya. So everyone will be engaged. And it is the duty of the government to see that nobody is unemployed. Then it will be devil's workshop. There will be so much movement, Communist movement, this movement, that movement, because everyone is not employed. The unemployment, devil's workshop, that is breeding so many isms and that... Otherwise, if anyone is engaged into work, his brain will not be a devil's workshop. He will work something.

So this is Krsna consciousness movement, that everyone should be employed in Krsna consciousness. That I am repeatedly saying to my students, that "Nobody sit idly. You must be engaged, either as a brahmana or as a ksatriya or as a vaisya or at last, as a sudra. But there must be..." But anyone who is engaged in the business of.... Superficially, it may be the brahmana's business, but in Krsna consciousness there is no such difference. Even though one is sweeping the temple, it may be sudra's business, but he can be allowed to worship the Deity, the brahmana's business. Because a devotee is neither brahmana, neither ksatriya, nor vaisya, nor sudra, because he is above. He is in the transcendental position. But in this material world, guna-karma, if one is not fit for performing the work as a brahmana, he can work as a sudra, he can work as a vaisya, but employment must be there for Krsna. That is Krsna consciousness movement. Employment must be there.

So our Krsna consciousness movement, this system is being followed. We have got a very nice business. Spiritual Sky. We are making good profit, millions of dollars. Therefore our expenditure is going on. We sell our books and we sell our Spiritual Sky products. In this way, we meet not less than eight to ten lakhs of rupees expenditure per month, this Krsna consciousness movement. We are not idle; neither we allow anyone to become idle. It is not this business that go to the temple and ring the bell and close the door and go to smoke ganja. No, it is not like that. It is not like that.

evam jnatva krtam karma
purvair api mumuksubhih
kuru karmaiva tasmat tvam
purvaih purvataram krtam

So we have to follow.

Now, follow purvataraih. Now, we are listening Bhagavad-gita. So Bhagavad-gita was first heard by the Vivasvan, the sun-god. So giving aside sun-god, we can take at least Arjuna. Purvataraih, mahadbhih. Arjuna is mahat, mahat. Sa mahatma su-dur... Because he knows Krsna. Sisyas te 'ham sadhi mam tvam prapannam [Bg. 2.7]. He surrendered to Krsna for solution of the problem, whether he was to fight or not to fight. So Krsna instructed directly and Krsna certified him, bhakto 'si me priyo 'si: [Bg. 4.3] "You are my dear friend. You are My devotee. Therefore I shall talk to you the mystery." Rahasyam etad uttamam, Bhagavad-gita. So take the lesson from Arjuna, how he acted, how he understood Bhagavad-gita. Then purvataraih. You don't have to go very long, long before. You take the symbolical representation of Krsna, Arjuna. So how did he understood? How he did understand Krsna? He understood Krsna: param brahma param dhama pavitram paramam bhavan [Bg. 10.12]. So you understand like that.

Why do you misinterpret, "Oh there is no Krsna, there is no battlefield, it is all fictitious, I can make my own commentary, you can make your own..."? Why all this nonsense? Purvataraih. Just Arjuna did, Arjuna accepted, accept like that. Then your Bhagavad-gita reading is perfect. Otherwise simply wasting your time and misleading others. "This meaning is, this meaning is, that meaning is that." Why meaning is that? What right you have got to say like that? But these rascals are doing and spoiling the whole country. You see? Misinterpreting. There is no misinterpretation. Try to understand Bhagavad-gita as it is. Your life will be successful. So try to follow Arjuna. Mahajano yena gatah sa panthah [Cc. Madhya 17.186]. Dharmasya tattvam nihitam guhayam mahajano yena gatah sa panthah. (aside:) Take this.

So the sastra says, tarko 'pratisthah: "If you simply want to know what is self-realization, what is religion, simply by argument, logic, it is not possible." Tarko 'pratisthah srutayo vibhinnah: "If you want to learn by studying scriptures, Vedic literature, you will find different scriptures." Sama, Yajur, Rg, Atharva, then different Puranas. There are eighteen Puranas, Mahabharata. That is also impossible, means you cannot understand.

Srutayo vibhinna nasav rsir yasya matam na bhinnam. But if you philosophize, following some philosopher... There are six kinds of philosophers in India. So philosopher means he must decry another philosopher. He must give a new theory. So nasav rsir yasya matam na bhinnam. That will also not help. Dharmasya tattvam nihitam guhayam. It is very confidential subject matter.

Mahajano yena gatah so panthah. Then you accept the mahajana. Mahajana means following the parampara system. According to Vedic system, there are twelve mahajanas. Svayambhur naradah sambhuh kumarah kapilo manuh, janako bhismah and vaiyasakir vayam [SB 6.3.20], like that. I am just now forgetting. Excuse me. Svayambhur naradah sambhuh kapilo kumarah manuh, prahlado janako bhismah [SB 6.3.20]. Prahlada, Prahlada Maharaja, this grhastha. Amongst these mahajanas, there are sannyasis, there are brahmacaris, and there are grhasthas also. So it does not mean only the sannyasi and brahmacari can become mahajana. There are grhasthas also. Just like Prahlada Maharaja is grhastha. Brahma is grhastha. Svayambhu. Svayambhu. Narada is brahmacari. Svayambhur naradah sambhuh [SB 6.3.20]. Sambhu, Lord Siva, is also grhastha. Svayambhur naradah kumarah, brahmacari, four Kumaras, from the birth, naisthika-brahmacari. Kapila, Kapila is also brahmacari. Svayambhur naradah sambhuh kumarah kapilo manuh [SB 6.3.20]. Manu is grhastha. Similarly, Prahlada Maharaja is also grhastha. Prahlado janakah. Janaka Maharaja is also grhastha. Bhisma, brahmacari. Bhisma, Bali, Bali Maharaja, grhastha. Vaiyasaki, a brahmacari. So it doesn't matter whether one is brahmacari, sannyasi or grhastha, he must know the science.

Just like if you go to a scientist man, you don't inquire whether he is a brahmacari or sannyasi or grhastha. You require the knowledge. That is also confirmed by Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu says,

kiba vipra, kiba nyasi, sudra kene naya
yei krsna-tattva-vetta, sei 'guru' haya
[Cc. Madhya 8.128]

It doesn't matter whether one is a brahmana, kiba vipra, kiba sudra, or one is sudra, kiba vipra, kiba nyasi, kene naya, or whether he is a sannyasi. Yei krsna-tattva-vetta, one must know the science of Krsna. The science of Krsna is being explained by Krsna Himself.

So in whatever position you are, you try to understand the science of Krsna. Then you become guru. That is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission.

yare dekha, tare kaha 'krsna'-upadesa
amara ajnaya guru hana tara' ei desa
[Cc. Madhya 7.128]

This is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission. He says, "You become a spiritual master." "How? I have no qualification." "No. You just accept my order?" "So what is your order, sir?" Yare dekha, tare kaha 'krsna'-upadesa: [Cc. Madhya 7.128] "You simply speak the instruction of Krsna whoever you meet. Then you become a spiritual master."

So actually it is happening. We are not wonderful men. But our only business is that we are speaking only the same thing as Krsna has spoken. That's all. There is no magic. This is the magic. If you adulterate nonsensically like a rascal, then you cannot become a spiritual master. If you simply follow what Krsna has spoken, then you become spiritual master. Very simple thing. It doesn't require education. You can hear from your spiritual master what has Krsna said.

It doesn't require even literacy. There are many great personalities, saintly persons. My Guru Maharaja's Guru Maharaja, he was illiterate, Gaura Kisora dasa Babaji Maharaja. He could not sign even his name. But my Guru Maharaja was the best scholar of his time. He accepted him as guru. So this is the process, that yei krsna-tattva-vetta sei guru haya [Cc. Madhya 8.128]. That is the business of every Indian. And Caitanya Mahaprabhu therefore asking,

bharata-bhumite haila manusya-janma yara
janma sarthaka kari' kara para-upakara
[Cc. Adi 9.41]

Indians are meant for para-upakara, because outside India they are in darkness. But unfortunately, Indians are now imitating the western kind of life. It is very regrettable.
You have to make your life successful by reading Bhagavad-gita and preach the truth all over the world. Then world will be happy and you will be happy. This is required. Yare dekha, tare kaha 'krsna'-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. That is recommended here, evam jnatva krtam karma purvair api mumuksubhih. This kind of business can be done by whom? Mumuksubhih, not ordinary men. Those who are aspiring after liberation. Those who are thinking of stopping this nonsense business of repetition of birth and death, for them. They are not ordinary men. Mumuksubhih.

When Visvamitra Muni approached Maharaja Dasaratha for help, taking Ramacandra and Laksmana for killing that raksasi... Visvamitra Muni could kill that raksasi, but because he was brahmana, it was not his business to kill. He begged help from Maharaja Dasaratha to lend Lord Ramacandra and Laksmana, to take Him there. This is the systematic way. The brahmanas should be engaged in knowledge and distributing knowledge. That means their business is not fighting. The ksatriyas, they should fight. The killing business is meant for the ksatriya. That is also required.

Evam... Catur-varnyam maya srstam [Bg. 4.13]. The first of all... Unless this division is there, that is animal society. That is not human society if these four divisions are not. Varnasramacaravata purusena. Systematic human society means

varnasramacaravata
purusena parah puman
visnur aradhyate pantha
nanyat tat-tosa-karanam
[Cc. Madhya 8.58]

This is required, varnasrama. That is again confirmed here, evam jnatva krtam karma purvair api mumuksubhih. Mumuksubhih. The real business is mumuksa, how to get out of this business of repetition of birth. People do not know it. They do not know what is the aim of life. The aim of life is mumuksa. This human life is meant for that, to get out of the cycle of birth and death. The animal cannot know this. Therefore it is called mumuksubhih, "one who wants to get rid of this business of repetition of birth and death." Mumuksubhih. Kuru karmaiva tasmat tvam.

That is advice of Krsna to Arjuna, that "You follow the previous acaryas, previous personalities, authorities." Just like svayambhur naradah sambhuh [SB 6.3.20]. I have already described. "You follow them, and act like that, and you try to understand that what is My position. If you simply understand My position, immediately you become liberated." Janma karma me divyam yo janati tattvatah, tyaktva deham punar janma naiti [Bg. 4.9]. This is liberation. If you simply understand, try to understand Krsna, why Krsna comes, what is His instruction, why He says, yada yada hi dharma, these things, if you simply understand, then you become liberated person.

And this is required in human life to be liberated. What is this nonsense business, sometimes human being, sometimes cat, sometimes dog? But they do not know. But this is a fact, that dehino 'smin yatha dehe kaumaram yau..., tatha dehantara [Bg. 2.13]. You have to change your body, transmigrate, but change for the better, or stop this change, go back to home, back to Godhead. That is required. Thank you very much. Hare Krsna. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Bhagavad-gita 4.15 -- Bombay, April 4, 1974