"Not Attracted To All-atractive"

24 Jan 77 , Bhubanesvara

Prabhupada: (chants Jaya Radha-Madhava, incomplete)

kiba vipra, kiba nyasi, sudra kene naya
yei krsna-tattva-vetta, sei 'guru' haya
[Cc. Madhya 8.128]

This verse we were discussing last night, Caitanya Mahaprabhu's statement that Krsna consciousness is not reserved for any particular person or nation or religion. The central point is that one must understand what is Krsna. The other day somebody inquired, "What is the meaning of 'Krsna'?" "Krsna" means all-attractive. Unless God is all-attractive, how He can become God? So Vrndavana life means Krsna comes, descends Himself to show what is Krsna, what is God. So the picture, Vrndavana life, that is village life. There are villagers, cultivators, cows, calves -- that is Vrndavana. It is not a big city like New York, London. It is village, and the central point is Krsna. This is Vrndavana life. There the gopis, they are village girls and the cowherd boys, they are also village boys. Nanda Maharaja is the head of the village, agriculturist. Similarly, the elderly persons and the elderly gopis, mother Yasoda and her other friends -- all are attracted by Krsna. This is Vrndavana life. They even did not know what is Krsna. They did not know by reading Vedas, Puranas, Vedanta, to understand Krsna. But their natural affection was for Krsna.

So this svabhavika akarsana can be... At the present moment we have no natural attraction for Krsna; therefore we must understand by knowledge what is Krsna. That is Krsna tattva vetta. So why one should be attracted to Krsna unless Krsna has all the attractive features? The attraction... Generally, in this material world we are attracted to a rich man or to a powerful man, man or woman. Just like our Prime Minister, she is woman, but because she is powerful, we are attracted. We talk of her. So the points of attraction are discussed by Parasara Muni as bhaga. Bhaga means opulence. So these opulences... When one is very rich, he is opulent. One is very powerful, he is attractive. One is very influential, one is very beautiful, one is very highly learned... In this way, attraction. So if we scrutinizingly study the life of Krsna, you will find in the history of the world than Krsna there was no richer person, no powerful person than Krsna, no beautiful person than Krsna, more learned and person of knowledge, philosophy than Krsna. If you study you'll find everything. The six opulences are fully represented in Krsna; therefore He is Bhagavan. Bhaga means opulences, and van means one who possesses. This is the meaning of Krsna, that He is all-attractive because He possesses all the six opulences. This is the description of Krsna. So we should not accept anyone and everyone as Bhagavan. We must test whether he has got the six opulences. A person who is begging from door to door, and when there is some bodily pain he immediately goes to the doctor -- "Toothache, sir. Please give me medicine," so does it mean that he is Bhagavan? A Bhagavan cannot cure his tooth pain even? This class of Bhagavan we should not accept. Bhagavan is described in the Bhagavad-gita, asamaurdha. Nobody can be equal to Bhagavan and nobody can be greater than Bhagavan. Therefore Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu says particularly, yei krsna-tattva-vetta sei guru haya: [Cc. Madhya 8.128] "One who knows Krsna specifically, not superficially, but in all details, What is the meaning of Krsna, what is Krsna, he can become guru." Krsna says in the Bhagavad-gita about Himself, krsna-tattva, about..., the truth about Krsna we can understand from Bhagavad-gita with our intelligence. Just like Krsna describes that mattah parataram nanyat kincid asti dhananjaya [Bg. 7.7]. Now you study this one line that Krsna says, "There is nobody greater than Me." Now you study Krsna's life, Compare with anyone and you'll find, "Yes. Nobody is greater or equal to Krsna." This is Krsna.

So at the present moment the defect is that people are not very serious to understand of Krsna, because in this age, as it is stated in the Srimad-Bhagavatam about the people of this age,

prayenalpayusah (sabhya)
kalav asmin yuge janah
mandah sumanda-matayo
manda-bhagya hy upadrutah
[SB 1.1.10]

Prayenalpayusah. People are living not as they used to live formerly. In this age, Kali-yuga, the maximum years one can live: hundred years in this Kali-yuga. Hundred years. In the Dvapara-yuga it was one thousand years. In the Treta-yuga it was ten thousand years. In the Satya-yuga it was hundred thousand years. It is reducing. Kali-yuga means the duration of age will reduce, the memory will reduce, the bodily strength will reduce, mercifulness will reduce. In this way everything will reduce. This is Kali-yuga. Supply of foodstuff will be reduced. This is Kali-yuga. So mandah. Everyone is bad, not full strength. Mandah sumanda-matayo. And everyone has got a sumanda-mata. Mata means opinion or system which is also sumanda. Not only mandah but sumanda. Everyone is manufacturing a type of Bhagavan, a type of religious system. That is not bona fide at all. Sumanda-matayo. Mandah sumanda matayo. And everyone is unfortunate, manda-bhagya, unfortunate in this sense: they do not know what is the aim of life, how human life should make progress.

(aside:) So you can read the explanation of this. He will explain in Oriya. Purport.

Hari-sauri: Translation: "Whether one is a brahmana, a sannyasi, or a sudra, regardless of what he is, he can become a spiritual master if he knows the science of Krsna." Purport: "This verse is very important to the Krsna consciousness movement. In his Amrta-pravaha-bhasya, Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura explains that one should not think that because Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu was born a brahmana and was situated..."

Indian translator: Kindly read one sentence.

Prabhupada: One sentence. Yes. One sentence, finish talk. Then he'll explain.

Hari-sauri: "One should not think that because Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu was born a brahmana and was situated in the topmost spiritual order as a sannyasi it was improper for Him to receive instructions from Srila Ramananda Raya, who belonged to the sudra caste." [break]

Prabhupada: ...prabhu said,

yei bhaje sei bada abhakta hina chara
krsna bhajanete nahi jati-kuladi-vicara
[Cc. Antya 4.67]

This is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's vision. There is no such distinction that one is lower and higher in the matter of Krsna consciousness movement. In the sastras it is clearly stated that unless one is Krsna conscious, he cannot become guru.

sat-karma-nipuno vipro
mantra-tantra-visaradah
avaisnavo gurur na syat
sad-vaisnavah sva-paco guruh

It is said that a brahmana, even though he's well-qualified, sat-karma, brahmana's six occupation, sat-karma-pathana pathan yajana yajana dana pratigraha-sat-karma-nipuno vipro mantra-tantra-visaradah, and he's well expert in Vedic hymns, Vedic understanding -- mantra-tantra, Pancatantra, everything is competent -- but avaisnava, if he's not a devotee of Krsna, he cannot become guru. Sad-vaisnava sva-paco guruh. But if a Vaisnava, even though he may come from the candala family, svapaca, the dog-eater's family -- that is considered the lowest in the human society -- if he becomes a Vaisnava, he is fit for becoming spiritual master. This is the sastric injunction. Our guru, out of the Six Gosvamis, one of them, he has given his direction in the Bhakti... What is that? Hari-bhakti-vilasa, that avaisnava-mukhodgirnam putam hari-kathamrtam sravanam na kartavyam. A person who is not Vaisnava... Vaisnava means krsna tattva vetta. If he's not well versed in the science of Krsna, if his behavior is not Vaisnava... Sadacara-sampanna. Vaisnava must have dvadasa-tilaka, sikha, sutra, kunti, and there are many things, description. Sadacara-sampranna, Vaisnava. If he's not that, simply by education if he speaks about Krsna, one should not hear. One should not hear. These are professional men. If you pay him something, he'll speak for some time, but his behavior is not Vaisnava. So from such person it is forbidden to hear about Srimad-Bhagavatam or anything about Krsna. Avaisnava-mukhodgirnam putam hari-kathamrtam, sravanam na kartavyam. So one may say that "He's speaking about Krsna, so what is the wrong there? He may be misbehaved, but he's speaking about Krsna." So that Sanatana Gosvami says, putam hari-kathamrtam. Hari-kathamrtam is always pure. That's all right. But avaisnava-mukhodgirnam putam hari-kathamrta, sravanam... Why? Sarpocchistam payo yatha. Everyone knows milk is very nice and nutritious food, but if it is touched by the lips of a serpent, it is spoiled, no more to be... So it is forbidden, that we should not try to understand about Krsna from a person who is not Vaisnava. Explain. [break]

At the present moment there are so-called scholars, politicians or philosophers, they have nothing to do with Krsna or Krsna -- bhakti, but just to take advantage of the Bhagavad-gita they are explaining Bhagavad-gita in their own way. [break] One should not spoil his life by hearing or understanding the version given by such avaisnava. So if we want to derive actual benefit from the Bhagavad-gita, we must approach such person who has understood what is Krsna. So therefore Krsna gives the direction:

tad viddhi pranipatena
pariprasnena sevaya
upadeksyanti tad jnanam
jnaninas tattva-darsanam
[Bg. 4.34]

We should approach, we must approach, yei krsna tattva vetta. We must learn from him about Krsna. Then we can understand Krsna. Otherwise not possible. Go on reading. [break] ...movement here giving this yajnopavita to the Europeans and Americans because they are now qualified. So sometimes we are criticized in India, that "Bhaktivedanta Swami is spoiling Hindu religion." But it is not actually the fact. We are increasing the number of Hindus. Unfortunately these, our these European and American disciples, these so-called brahmana priests of Jagannatha Puri, they do not allow.
Guest (1): Americans, they are not allowed to see Jagannatha temple. What Prabhu Bhaktivedanta is doing? What he's doing for them?

Prabhupada: That is up to you. We... [break] ...vaisnave jati-buddhih, arcye sila-dhir. Everyone knows in the temple... Just like Jagannatha. Everyone knows Jagannatha is made of wood, or, in other temple, made of stone. But people, do they come to see wood and stone? So if anyone thinks... Sometimes the atheist class, they think that "These foolish men, they are going to see a piece of wood." This is naraki-buddhi. Similarly, arcye visnau sila-dhir gurusu nara-matih. Those who are acting as guru according to the description, if somebody thinks that "This man is ordinary person," and vaisnave jati-buddhih, similarly caranamrta, Gangajala, if somebody thinks ordinary water, so "he's naraki." So these Europeans, Americans who are properly initiated according to Vaisnava system, according to Caitanya Mahaprabhu's indication, if somebody thinks their jati, angrej jati or American jati, he's naraki. What can be done?

Guest (2): What are the reasons why one should not hear from one who has got sufficient knowledge on Lord Krsna if he is not outwardly a Vaisnava? That means he's not having sikha or kunti, like that.

Prabhupada: What is that?

Hari-sauri: He says, "What's wrong with hearing from someone if he has some knowledge of Krsna even if he doesn't have a sikha and tilaka and what have you?"

Prabhupada: That is the injunction of authority. Avaisnava-mukhodgirnam putam hari-ka..., sravanam na kartavyam. We have to abide by the orders of the superiors. "Why?" -- there is no question. Authority says; you have to accept. You cannot say "Why?" Vedic injunction. Therefore Krsna was accepted as guru by Arjuna. Sisyas te 'ham sadhi mam prapannam [Bg. 2.7]. Because as friend and friend the reply and argument will go on, to stop this argument Krsna is accepted as guru, not as friend. Similarly, when you accept a guru, you must accept guru according to the Vedic principle. So here guru, Sanatana Gosvami, he is giving the injunction that avaisnava-mukhodgirnam putam hari-kathamrtam sravanam na kartavyam. Exceptional case is different, the paramahamsa stage. But a guru, although he is paramahamsa, because he is teaching, he come down as madhyama-adhikari. There are three kinds of Vaisnava: kanistha adhikari, madhyama adhikari and uttama adhikari. Uttama adhikari may be without kunti, without sikha, without Vaisnava symptoms. He's paramahamsa. But when he comes to the preaching platform he must become a madhyama adhikari, not to imitate uttama adhikari, because he has to teach. He cannot deviate from the teaching principles. So what you are speaking, that "Without sikha without kunti, one can become guru," that is fact for the paramahamsa, not for the preacher. Preacher must behave very nicely.

Guest (3): Maharaja, it is true that one should follow Krsna consciousness for spiritual progress, no doubt, but who and why this present society situated which we observe in this world, in the modern civilization?

Prabhupada: You can come please here. We can hear. You can come. What do you mean by "modern civilization"?

Guest (3): The civilization we are now going through.

Prabhupada: So what do you mean by "modern civilization"? That means to violate all the rules and regulation? Does it mean modern civilization?

Guest (2): Question was, "Why there is a chaotic situation if...," I think if I'm understanding him correctly, "Why there is a chaotic situation? If God is to uplift the soul of all the persons, all the livings, why there is a chaotic situation?" Lord Krsna has said that yada yada hi glanir bhavati... That is the answer, guru will say. Why there is a chaotic situation? That is his question, sir.

Prabhupada: The chaotic sit..., must be there. Krsna says one thing and you do other thing. So why there shouldn't be chaotic condition? You hear Krsna, you follow Krsna; there will be order. But if you do not follow, Krsna says something and you do something... Krsna says that,

evam parampara-praptam
imam rajarsayo viduh
sa kaleneha (mahata)
yoga nasto parantapa
[Bg. 4.2]

Krsna says that this Bhagavad-gita,

imam vivasvate yogam
proktavan aham avyayam
vivasvan manave prahur
manur iksvakave 'bravit
[Bg. 4.1]

Krsna says the way of studying Bhagavad-gita, but you do not accept Krsna's instruction. You read all rascal's Bhagavad-gita commentary. Then why there shall not be chaotic condition? You do not follow. He strictly prohibits. Evam parampara-praptam [Bg. 4.2], sa kaleneha yogo nastah parantapa. Yogo nastah. As soon as the parampara system is not accepted, the so-called commentary on Bhagavad-gita is lost or rotten. So you are interested with the rotten commentary of so-called politicians, scholars. So how you'll get the benefit? Therefore it is chaotic.

Guest (3): Lord Krsna preached Bhagavad-gita in battlefield of Kuruksetra, and it is afterwards written by Vyasadeva.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (2): Is the Vyasadeva got it out of his meditation, or how the actual thing which was conveyed to Arjuna was again in real thing took a shape in Bhagavad-gita?

Prabhupada: That you have no intelligence to understand. But what is given by Vyasadeva, that is accepted by all the acaryas. We are not so learned as you are, but we follow the acarya. And it is recommended in the Bhagavad-gita, acaryopasanam. You must follow the acaryas, the Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya, even Sankaracarya, Caitanya Mahaprabhu. Then you'll get the real answer. Acaryavan puruso veda: "One who follows the acarya, he knows." Others, they do not know. So you cannot question "Why? How Vyasadeva wrote?" That is stated in the Bhagavad-gita. Sanjaya says vyasa prasada. How one can understand? By the mercy of Vyasadeva. So we have to see. Instead of criticizing in that adverse way, we have to follow the acarya. Acaryopasanam. So you'll find Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya, Visnu Svami, Nimbarka, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, they have accepted in that way. So what is the use of our questioning? We should follow. Mahajano yena gatah sa panthah [Cc. Madhya 17.186]. Otherwise it is not possible.

Guest (4): I think Bhagavad-gita invisible treasure of all the sums of teaching of...

Prabhupada: Invisible for the nondevotees. Naham prakasah sarvasya yogamaya-samavrtah [Bg. 7.25]. But for devotee He's visible. Premanjana-cchurita-bhakti-vilocanena santah sadaiva hrdayesu vilokayanti [Bs. 5.38]. Those who are real devotee of God, they are hours seeing Him within the heart. So God is not invisible. Invisible for the atheist.

Guest (5): We see some invisible action and some outer action.

Prabhupada: What is invisible?

Guest (5): Man is simple instrument in the hands of God. That I know. God is doing everything or the man? Then the point comes why the brahmanas of the Jagannatha temple are not allowing foreigners... Sri Krsna says, atmanu:(?) "I live in (indistinct)." That means this atma is Parambrahma Himself. If so, why the brahmanas of Jagannatha temple are not allowing them and...?

Prabhupada: So why in other temples they are allowed? No. God wants that these rascals may remain in darkness. They cannot understand Vaisnava. Let them remain in darkness. That God wants.

Guest (5): Krsna, Rama, Hari...

Prabhupada: No. Your answer is this, that "Why God does not...?" God wants that "These so-called brahmanas who eat Jagannatha-prasada with fish, let them remain in darkness, not to understand who is Vaisnava."

Guest (5): That is true...

Prabhupada: That is true. Take it, that. That's all. (laughter)

Guest (5): But to understand the God...

Prabhupada: Tan aham dvisatah kruran ksipamy ajasram andha-yonisu [Bg. 16.19]. Those who are vaisnava-dvesi, bhagavad-dvesi, God keeps them in darkness perpetually.

Guest (5): What is the reason between man and God? That is the point we have to understood.

Prabhupada: We have to understood... Come to this school and learn it, not in a minute.

Guest (5): Sir, not minute.

Prabhupada: Then why you are asking all these things? You come, become a student, and learn. It is not so easy subject that standing for one minute, you'll understand everything.

Guest (5): Not standing. If God... If God is not doing everything...

Prabhupada: God is doing everything. I have already explained. If you want to remain a demon, God will keep you in demonic condition. That's it. He is doing everything. That's a fact. And if you want to be devotee, then God can make you devotee also. Ye yatha mam prapadyante tams tathaiva bhajami [Bg. 4.11].

Guest (5): That would be good.

Prabhupada: Yes. So...

Guest (5): That's why I asked of the point which is not clear to me. That's why I asked of the point. I know that God is, God is moving everything...

Prabhupada: God is doing everything. That's a fact.

Guest (5): Krsna says in the Gita, "I am moving everything.(?)" If so, if Sri Krsna is in the heart, if not then... If Sri Krsna is entering in every heart -- He's God -- then Americans are also. If Krsna is living in every heart, this atma itself, God, Parambrahma, atma in maya, being entangled...

Prabhupada: The God never says the atma is Parabrahman. Why you are talking like that?

Guest (5): No. If the atma is not God, then what is there?

Prabhupada: God is...

Guest (5): Due to the presence of a God... This life force is not God. Due to presence of God this atma is living.

Prabhupada: That's all right. Atma is there. You have studied Bhagavad-gita or not? First of all tell me. Do you think atma and Paramatma are the same thing?

Guest (5): Mostly the same thing. Yes. (laughter)

Prabhupada: That is foolishness. That is foolishness. First of all try to understand. That is foolishness. Atma and Paramatma -- different.

Guest (5): Advaitavada, dvaitavada, visistadvaitavada...

Prabhupada: No, no. I am talking of Bhagavad-gita as it is. Don't bring this vada, that vada. In the Bhagavad-gita the atma and Paramatma is not the same.

Guest (5): No, then, well... We have to accept dualism. There are two...

Prabhupada: No. Whatever "ism," we are talking of Bhagavad-gita. So Bhagavad-gita -- atma and Paramatma different.

Guest (5): This atma is giving forms to Paramatma.

Prabhupada: That is foolishness. That is foolishness. In the Bhagavad-gita that is not stated.

Guest (5): With our intelligence we both cannot understand the thing, what is Parambrahman, but real philosophy is dvaitavada, advaitavada, one monism.

Prabhupada: So dvaitavada, advaitavada, there may be. But we are talking of Bhagavad-gita. In the Bhagavad-gita what is there? You speak.

Guest (5): Knowledge of our atma. Bhagavad-gita is connected to our atma. Excuse me.

Prabhupada: Bhagavad-gita, it is clearly stated that... What is that? Ksetra-ksetrajna. Ksetrajna. Just hear. Hear, please. Hear. Hear, please. Yes. Now, Krsna says, ksetra-jnam capi mam viddhi: "So I am also ksetrajna, and the jiva is also ksetrajna." So that does not mean... First of all hear. Then say yes or no. He says, ksetra-jnam capi mam viddhi sarva-ksetresu bharata: "I am also ksetrajnam, but sarva-ksetresu." If atma... I am atma; you are atma. You know your ksetra; I know my ksetra. But I do not know your ksetra; you do not know my ksetra. That is Bhagavan. He knows everyone. Ksetra-jnam capi mam viddhi sarva-ksetresu bharata. So Krsna or Bhagavan, He is sarva-ksetresu, but you are only your ksetra. Therefore dvaitavada, two different ksetras, ksetrajnas. One ksetrajna is all-pervading and one ksetrajna is localized. Therefore two ksetrajnas. It is dvaitavada. Yes. You see Bhagavad-gita? You have read Bhagavad-gita?

Guest (5): In this atma, two ksetrajnas.

Prabhupada: In this... Not atma. In this body. There are two ksetrajnas. One is the individual ksetrajna.

Guest (5): But we mean to who is residing in the heart with the atma.

Prabhupada: Yes. Then He's ksetrajna.

Guest (5): Who become splitted after our death, that is the ksetrajna.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (5): Then it will be two.

Prabhupada: There are two ksetrajnas: one ksetrajna, the individual soul, and the other ksetrajna is Bhagavan. There are two ksetrajnas. Dvaitavada.

Guest (5): Yes. Then this monism and dualism, then what about the Visista-advaita?

Prabhupada: No, no. We are talking of Bhagavad-gita. Why you are bringing so many things? First of all try to understand the simple thing in the Bhagavad-gita. Then bring big, big words. Yes, there are two ksetrajnas. You have to accept it.

Guest (5): Two ksetrajnas.

Prabhupada: Yes!

Guest (5): Then duality.

Prabhupada: Yes!

Guest (5): Then there are two Gods.

Prabhupada: Yes. Not two Gods. One God. One is servant. Not two Gods. There cannot be two Gods. Otherwise Krsna says, mattah parataram nanyat kincid asti dhananjaya [Bg. 7.7].

Guest (5): Two ksetrajna means two Gods.

Prabhupada: Why ksetrajna two Gods?

Guest (5): Because jna means God.

Prabhupada: Then why two Gods?

Guest (5): Two ksetrajna.

Prabhupada: No! Two ksetrajnas does not mean two Gods. Isvarah sarva-bhutanam hrd-dese 'rjuna tisthati [Bg. 18.61]. So He is all-pervading. You are not all-pervading.

Guest (5): Krsna is all-pervading.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (5): But by sandhana, by sandhana...

Prabhupada: So even if you say... Even if you...

Guest (5): I can also pervade. I can also pervade. (laughter)

Prabhupada: What is that?

Bhagavata: By sadhana he can become all-pervading himself.

Prabhupada: That is foolishness. That is foolishness.

Guest (4): There is no use in argument.

Prabhupada: That is not possible.

Guest (5): In this body...

Prabhupada: That is not possible. Mamaivamso jiva-bhutah jiva loke sanatana [Bg. 15.7]. Sanatana-jiva-loke jiva amsa. Amsa cannot be the full. Yes. Amsa, part, cannot be equal to the whole.

Guest (5): Then if we be the parcels of God, then what about prarabdha? We are suffering from pain and pleasure...

Prabhupada: So you are suffering. God is not suffering.

Guest (5): No. God is not suffering.

Prabhupada: Then, therefore, difference between you and God. You are suffering god and he's enjoying God.

Guest (5): We are enjoying the prarabdha, is it not?

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (5): Pain and pleasure is part of God.

Prabhupada: Yes. That prarabdha. That is the... But God is not...

Guest (5): This is not argument. I have no equal.(?)

Prabhupada: God is not under the laws of karma.

Guest (5): Swami, I want to know from swami.

Hari-sauri: If you want to know, then listen! If you want to know, listen. Don't speak!

Guest (5): All are waves and bubbles of the same sea. We are the bubbles and waves of the same sea, same Parambrahman, this atma, Himself... (quotes Sanskrit) Om bhur bhuvah svah... [break]

Prabhupada: Krsna says ca, this word. Ksetrajnam ca means "I am also ksetrajna." Therefore He is different from the ordinary ksetrajna. First of all try to understand this. Ca means different, another. And the difference is that sarva-ksetresu bharata, whereas the individual ksetrajna is within the body. That's all. [break] ...there is no advaitavada. There may be advaitavada philosophy, but in Bhagavad-gita there is no adva itavada. It is dvaitavada. Otherwise why Krsna said, sarva-dharman partiyajya mam ekam saranam: "You saranam vraja. You are different from Me"? Krsna says. Otherwise why Krsna asked that "You surrender"? That you and I, different. That is dvaitavada.

Guest (5): Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66], that can I understood, all arguments.

Prabhupada: No. You can understand anything, but that is not the thing. We have to take it as it is. We are therefore presenting Bhagavad-gita as God is commanding you, that "You surrender." So you are different from God.

Guest (5): That means, surrender means I am not a doer. I am not doing anything. God, who is residing within me...

Prabhupada: Surrender. Who will surrender? Unless you are servant, why shall you surrender? You are servant; God is master. So therefore master and servant different.

Guest (5): No, that is true. I am not God. But God is there within me. God is everybody.

Prabhupada: That's all... God is everywhere.

Guest (5): He's within ant and dog and elephant and everybody.

Prabhupada: That...

Guest (5): Due to presence of God, this small living being, due to presence of God...

Prabhupada: God is within dog. Therefore does it mean God is dog also?

Guest (5): No. God is not dog. God is a ...

Prabhupada: Then you are putting the same argument. Because God is there within dog, therefore God is dog.

Guest (5): When we are talking...

Prabhupada: Yes. they are talking like that: daridra-narayana.

Guest (5): God is in everywhere.


Prabhupada: God is everywhere. That is understood. But that does not mean... God says, mat-sthani sarva-bhutani naham tesu avasthitah [Bg. 9.4]. Why don't you read this?

Guest (5): No. That is true. If we will not believe that, then we will be helping people? We will be helping lot of people? No, that is not...

Prabhupada: Well, we understand Bhagavad-gita as it is. We don't make any interpretation.

Guest (5): In Bhagavad-gita Sri Krsna says, "I live in everybody."

Prabhupada: Who denies that? That does not mean God is everything.

Guest (5): No. God is not everything.

Prabhupada: Then dvaitavada -- everything and God is different. That is dvaitavada.

Guest (5): Then we have to love everybody, everything.

Prabhupada: So who says no? Unless we love everyone, why we are traveling all over the world?

Guest (5): Love is God, accept, param dharma.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (5): Truth I understand.

Prabhupada: That's it. That is... That is wanted. Param brahma param dhama pavitram [Bg. 10.12].

Guest (5): Otherwise we can't love a poor man...

Satsvarupa: Enough argument. Sit down. Then no more argument.

Guest (3): I think Lord has said in the Bhagavad-gita...

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (3): "Like sky, everywhere I am pervading, like one sun giving light to all."

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (3): "So in all souls I am pervading."

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (3): That much clear answer to his question, the difference between the all-pervading Lord...

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (3): ...and the individual soul.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Guest (3): And also He has said that Paramatma, He is Purusottama, greater than the soul. The soul is also...

Prabhupada: Purusa. Soul is described as purusa.

Guest (3): Greater than him. So that also establishes that...

Prabhupada: Dvaitavada.

Guest (3): Yes. God is different. And we cannot say that we are equal to God.

Prabhupada: Yes. And God says further, mattah parataram nanyat: [Bg. 7.7] "Nobody is equal." Asamaurdha: "Nobody is equal to God; nobody is greater than God." That is God. All right. Chant Hare Krsna. (end)


>>> Ref. VedaBase =>

"Surrender To Vishnu"

1 Apr 77 , Bombay


Prabhupada: That is sa gunan samatityaitan, that is mukti. Baddha, conditioned, means we are under the three modes of material nature. That is conditioned. And mukti means you are not under the obligation of the three modes of material nature. That is karma-mukta. So Krsna can make you immediately mukta. Aham tvam sarva-papebhyo moksayisyami. That is Krsna's power. Prabhavisnave namah. He can make the lowest class of men... Kirata-hunandhra-pulinda-pulkasa abhira-sumbha yavanah khasadayah ye 'nye ca papah [SB 2.4.18]. They are considered as the most sinful, less than the sudras, candalas. Kirata-hunandhra-pulinda-pulkasa... Or more sinful, sudhyanti. They can be purified by the mercy, by the power, prabhavisnave namah. Visnu has got so much power. So that power you can have the benefit if you surrender to Visnu. Therefore Krsna personally comes and requests you,

sarva-dharman parityajya
mam ekam saranam vraja
aham tvam sarva-papebhyo
moksayisyami ma sucah
[Bg. 18.66]

So here is Krsna's direction. You take always Krsna's direction, then that is bhakti, and you remain brahma-bhuyaya kalpate. [Bg. 14.26] You are always immune from the sinful reactions of this material world. It does not mean... You cannot manufacture. Actually you have to follow the orders of Krsna. Just like Arjuna is being advised. You simply follow Krsna. Not that whimsically he was going to punish Asvatthama. Under direction of Krsna. Similarly, in every step of your life, if you take Krsna's direction or His representative's direction, then you are safe.

Thank you very much. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.7.38-39 -- Vrndavana, September 30, 1976

"Meaningless Has Hidden Meaning"

31 Jan 77 , Bhubanesvara

Prabhupada: Today, Varaha-dvadasi, appearance of Krsna's taking the incarnation of Varaha, boar... Kesava dhrta-sukara-rupa jaya jagadisa hare.

ramadi-murtisu kala-niyamena tisthan
nanavataram akarod bhuvanesu kintu
krsnah svayam samabhavat paramah puman yo
govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami
[Bs. 5.39]

Krsna, Govinda, adi-purusa, the original person, He is taking various forms. Ramadi-murtisu specially. Three Rama: Parasurama, Balarama, and Dasarathi Rama. So this Rama means enjoyment. So Krsna's enjoyment... It does not mean, Krsna has appeared as the boar; it does not mean He is suffering. Everything is ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhis [Bs. 5.37]. Sometimes a big man becomes a horse. It is... There is a very nice interesting story that the big Prime Minister Gladstone, English, English Prime Minister, Gladstone?

Devotee: Yeah.

Prabhupada: Yes. So somebody came to see him for an interview. So the servant informed the visitor that "The Prime Minister is now busy, you have to wait." So he was waiting. He was big man. So one hour passed. So he became inquisitive, so with little opening of the door, he wanted to see the how this man is engaged. I am waiting for one hour . So he saw that the Prime Minister has become a horse, taking his grandchild on the back, and he's playing like a horse. And the important visitor is waiting for one hour. So this is enjoyment. The Prime Minister is not the horse, but he is enjoying taking his grandchild on the back and he was playing like a horse and the grandchild was, "Hut! Hut! Hut! Hut!" This was his engagement. So similarly, because he has become the horse of his grandchild, he is not horse, he is enjoying. That is enjoyment. Similarly when kesava dhrta-sukara-rupa or kesava dhrta-varaha-rupa does not mean that He is varaha, or He is crocodile, or He is something like... No. He's everything. But that is not by karma. When we become crocodile, that is karma, punishment. We are now human being. It may be next life I become a crocodile according to karma, be forced by the laws of nature. Just like in Honolulu, Hawaii, we see so many young boys, they are enjoying, they are surfing in the middle of the ocean, struggling. So our karma, if you are practiced to that way, then at the time of death I shall think of just, in the middle ocean, swimming and struggling, then Krsna will give opportunity to become a aquatic. Very easily we can remain within the water. That is the laws of nature. Yam yam vapi smaran loke tyajaty ante kalevaram [Bg. 8.6].

So our taking the shape of crocodile or boar or something animal that is karma. But that is a horse, real horse is karma but the Gladstone's becoming horse, that is not karma, that is enjoyment. We should understand like that, that when kesava dhrta-kurma-sarira and varaha-sarira, He's not forced by karma. Na mam karmani limpanti [Bg. 4.14]. Krsna says in the Bhagavad-gita, na me karma-phale sprha. He is self-sufficient. So, everything His enjoyment. We are also seeking enjoyment because we are part and parcel of Krsna. So anandamayo 'bhyasat (Vedanta-sutra 1.1.12). Krsna or His part and parcel, the same quality. Krsna is seeking enjoyment, and we are also seeking enjoyment, but we can enjoy together in the spiritual world without any hamper, without any impediment.

ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhis
tabhir ya eva nija-rupataya kalabhih
goloka eva nivasaty akhilatma-bhuto
govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami
[Bs. 5.37]

When we dance with Krsna in the Goloka Vrndavana, both of us are enjoying. Krsna is enjoying; we are also enjoying. But if we want to enjoy independent of Krsna or to imitate Krsna or to become Krsna, then it is maya. Then it is maya. This material world means the same enjoying spirit is there within me, but if I want to become Krsna or enjoy independently, then it is maya. So therefore we should enjoy with Krsna. That is the aim of... The same thing is there.

So Krsna comes therefore, personally appears and exhibits His enjoying love in Vrndavana. He brings His friends, His girl-friends, boy-friends, everything, His father, His mother, and shows that "The enjoyment which you are seeking, that is there in the spiritual world with Me. See how I am enjoying." Just so that we may have our brain cleared that if we enjoy with Krsna, we can enjoy the dance, the paternal love, the conjugal love, the friendly playing with boys, with animals, who is in the garden, in the forest, in the water-same thing is there. Everything is there, all the sporting, but spiritual. So this is Krsna's lila. Ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhis [Bs. 5.37]. So we are seeking pleasure within this material world. That is imitation. That is not real enjoyment. But the basic principle of enjoyment is there. Here there is imitation enjoyment, love between young boy young girl. So wherefrom it comes? It is there in Krsna. Otherwise how it can come? It is not possible. Janmady asya yatah [SB 1.1.1]. This loving exchange between young boy, young girl is there. Krsna is also enjoying there. The gopis, the young girls, Krsna is young... The exchange of love between father and son, mother and son; the exchange of love between friend and friend, the exchange of love between animal and man...

We, just like we keep so many animals, Krsna is also enjoying with the calves. Sometimes with other animal also. Same thing is there. It is simply imitation here. Otherwise, everything is there in the spiritual world. We are mistaking, here, karma-phala-vadya (?). But here is no inebrieties, in the spiritual world. Here it is full of inebrieties. You'll see that Krsna is enjoying with the gopis but there is no inebriety. There is no pregnancy, there is no abortion. That is the beauty. And the material world the love turns into lusty desires and it entails so many difficulties. Yan-maithunadi-grhamedhi-sukham hi tuccham kanduyanena karayor iva duhkha-duhkham [SB 7.9.45]. Here sex life means entailed with so many sufferings. But there is no sex life in the spiritual world but the pleasure is there. That is the difference between material and spiritual. Therefore there is restriction. Just like sex life is there, but a tuberculosis patient, if he enjoys sex life, he'll die very soon. Without sex life he could live for some years. Everyone will die. So for tuberculosis patient sex life is strictly prohibited. So when there is prohibition... Just like in the material world there is prohibition, "No sex life," because we are patient here, tuberculosis patient. If we enjoy sex life then we'll die. Die means... We are already dead because we have to accept this dead body. This body is dead. But so long I am within this body, simply it is moving. Just like motor car. Motor car is a lump of matter, but when the driver is acting, it is moving. Similarly this body... By maya we are thinking that this body is living. It is not living. It is dead. From the very beginning it is dead. And when the soul will go away, it will appear its real identity-dead. Otherwise it is dead. Therefore Krsna says that "You are lamenting on this body? Oh, you are such a rascal." Nanusocanti panditah. Those who are learned, they do not care for this body, either dead or alive. It is dead matter. So why should you lament for the dead matter?

asocyan anvasocas tvam
prajna-vadams ca bhasase
gatasun agatasums ca
nanusocanti panditah
[Bg. 2.11]

This is spiritual life. When we are not at all concerned with this body, material body, that is the beginning of spiritual life. And so long we are interested with the dead lump of matter without any information of the spirit soul within it, that is material life. This is the difference between material life and spiritual life.

One who is in ignorance, without any knowledge of the spirit soul and identifying with this body and trying to enjoy life, he is implicated. Implicated. Life after life we change and enjoy in different ways. What (is) the enjoyment? The enjoyment is eating, sleeping, sex, and defense. So either you become one little insect or you become Brahma, the same enjoyment in different forms. Therefore punah punas carvita-carvananam [SB 7.5.30], repeating the same process-eating, sleeping, mating, and defending. But there is a life eternal which is not this eating-sleeping but another enjoyment, ananda-cinmaya-rasa. We can get it. So therefore in this life we should understand, we should be little sober, that this is our diseased condition. I am eternal. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. Why I am put into this condition of birth, death, old age, and disease. This is my disease. This is not healthy condition. So one who is sober, dhira, he understands that "This is my tuberculosis disease state." We should restrict all the so-called material happiness and prepare for the spiritual life, eternal life That is a human consciousness. Otherwise you are in darkness, mudha. Duskrtina, mudha, naradhama. Life is lost. So Krsna has so many lilas, activities. Krsna is not different from His activities, He is absolute. So these are the occasions we can hear about His activities. We are benefited. Therefore He plays sometimes as mina-sarira, as varaha-sarira, as kurma-sarira. Ramadi-murtisu-kala niyamena. There are hundreds and thousands of incarnations. Advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam [Bs. 5.33]. Just like you cannot count the waves of the river, it is going on continually. Similarly, the incarnation of Krsna is going on eternally, so many. If you take the opportunity of hearing-sravanam kirtanam visnoh [SB 7.5.23] -- about Visnu's lila activities... And if you simply stick to the nirakara Brahman, what we shall hear? Therefore they fall down, these Mayavadis who simply take seriously the impersonal feature of Krsna, because there is no lila. "Brahman brahman aham brahman brahman," then how long it will go on? It will be hackneyed. But when we take to Krsna's personal activities, then are newer, newer, newer, and multi and many... Then we get the opportunity of hearing Krsna. Then you stick. Otherwise, if I simply become understood about the Brahman feature, it will be hackneyed, we want seek ananda, pleasure. So in the impersonal feature there is no pleasure. Just like in the sky, even if you take a very nice airplane, and simply fly in the sky, you'll be very much displeased. That is our practical experience. If you go in the sea and for months together remain in the sea, you'll be very much sick. We want pleasure. We want pleasure, varieties. That is Krsna's desire. He also discover..., varieties of pleasure, and if we join with Him, we also enjoy the varieties of pleasure eternally in the spiritual world. That is success of life.

Thank you very much.

Devotees: Jaya Prabhupada (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Varaha-dvadasi, Lord Varaha's Appearance Day Lecture -- Bhuvanesvara, January 31, 1977

"Krishna's Yoga System"

24 Mar 77 , Bombay

Prabhupada: ...great responsibility of preaching the message of Bhagavad-gita throughout the whole world. It is meant for the human being and -- do not mind it -- it appears that rarely a human being is found there to take up the responsibility in India. They're talking all nonsense. The real message of Indian culture is Krsna consciousness. Ya idam paramam guhyam mad-bhaktesv abhidhasyati [Bg 18.68]. Na ca tasman manusyesu kascin me priya-krttamah [Bg. 18.69]. Krsna says at the end of His instruction that "Anyone who is taking the responsibility of preaching the message of Bhagavad-gita to the devotees..." Because unless one is devotee, one cannot understand what is Bhagavad-gita. Bhaktya mam abhijanati yavan yas casmi tattvatah [Bg. 18.55]. To know Krsna superficially, that is a different thing. You can imagine anything nonsense. But if you want to know Krsna as He is, that requires intelligence.

manusyanam sahasresu
kascid yatati siddhaye
yatatam api siddhanam
kascin mam vetti tattvatah
[Bg. 7.3]

So we have to understand Krsna tattvatah, as He is. This tattvatah word has been used in several places in Bhagavad-gita. Janma karma ca me divyam yo janati tattvatah [Bg. 4.9]. Here is one tattvatah. Krsna's appearance and disappearance is not ordinary thing. Yo janati tattvatah: "Anyone who understands in truth..." So what is the result? Tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti kaunteya [Bg. 4.9]. Immediately becomes liberated. Immediately he becomes eligible not to accept any more this material body. Tyaktva deham. Everyone has to give up this body, material body. You cannot remain permanently Indian or this party or that party. You have to change your body. Tatha dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2.13]. So why should you waste your time in this way, that "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim," "I am horse," "I am cat," "I am dog"? There is no difference. If a dog is thinking that "I am dog," and if I am thinking "I am Indian," where is the difference? The mentality is the same: I'm identifying with the body. Yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke. Anyone who is thinking of this body as himself,

yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke
sva-dhih kalatradisu bhauma ijya-dhih
yat-tirtha-buddhih salile na karhicij
janesv abhijnesu sa eva go-kharah
[SB 10.84.13]

Go-khara. Go means cow, and khara means ass. Anyone who's identifying with this body as self, he's go-khara, animal. So this animal civilization is not meant for India's culture. India's culture is different. Tatha dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2.13]. Tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti [Bg. 4.9]. This is India's culture. Why should we identify ourself as animal -- "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim," "I am this"? It is wrong type of civilization, go-khara civilization.

So our little attempt is... We are not manufacturing anything. We are not manufacturer of religious system, neither it is possible to manufacture. Just like you cannot manufacture law. Law is given by the state. Similarly, dharma means dharmam tu saksad bhagavat-pranitam [SB 6.3.19]. Dharma means the law given by God. That is dharma. You cannot manufacture. Who cares for your manufactured system? Just like nobody cares for if you make some law, that "I have made some law," and go to the court, "Sir, I have made this law. Please accept." "He's lunatic. Drive him away." That is not possible. This is dharma, as Krsna says, sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. This is dharma. Don't manufacture dharma. [break] Yada yada hi dharmasya glanir bhavati bharata [Bg. 4.7]. What is that glani? Discrepancy. So glani is disobedience to the order of God. That is glani. Yada yada hi dharmasya glanir bhavati bharata. So the whole world is denying, sunyavadi, nirvisesa-vadi, nirakara-vadi: "No God. God is dead." So what kind of religious system they'll manufacture? They are simply misled. Andha yathandhair upaniyamanas te 'pisa-tantryam uru-damni baddhah [SB 7.5.31]. Very tightly regulated by the laws of nature, and still, we are independently manufacturing religion. This is not possible. Give us this... Sarva-dharman parityajya [Bg. 18.66]. Actually this is dharma. Sa vai pumsam paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhoksaje [SB 1.2.6]. It doesn't matter whether you are Hindu, Muslim, Christian, or any other sect. The test is how much you are advanced in understanding God. That is the... If you do not understand God, if you have no obedience to God, that is not dharma.

So the Krsna consciousness movement is very important movement. It is neither manufactured nor unauthorized. It is authorized, the oldest. Yogah proktah puratanah. Krsna said to Arjuna that "I am repeating the same yoga, puratanam. Krsna does not say that "I am manufacturing another system of yoga." No. "I am speaking to you the same yoga system."

imam vivasvate yogam
proktavan aham avyayam
vivasvan manave praha
manur iksvakave 'bravit
[Bg. 4.1]

So yogo nastah parantapa. As soon as we deviate from the original system, it is nasta, spoiled. So what is the use of giving things which is already spoiled? But it cannot be spoiled if you follow the parampara system. This is the secret of success. So our only request is that India should not be misled by imitating the Western type of civilization, unnecessarily fighting on political and social... These political, social, there is problem, but that is temporary. Temporary... We must have our interest to the real life. Somebody yesterday was speaking of health. So what is health? If you are going to die, what is the value of your so-called health program? First of all you stop death; then the question of health. Krsna said, na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. First of all come to this position. Then even after the destruction of the body, you are not destroyed. That is health. That is health. Tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti [Bg. 4.9]. That is health, not that patchwork: you have got some disease, take some pill and again become diseased. Bhutva bhutva praliyate [Bg. 8.19]. That is not health. Here is health.

But we have no brain to understand. That Krsna said, na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. Na jayate na mriyate va kadacit -- at any time. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. Where is that medicine? Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. I am dying, my father is dying; my son is dying. But even if we accept, "Yes, we are accepting another body," but what do you know what kind of body you are going to accept? What is the position? There are 8,400,000 different forms of body. If you become an insignificant worm, then it will take millions of years by the evolution process to come again to this human form of body and come to..., there may be chance to take to Krsna consciousness. Krsna consciousness is not very easy. If I miss this opportunity, I may miss millions of years. So this knowledge should be given. It is not expected that everyone will accept or understand. But this knowledge must be current. A class of men, the brahmana class, the Vaisnava class... Manusyanam sahasresu [Bg. 7.3] -- that is a fact. But still there must be somebody out of millions to understand this philosophy. And there is good opportunity now. We have published so many books on this subject matter, and we have got very nice place in Bombay, Juhu. Please come, read our books, try to understand the philosophy and make your life successful.

Thank you very much. Any question?

Giriraja: Are there any questions? Please come forward with your questions. You can ask them in the microphone at the front of the stage.

Indian man (1): When chanting, you chant the name of Rama as well as Krsna. I do not see any photograph of Rama here. What is the thinking?

Prabhupada: You do not see, but can you hear?

Indian man (1): I do not see!

Prabhupada: But you do not hear!

Indian man (1): Photograph, that we are seeing.

Prabhupada: Hearing is also experiencing. Why do you want to see? You do not see your father who is dead.

Indian man (1): No, why? Why? Krsna has so many...

Prabhupada: No. Seeing and hearing is the same thing. Suppose you have grandfather. Are you seeing him? How do you accept you had a grandfather?

Indian man (1): I saw him all right.

Prabhupada: That is hearing.

Indian man (1): No, I saw him also.

Prabhupada: You saw... You did not see your great-grandfather. But how do you know? Hearing is also another process.

Indian man (1): My question is whether there is distinction between Rama and Krsna.

Prabhupada: The distinction is that hearing is also a process of acquiring knowledge. Why don't you accept it? Simply seeing is not acquiring knowledge. There are so many senses, and hearing is the first-class sense to understand which you cannot see. (applause)

Devotees: All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

Giriraja: Next? Please come forward with your questions. Asking questions is a sign of intelligence. Athato brahma jijnasa.

Tamala Krsna: I think you scared them away.

Indian man (2): How could I know the unknown within the known?

Prabhupada: This is already explained. How could you know your great-grandfather? From the parampara system. Your father says, "Yes, I had my grandfather." So from the authority of your father you can understand. This is easy process. Evam parampara-praptam imam rajarsayo viduh [Bg. 4.2]. You have to hear. Therefore Veda is called sruti. Sruti means you have to hear from the right source. Then you know. That is knowledge. You don't hear from a cheater. You hear from the right source. Then the knowledge is perfect.

Devotees: Jaya Srila Prabhupada.

Indian man (3): If a man is highly religious, it is very difficult for him to move in the material world. What is the subject? How should he move, the people who are materialistically-minded?

Prabhupada: Yes. Therefore you have to understand your spiritual identification. Because you are fools and rascals, you are thinking, "I am this body," and Krsna gives instruction in the beginning that you are not this body. Dehino 'smin yatha dehe kaumaram yauvanam jara [Bg. 2.13]. Asmin dehe: you are within this body, not this body you are. So Krsna is authority. You have to take it. Krsna is not only simply speaking authoritatively but He is giving practical example. Dehino 'smin yatha dehe kaumaram yauvanam jara [Bg. 2.13]. Because the soul is within the body it is changing. Tatha dehantara-praptir dhiras tatra na muhyati [Bg. 2.13]. You have to become a dhira, not adhira. There are two classes of men: dhira and adhira. So in order to become a dhira, you have to go... Tad-vijnanartham sa gurum evabhigacchet [MU 1.2.12]. You have to be trained up. Then you'll understand, not so quickly, without being dhira. Dhiras tatra na muhyati.

Indian man (4): What is the difference between mind and soul?

Prabhupada: Mind is material; soul is spiritual. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gita: bhumir apo 'nalo vayuh kham mano buddhir eva ca, apareyam bhinna me prakrtir astadha [Bg. 7.4]. They are also elements, but bhinna means material, separated from Krsna. Apareyam itas tu viddhi me prakrtim param: "These material elements, they are inferior quality, and beyond this, there is another, superior quality. That is soul." Jiva-bhutam maha-baho yayedam dharyate jagat [Bg. 7.5]. So you have to know from the books. That you now understand?

Indian man (5): Swamiji, they read a lot that Bhagavata says that our body is a temple for the soul, and the soul is a temple for the spirit. Would you kindly enlighten us on this point?

Prabhupada: That is already explained, that you are soul within this body, the body superficially covered with the senses. Indriyani parany ahur indriyebhyah param manah manasas tu para buddhih [Bg. 3.42]. You have to analyze that "First of all, I am prominent by my senses. My body means my senses. But the senses are useless unless there is mind." Indriyebhyah param manah. If your mind is not in order, your senses cannot act. Therefore mind is superior than the senses, and the mind cannot act if you have no intelligence. So manasas tu para buddhih. And if you can go beyond the intelligence, then you can find out what is soul. So it requires study. It requires education. The education is there. The books are there. The teachers are there. Unfortunately you are not interested to take the spiritual education. You are now interested in technology, how to hammer, that's all.

Indian man (6): It is told that athato brahma jijnasa. Whether to attain that Brahman you should follow that Brahman which is qualityless and shapeless, that is nirgunakara or sodasakara(?)?

Prabhupada: Brahman is always greater than anything. If you limit within some limited idea, that is not brahma-jnana. Brahman is unlimited, the greatest. Brhatvan brhanatvat(?). So Brahman includes everything -- nirakara, sakara, and whatever you can speak. But Brahman ultimately is sakara. It's not nirakara. That is the verdict of the sastra.

vadanti tat tattva-vidas
tattvam yaj jnanam advayam
brahmeti paramatmeti
bhagavan iti sabdyate
[SB 1.2.11]

This is brahma-jnana. Brahman... Sarvam khalv idam brahma. Everything Brahman, but there is division-brahmeti paramatmeti bhagavan iti sabdyate. Just like the sun. The sunshine is impersonal, but the sun globe is localized and the sun-god is person, but the same sun. Similarly, you have to understand Brahman. When you cannot understand the real nature of Brahman, then it is nirakara. And when you partially understand, Paramatma, then localized. And you fully understand, that is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Krsna.

Devotees: Jaya! (applause)

Indian man (6): It is said that first athato brahma jijnasa, and then it is said athato brahma jijnasa. It is said by one Yajnavalkya. Is there any difference between these two?

Prabhupada: So brahma-jijnasa, spiritual inquiry. So the cat and dog cannot inquire. It is not possible. But when you have got this human form of body, especially born in India and especially born in a Brahman family, if you misuse your life like cats and dogs, that is a great loss.

Indian man (7): Idol worship, impersonal, considered as a stepping stone. Is it fact?

Prabhupada: I don't follow. What is that?

Tamala Krsna: "Is worshiping the idol a stepping stone?"

Indian man (7): Idol worship, murti-puja, is considered as a stepping stone only. When you attain something, then you need not do.

Prabhupada: So unless you step one by one, how you can go to the topmost? You have to.

Indian man (7): After attaining that.

Prabhupada: Yes. First of all you have to step on the first step, then second step, then... Brahmeti paramatmeti bhagavan iti sabdyate [SB 1.2.11]. So everything requires training and knowledge.

Tamala Krsna: Jaya Srila Prabhupada.

Prabhupada: Hare Krsna. That's all.

Devotees: Jaya. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

Tamala Krsna: Kirtana. [break]

Indian man (8): Can you please explain that it is our only way out for salvation?

Prabhupada: Yes. People are so fallen that they cannot take the life of tapasya. Athato brahma jijnasa. This is the life of tapasya. Tapo divyam putraka yena suddhyet sattvam [SB 5.5.1]. So, tapasa brahmacaryena yamena niyamena va [SB 6.1.13]. So, there is process of tapasya, but in this age, Kali-yuga, people are so fallen that they cannot undergo all the items of tapasya. It is very difficult. Therefore Caitanya Mahaprabhu... Caitanya Mahaprabhu has not manufactured. It is mentioned in the sastra that only by this process.

kaler dosa-nidhe rajann
asti hy eko mahan gunah
kirtanad eva krsnasya
mukta-sangah param vrajet
[SB 12.3.51]

This is special concession to the Kali-yuga, that there are so many faults in this age, but if one sticks to this principle of kirtanad eva krsnasya mukta-sangah param vrajet, he becomes liberated and go back to home, back to Godhead.

Indian man (8): And is it so, that in Srimad-Bhagavata it is also written, many really great men want to be here in Kali-yuga, because it is easier to be for salvation? Only by...

Prabhupada: Yes. That I am speaking. Kirtanad eva krsnasya. Krsnasya kirtanad eva mukta-sangah param. Simply by chanting. Therefore we practically see that these Western people, they are not coming from high-class brahmana or Vaisnava family, but still, by kirtanad eva krsnasya they are becoming so liberated that they are preaching Krsna consciousness all over the world.

Indian man (8): Another thing, my last question. I shall not disturb you. The name is power, and to utter name...

Prabhupada: The name is the person. This is absolute. Absolute.

Indian man (8): Personified.

Prabhupada: Not personified. He is person.

nama cintamanih krsnas
caitanya-rasa-vigrahah
purnah suddho nitya-mukto
'bhinnatvan nama-naminoh
[Cc. Madhya 17.133]

There is... Just like here in this material world, dual world, water and the name "water" is different. But in the spiritual world, Krsna and Krsna's name is the same. Abhinnatvan nama-naminoh. So these things are to be realized one after another if you come to the process. Thank you very much. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Srimad-Bhagavatam 2.3.20 Bombay, March 24, 1977, At Cross Maidan Pandal

"Avoid Atheistic Mahatmas"

15 Jan 77, Ahmedabad

Prabhupada: So people do not understand that there is life after death. But Bhagavan says, "Yes, there is life after death." Tatha dehantara-praptih [Bg. 2.13]. So dehantara-prapti, two kinds of dehantara-prapti, either towards the hell or towards heaven, towards liberation and towards bondage. So liberation means mahat-sevam dvaram ahur vimukteh [SB 5.5.2]. We want liberation. Then mahat-seva, we have to take shelter of mahatma. And if you want to go to the darkest region of material existence, then yositam sangi-sangam, sense enjoyment... Yosit means woman. So the last resort of sense enjoyment is sex life. So if we indulge in sex life, then yositam sangi-sangam. Not only directly we indulge in sex life, but even indirectly we associate with persons who are only interested in sex life... The whole world is interested in sex life. Pumsah striya mithuni-bhavam etat. This material world is existing on this mithuni-bhava. So tamo-dvaram yositam sangi-sangam. Therefore you'll find in the Vedic way of life, sex indulgence is restricted. If we indulge in sex life than it is absolutely required, then we are gliding towards hellish condition of life. And if we follow the path of mahatmas, mahat-seva, that is dvaram ahur vimukteh. We are making progress towards liberation.

So this is a chance. This Kumbhamela is a chance to get opportunity of mahat-seva. Mahat-seva dvaram ahur vimukteh. Many... Of course, it is Kali-yuga. There are so many so-called mahatmas in dress for earning livelihood. That kind of mahatma is not required. Mahatma is also described in the Bhagavad-gita: sa mahatma su-durlabhah. Actually we have to associate with such mahatma who is su-durlabhah, not very easily obtainable. And who is that su-durlabhah mahatma? That is also described.

bahunam janmanam ante
jnanavan mam prapadyate
vasudevah sarvam iti
sa mahatma su-durlabhah
[Bg. 7.19]

So you'll get so many mahatmas who are declaring atheism: "There is no God. I am God. You are God. Where you are searching out God? The God is loitering in the street, the daridra-narayana." If you associate with such mahatma, so-called... They are not mahatmas. They are duratmas. So be careful that you may not mistake who is mahatma. Mahatma, very simple thing: mahatmanas tu mam partha daivim prakrtim asritah [Bg. 9.13]. Mahatma has nothing to do with this material world. They are under the care of daivi-prakrti, spiritual world. Mahatmanas tu mam partha daivi prakrti... [Bg. 9.13], bhajanty ananya-manaso. The symptom is that he's fully engaged in serving Krsna. Mam. Krsna is original, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. So we have to catch up the lotus feet of Krsna. Bahunam janmanam ante [Bg. 7.19]. It is not very easy, but it can be done if we have got intelligence. Intelligence is... That Krsna says. (aside:) Who is that making sound? Krsna says, mam eva ye prapadyante mayam etam taranti te. If you take to Krsna consciousness, immediately... Of course, we must take sincerely, not a show. Everything is seriously. Then immediately we become on the path of mahat-sevam dvaram ahur vimukteh [SB 5.5.2].

So... And this line of devotional service is seva, service. Ultimately we are all servants, but in the absence of being mahatma, we are serving maya. Service is there. We cannot become master. That is not possible. Jivera svarupa haya nitya krsna dasa [Cc. Madhya 20.108-109]. So there are two things: Krsna and maya, light and shadow. If you don't serve Krsna, then you have to serve maya. And those who are serving maya in the name of Krsna, they are called Mayavadi. Actually, they are serving maya, but they say that they have become liberated. Vimukta-maninah. They are described as vimukta-maninah. Maninah means one who is not actually the thing, but falsely one is thinking that "I am liberated. I have become equal with Narayana." They are called vimukta-maninah. Actually that is not the fact. So we shall be very careful to avoid this kind of mahatmas who are thinking themselves as Narayana, equal to Narayana, or sometimes they claim greater than Narayana. So we shall be very careful. This Mela, there are so many so-called mahatmas. But the symptom of mahatma is described in the Bhagavad-gita: bhajanty ananya-manaso. That is the qualification. And to become devotee of Krsna, it is not at all difficulty. There is no difficulty. Anyone can become. Mam hi partha vyapasritya ye 'pi syuh papa-yonayah [Bg. 9.32]. Even lowborn, they can also take shelter of Krsna, and what to speak of... Kim punar brahmanah punya bhakta rajarsayas tatha [Bg. 9.33]. If actually qualified brahmanas, they take shelter, what to speak of... Their progress is very quick. Punya. Without punya background, sukrti, nobody can take birth in the family or society of brahmanas.

So brahmana... First of all, we have to become pure brahmana.

satya samo dama titiksa arjava
jnanam-vijnanam astikyam
brahma-karma svabhava-jam
[Bg. 18.42]

These are the brahminical qualification. Unfortunately, nobody is interested to become a brahmana, and what to speak of becoming a Vaisnava. Vaisnava is above the brahmanas. Sat-karma-nipuno vipro mantra-tantra-visaradah. Brahmana's business is sat-karma: pathan pathan yajan yajan dana pratigraha. So even a brahmana is very expert in this brahmana's business, pathan pathan... He has studied Vedas very thoroughly, and he has many students whom he has taught the Vedic knowledge. This is pathan pathan. Yajan yajan: he is expert in worshiping the Deity, and he teaches other disciples also. Sri-vigraharadhana-nitya-nana-srngara-tan-mandira-marj anadau **. So there are brahmanas who are not Vaisnava, worshiper of demigods other than the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Such brahmana is not required. Such brahmanas are condemned. Kamais tais tair hrta-jnanah yajante anya-devatah [Bg. 7.20]. Anya-devatah. The Visnu is the original devata, and then next devata, Lord Brahma, Lord Siva, and then others. So they are all anya-devatah. Om tad visnoh paramam padam. So one has to worship Visnu. That is Vaisnava. Visnur asya devata iti vaisnavah. Vaisnava means that he's not worshiper of any other demigods. There is no question of disrespect for any other demigods. But saranam saranyam. But to take shelter of and to worship is recommended to the Supreme Lord-mam ekam -- not everyone. We can show our respectful obeisances even to the ant, but worshipable Deity, or God, is Krsna or Visnu, Visnu-tattva.

There are many forms of Visnu-tattva. Ramadi-murtisu kala-niyamena tisthan [Bs. 5.39]. He's expanded in many forms: Rama, Nrsimha, Varaha... There are so many incarnation of Visnu-tattva. They're all one. Advaitam acyutam anadi ananta-rupam. So Visnu-tattva, worshipable, or Krsna-tattva, worshipable. And to pin our staunch faith in Visnu, we should discuss about Visnu-tattva and not Visnu-tattva (?). That is called siddhanta. Siddhanta boliya citte na kara alasa: "Don't be lazy to discuss about siddhanta." Iha haite krsne lage sudrdha manasa: "The more you discuss the thesis -- not thesis; the factual presentation of Visnu-tattva, maya, and jiva-tattva, sakti-tattva -- then it will be clear what is Krsna." Krsna is the origin of everything. Aham sarvasya prabhavo mattah sarvam pravartate [Bg. 10.8]. We should try to understand this fact, that Krsna is the origin of everything, and if we take to Krsna consciousness... Krsne bhakti kaile sarva-karma krta haya. If you become Krsna conscious, then your all other duties automatically... The same example, as we have given: If you pour water on the root of the tree, then all other duties are automatically done. There is no question of separate attempt-philanthropy, philosophy and nationalism, this "ism," that "ism." We have discovered so many things and diversion of the real duty. That we shall have to concentrate. That is siddhanta.

siddhanta boliya citte na kara alasa
iha haite krsne lage sudrdha manasa

We become more and more faithful to Krsna by understanding the siddhanta.

So mayavadi-bhasya sunile haya sarva... [Cc. Madhya 6.169]. For kanistha-adhikari, to avoid this Mayavadi philosophy that "Everyone is God. I am God. You are God..." This is atheism. It is cheating atheism. One class of atheism is Sunyavadi: "There is no God." That we can understand, that he is atheist. "There is no God." He publicly declares, "We don't believe in God." But the Mayavadis are dangerous because they say that there is God, but without any form -- no head, no leg. If you make "no, no, no," then where is...? It becomes zero ultimately. Go on making "no, no" -- "No head, no tail, no hand, no..." So what remains? So this is another trick for saying there is no God. Therefore Caitanya Mahaprabhu has said that this class, who gives the negative definition of God -- "Not this, not this, not this, not this" -- the Mayavadi, Maya... They say, "Not this. This is maya." So this Mayavadi, they are greater atheist.

veda na maniya bauddha haya ta nastika
vedasraya nastikya-vada bauddhake adhika

So it is very dangerous to associate with Mayavadis. Of course, those who are kanistha... Who are fixed up in Krsna consciousness, they can mix with anyone. Nobody can influence. They are protected. If one has become pure devotee, for preaching work he can go anywhere. [break] (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Morning Lecture -- Allahabad, January 15, 1977

"A Devotee's Desire"

8 Feb 77 , Mayapura

Prabhupada: One-hundred-third birth anniversary. So this is formal, one-hundred-third or, or, or -second. It is eternal. It is eternal. Just like Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu has described, nitya-lila. Nitya-lila means it is going on. Just like just now it is eleven o'clock. This eleven o'clock, and when it becomes twelve o'clock noon, it does not mean that eleven o'clock is passed. Eleven o'clock is existing somewhere. In India it is eleven o'clock, somewhere else it is ten o'clock, and when in India it will be twelve o'clock that eleven o'clock will be somewhere else. Therefore one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, you take, that is going on. It is not that one is finished. That is material calculation. Material calculation, this body we have got. When this body will be finished it is finished forever. It will never come. Tatha dehantara-praptir. In the spiritual world there is no such thing as finished. Nitya-lila. Nitya-mukta. We have to understand that. In the material world, one minute's lost, it is lost forever. Canakya Pandita has given us instruction from the material point of view,

ayusah ksana eko 'pi
na labhyah svarna-kotibhih
sacen nirarthakam nitah
ka ca hanis tato 'dhikah

Ayusah ksana eko 'pi. Suppose I shall live fifty years or hundred years maximum. So out of them, one moment lost, it will be never returned. From our birth, when a child is born we ask the parents when the child is born. The parents say, "This child was born in the morning, ten o'clock." So if the child is born at ten o'clock and I am asking at eleven o'clock, the one hour life of the child lost. Eleven o'clock means child has already died one hour out of his one hundred years.

So for Vaisnava it is not like that. It is not like that. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. This is material calculation: one hour lost, two hours lost, body's life is transient..., it is losing one moment, one hour. But spiritual life is different. Nityah sasvato yam, na hanyate hanyamane sarire. So, as Krsna comes, yada yada hi dharmasya glanir bhavati bharata tadatmanam srjamy aham [Bg. 4.7]. Krsna is eternal, but still, He appears. The same example. Just like the sun is in the sky but we see in the morning it appears; in the evening it retires. That is defectness of our eyes. Actually the sun is always there. So similarly Vaisnava, as Krsna comes, yada yada hi dharmasya glanir. Similarly, a Vaisnava means the confidential servant of Krsna, he also comes for some purpose by the order of the master. So their life and Krsna's life, it is same. There is no question of past, present, future. Nityah. Nityah sasvato 'yam, na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. So they are the same thing as the appearance and disappearance of sun. And Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, our master, spiritual master, he also came in this world to execute some mission of life or mission of Caitanya Mahaprabhu. So he executed it, and when it was required, he left this place and went to another place to do the same business. Just like the sun rises at six o'clock and seven o'clock there is six o'clock in another place, and it is eight o'clock another place. It is going on. Nitya-lila.

So we have nothing to lament for disappearance. We should simply remember his activities. That is Vaisnava -- you cannot understand the activities of the Vaisnava, but they come, any Vaisnava comes, for some particular mission. Prahlada Maharaja,

naivodvije para duratyaya-vaitaranyas
tvad-virya-gayana-mahamrta-magna-cittah
soce tato vimukha-cetasa (indriyartha-)
maya-sukhaya bharam udvahato vimudhan
[SB 7.9.43]

Prahlada Maharaja said to Nrsimhadeva, "My Lord, I have nothing to grieve, because wherever I shall sit down, glorifying Your activities, I immediately become merged into the ocean of nectarine. So I have nothing to grieve. But one thing I am sorry, I am in grief for these vimudhas." Vimudhan. Mudha means rascal, and vimudhai, particularly rascals. Every living being within this material world, they are mudhas because they are forgetting their relationship with Krsna. Mudho nabhijanati mam param avyayam. This is mudha. All living entities more or less, we are all mudhas, particularly vimudhan, because there are different types of living entities. Jalaja nava-laksani sthavara laksa vimsati krmayo, species of life.

So the evolution is going on. When we come to this stage of human form of life, here is a chance to get out of this evolutionary process. This is the chance. Asatim, caturam caiva brahma jiva-jatesu. In the Padma Purana the evolutionary theory...Not theory. It is fact. Darwin's evolutionary theory it may be, but in the Vedic literature the evolutionary theory it is existing since very, very, millions of... It is not crazy fellow's evolutionary theory. It is fact. So in this evolutionary theory, fact, we see that the, bahunam janmanam ante, bahunam sambhavan [Bg. 7.19]. After many, many evolution, millions of years, we get this chance of human being, to become human being. In this human form of life, if we still remain a mudha, then we are vimudhan. Vimudhan means, vi means visesa. Here is chance. And Krsna personally is giving his instruction to the human being. Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. This is the chance. But still, we are not accepting. Therefore vimudhan. Mudha, the cats and dogs, they cannot understand. If we give instruction to the dog, "My dear dog, chant Hare Krsna..." But a human being, either he may be known to Krsna or not known to Krsna, he can be trained up. Just like in your country, in Europe and America, they did not know even what Krsna. But since we have started this movement, Krsna consciousness movement, you have become so many devotees of Krsna. That is possible because human being. They can be trained up. So in spite of all these facilities for the human being, if he's not trained up to Krsna consciousness, then he is vimudha. He does not take the advantage. Na mam... This human form of life, he is classified as duskrtina, mudha, naradhama, mayayapahrta-jnanah [Bg. 7.15]. He's described. He must be either of these categories. So things have degraded so low that India they're asking what is God. This is Kali-yuga. In India, where Krsna comes personally, where Lord Ramacandra comes, where Lord Buddha comes, where Caitanya Mahaprabhu comes, in that country now young men are asking, "What is God?" This is Kali-yuga.

So we should not remain vimudha. We should become intelligent. And to make us intelligent, Krsna comes, Krsna's devotees come, some messenger comes. And Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura is one of the messengers of Krsna Caitanya Mahaprabhu to preach Krsna consciousness. And not only he preached, but he trained up many disciples to preach this Krsna consciousness all over the world. So by his grace we are also endeavoring to do something. This is called parampara system. So we should take advantage of this Vaisnava mission. As Caitanya... Prahlada Maharaja said, they are very anxious. Vaisnava means para-duhkha-duhkhi. Krpambudhir yas tam, aham prapadye [Cc. Madhya 6.254]. Para-duhkha-duhkhi. Vaisnava... Our Guru Maharaja Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, he is Vaisnava, cent percent Vaisnava. And he was para-duhkha-duhkhi. This is Vaisnava. He criticized nirjana bhajana. He has personally written one song, mana tumi kisera vaisnava. Nirjanera ghare pratisthara tare, tava hari-nama kevala kaitava. Mana tumi kisera vaisnava. He has in long song... Pratistha... Vaisnava means he doesn't want any material profit or material opulence or material reputation. He doesn't want. This is... But in the material world everyone is busy for three things -- material profit, material reputation, and material adoration. This is not Vaisnava's business. Vaisnava never cares for all these things. Vaisnava is always thinking how to do good to the suffering humanity. Lokanam-hita-karinau. About Six Gosvamis it is said, nana-sastra-vicaranaika-nipunau sad-dharma-samsthapakau lokanam hita-karinau tri-bhuvane manyau saranyakarau. This is Vaisnava. Nana-sastra-vicaranaika-nipunau. In the sastra everything is there. Just like Srila Rupa Gosvami has given us Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu to understand what is bhakti. We have tried to translate it into English, the Nectar of Devotion. So, why? Rupa Gosvami was the minister in the government of Hussain Shah. Very opulent position. Tyaktva turnam asesa-mandala-pati-srenim sada tucchavat bhutva dina-ganesakau karunaya kaupina-kanthasritau. They resigned the high post of ministership and joined Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu for pushing on and on this Krsna consciousness movement. Tyaktva turnam asesa-mandala-pati-srenim sada tucchavat bhutva dina-ganesakau karunaya kaupina-kanthasritau.

So Vaisnava means para-duhkha-duhkhi. They are simple thinking...There are so many politicians and humanitarians and so many. But nobody knows how to do good to others. Nobody knows. They do not know. The real fact is, as Krsna explains Himself, that

asraddadhanah purusa
dharmasyasya parantapa
mam aprapya nivartante
mrtyu-samsara-vartmani (sic:)
[Bg. 9.3]

This is the real suffering of the humanity. I especially speak humanity because in the human form of life one can actually understand what is the position, what is the value of life. The value of life one should understand that we are in the cycle of birth and death. Bhutva bhutva praliyate [Bg. 8.19]. Once we take birth and again we die. Janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi duhkha-dosanu-darsanam [Bg. 13.9]. So one should be intelligent to understand that I am eternal. I learn from Bhagavad-gita and Vedic literature that aham brahmasmi: "I am eternal." Why I am dying? This is intelligence. This is intelligence. Otherwise cats and dogs. A dog, a cat, does not know why he is dying. Neither he knows that he is eternal. But a human being can take information from the sastra that he is eternal and he does not die on the destruction of the body. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. Krsna is giving this information. Tatha dehantara. This is our real unhappiness. Janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi. But if we are kept in darkness about this and simply we become busy with some superficial things, bahir-artha-maninah. Na te viduh svartha-gatim hi visnu, durasaya. It is durasaya. So all these leaders, the political leaders, they do not know what is the value of life. The durasaya, with some hope which will never be fulfilled, they are busy with that. Therefore a Vaisnava is para-duhkha-duhkhi. He knows what is the real suffering of humanity and he tries to estab...Sad-dharma-samsthapakau. Nana-sastra-vicaranaika-nipunau. Real dharma means occupation. Dharma does not mean that you believe in something. That is the description in the..., "a faith." Faith is different thing. But real dharma means the occupational duty. Just like government law. Government law. If you go on the street, you'll find "Keep to the left." There is no question of faith. You must keep on the left; otherwise you are criminal, you'll be punished. That is dharma. The real meaning is this, that dharmam tu saksad bhagavat-pranitam [SB 6.3.19], The laws given by God. That is the simple definition of dharma.

So if we don't accept the dharma, then we'll be punished. That is stated in the Bhagavata. Dharmasya asya. Asraddadhanah. "If I have no faith in the words of God..." Man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru [Bg. 18.65]. Krsna is saying, "If you do not become devotee, if you do not think of Krsna, then you will not get Krsna." Remain continuously, birth after birth, forgetful of Krsna, that is very dangerous. What is that danger? Nivartante mrtyu-samsara-vartmani: again you'll be in the cycle of birth and death, birth and death, birth and death. Not that today you are Indian; you shall get the birth again as Indian. No. Today you may be Indian, prime minister; tomorrow you may be a dog in some other country. They do not know these laws.

prakrteh kriyamanani
gunaih karmani sarvasah
ahankara vimudhatma
kartaham iti manyate
[Bg. 3.27]

You are not independent. Nobody is independent. Today you maybe something; tomorrow you may be something. But you must search out your real life. That is intelligence. That is intelligence. That intelligence is given by the Vaisnava. Therefore Vaisnava has got a very great responsibility. My Guru Maharaja pointed out, Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura,

mana tumi kisera vaisnava?
pratisthara tare, nirjanera ghare,
tava hari-nama kevala (kaitava)

Formerly people used to know that "If I take a mala and sit down in a secluded place..." Of course, that is good; that is not bad. But the real business of Vaisnava is not for himself, but for others. Just like the example given by Rupa Gosvami: nana-sastra-vicaranaika-nipunau sad-dharma samsthapakau lokanam hita-karinau. Lokanam-hita-karinau, not personal hita-karinau. Personal hita-karinau is not high-class Vaisnava. "I shall become liberated. Let me give up everything and sit down." Sometimes that is also good, but sometimes we take it to get cheap adoration from innocent public that "Here is a Vaisnava. He sits down." No. My Guru Maharaja, Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, he was not that type of Vaisnava. That is his special gift. He wanted every one of his disciples to go and preach the cult of Krsna consciousness. Caitanya Mahaprabhu wanted. Here we are in the Caitanya Mahaprabhu's country, birthplace. We should remember. Caitanya Mahaprabhu of course asked every Indian to take His mission. At least Bengalis should take Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission.

So Caitanya Mahaprabhu...What is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission?

amara ajnaya guru hana, tara ei desa
yare dekha, tare kaha 'krsna'-upadesa
[Cc. Madhya 7.128]

Even if you cannot go outside, it doesn't matter. Wherever you are, either you are here in Nabadwip or in Calcutta, anywhere, so you become a guru. Don't remain a rascal. You become a guru. "Now, how can I become a guru? I am not very educated." No! You don't require to be very highly educated rascal. Simply repeat Krsna consciousness as Krsna said. You become guru. Unfortunately we don't care for Krsna's instruction. We are busy with this ism, that ism, that ism. So we should remember -- I don't wish to take much time -- Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, he took Caitanya Mahaprabhu's instruction very seriously, and he wanted his disciple to do. Bhaktivinoda Thakura also wanted that, and Bhaktisiddhanta... This Mayapur is meant for this purpose, to spread Krsna consciousness movement all over the world as it was desired by Caitanya Mahaprabhu. Prthivite ache yata nagaradi grama sarvatra pracara. So the beginning is there. We are preaching all over the world and you, my dear friends from Europe and America, you have taken this Krsna consciousness movement. Again I shall repeat the same logic. Andha-pangu-nyaya. Andha means blind and pangu means lame. Both of them are useless. Andha cannot see, he cannot walk, and the lame man cannot walk. Andha can walk but cannot see. And the lame man can see but cannot walk. Now let them both combine together. So the whole world is suffering for want of Krsna consciousness or spiritual life. If American money and Indian culture mix together, the whole world will be benefited. That is my ambition. Take Indian culture and help with American money. The whole world will be happy. Andha-pangu-nyaya. If the andha is taken on the shoulder... If the pangu is taken on the shoulder of the andha, then the lame man can give direction.

So actually this logic is coming to be true, there is now agitation. People are feeling the pressure of this movement, and in Europe and America there is opposing party. But don't be afraid. Take this Krsna consciousness movement very seriously. It is not a national movement or some social movement. It is the movement to uplift the position of the whole human society. So that was the mission of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura. Somehow or other we are taking it little seriously. Let all the Americans, Indians, especially young men... Don't misunderstand these Europeans and Americans C.I.A. Don't be mad, crazy fellow. They have taken Krsna consciousness. They have nothing to do with politics. And you also, young men, you also join on the basis of Krsna consciousness and do something philanthropic for the whole human society. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => His Divine Grace Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Gosvami Prabhupada's Appearance Day, Lecture -- Mayapur, February 8, 1977

"What to Fear"

21 Feb 76 , Mayapura


Prabhupada: Today, the auspicious day of our predecessor spiritual master, Om Visnupada Paramahamsa Parivrajakacarya Astottara-sata Srimad Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura Prabhupada. Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura's mission... Apart from his life, we are especially stressing on the mission of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura. This place, Mayapur, was formerly known as Miyapura. Mostly it is inhabited by the Muhammadans. Some way or other it converted into the name of Miyapura instead of Mayapur. Still, people are very much doubtful where is the birth site of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. And Bhaktivinoda Thakura was researching to find out the actual place. So under the direction of Jagannatha dasa Babaji Maharaja, this present Yogapitha was ascertained to be the birth site of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. So Bhaktivinoda Thakura in the beginning wanted to develop this place very gloriously, befitting the holy name of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. So he started this movement of developing Mayapur. He could not finish it, so it was handed down to Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura. So under his effort, assisted by his disciples, this place has gradually developed, and our attempt is also to develop this place. Therefore we have named this temple Mayapur Chandrodaya. We have got great ambition to develop this place nicely and gloriously, and fortunately we are now connected with foreign countries, especially with the Americans. Bhaktivinoda Thakura's great desire was that the Americans would come here and develop this place and they would chant and dance along with the Indians.

So his dream as well as Caitanya Mahaprabhu's foretelling,

prthivite ache yata nagaradi grama
sarvatra pracara haibe mora nama

So Caitanya Mahaprabhu desired that all Indians to take part.

bharata bhumite manusya-janma haila yara
janma sarthaka kari' kara para-upakara.
[Cc. Adi 9.41]

This is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission, para-upakara. Para-upakara means to do good to others. Of course, in the human society there are many different branches of doing good to others -- welfare societies -- but more or less... Why more or less? Almost completely they think that this body is our self and to do some good to the body is welfare activities. But actually that is not welfare activities because in the Bhagavad-gita we understand very clearly, antavanta ime dehah nityasyoktah saririnah. This body is antavat. Anta means it will be finished. Everyone knows his body is not permanent; it will be finished. Anything material -- bhutva bhutva praliyate [Bg. 8.19] -- it has a date of birth, it stays for some time, and then it annihilates. So the spiritual education begins from the understanding that "I am not this body." This is spiritual education. In the Bhagavad-gita the first instruction given by Krsna to Arjuna is this, that we are not this body. Because Arjuna was speaking from the bodily platform, so Krsna chastised him that asocyan anvasocas tvam prajna-vadams ca bhasase: [Bg. 2.11] "Arjuna, you are talking like a very learned man, but you are lamenting on the subject matter on which no learned man laments." Asocyan anvasocas tvam.

So such kind of welfare activity concerning the body, like hospital and so many other things, they are good undoubtedly, but the ultimate goal is to see the interest of the soul. That is ultimate goal. That is the whole Vedic instruction. And Krsna begins from this point. Dehino 'smin yatha dehe kaumaram yauvanam jara [Bg. 2.13]. So when Caitanya Mahaprabhu wanted to do some para-upakara...

bharata bhumite manusya-janma haila yara
(manusya) janma sarthaka kari' kara para-upakara
[Cc. Adi 9.41]

These welfare activities did not mean that welfare to this body. It was meant for the soul, the same thing as Krsna wanted to impress upon Arjuna, that "You are not this body. You are soul." Antavanta ime dehah nityasyoktah saririnah, na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. So real welfare activity means to see to the interest of the soul. So what is the interest of the soul? The interest of the soul is that the soul is part and parcel of Krsna, God. Just like small spark of fire is part and parcel of the big fire, similarly, we living entities, we are very minute, small spark of the Supreme Brahman, Parabrahman, or Krsna. So as the spark within the fire looks very beautiful, the fire also looks beautiful, and the spark also looks beautiful, but as soon as the sparks fall down from the fire, it becomes extinguished.

So our condition is that the... Our present position is that we are fallen down from the whole fire, Krsna. This is explained in a simple Bengali language:

krsna bhuliya jiva bhoga vancha kare
pasate maya tare japatiya dhare

Maya means darkness, ignorance. So this example is very nice. The sparks of the fire dancing very nicely with fire, it is also illuminating. But as soon as it fall down on the ground, it becomes cinder, black cinder, no more fiery quality. Similarly, we are meant for dancing and playing and walking and living with Krsna. That is our real position. That is the Vrndavana. Everyone... Everyone is connected with Krsna. There the trees, there the flowers, water, the cows, the calves, the cowherd boys, or elderly cowherd men, Nanda Maharaja, other persons of his age, then Yasodamayi, mother, then gopis -- in this way Vrndavana life, Vrndavana picture. Krsna comes with full Vrndavana picture, and He demonstrates His Vrndavana life, cintamani-prakara-sadmasu, just to attract us, that "You are trying to enjoy in this material world, but here you cannot enjoy because you are eternal. You cannot get eternal life here. So you come to Me. You come to Me." Tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti kaunteya [Bg. 4.9]. This is Krsna consciousness movement. (aside:) Please ask them to wait for prasadam. Tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti. This is the invitation. Mam eti: "He comes back to home, back to Godhead." This is the whole instruction of Bhagavad-gita. And at the end He said, sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. Why you are bothering yourself, manufacturing so many plans to adjust material life? That is not possible. Here it is not possible. Here so long you are in material association, then you have to change the body. Prakrteh kriyamanani... [Bg. 3.27]. Prakrti-stho. What is that verse? Purusah prakrti-stho 'pi...

Hrdayananda: Bhunjate prakrti-jan gunan.

Prabhupada: Ha. Bhunjate prakrti-jan gunan. So long the living entity is in this material world, he has to associate with the different modes of material nature. The same example. Just like the fire spark falls down on the ground. So ground, they have got different situation. One situation is dry grass, one situation is wet grass, and one situation is simply ground. So similarly, there are three position: sattva-guna, rajo-guna, tamo-guna. So sattva-guna means if the spark falls down on the dry grass, then it ignites the grasses. So in the sattva-guna, prakasa, this fiery quality is demonstrated. But if it falls down on the water, wet ground, then it is completely extinguished. Three stages. Similarly, when we come down to this material world, if we associate with the sattva-guna, then there is some hope of spiritual life. And if we are rajo-guna there is no hope, and tamo-guna, there is no hope. Rajas-tamah. Rajas-tamo-bhava kama-lobhadayas ca ye. Rajas-tamah. If we associate with rajo-guna and tamo-guna, then our desires will be lusty and greediness. Kama-lobhadayas ca. Tato rajas-tamo-bhava kama-lobhadayas ca. And if we increase our sattva-guna quality, then this kama-lobhadaya, these two things, will not touch us. We may be little aloof from kama-lobha. So if in the sattva-guna... This is stated in the Srimad-Bhagavatam:

srnvatam sva-kathah krsnah
punya-sravana-kirtanah
hrdy antah-stho hy abhadrani
vidhunoti suhrtsatam
[SB 1.2.17]

So we have to transcend all these three qualities, sattva-guna, rajo-guna, tamo-guna, especially rajo-guna, tamo-guna. If we do not try to do that, then there is no hope of spiritual salvation or liberation from the material entanglement. But in the Kali-yuga there is no practically sattva-guna, simply rajas, rajo-guna, tamo-guna, especially tamo-guna. Jaghanya-guna-vrtti-sthah [Bg. 14.18]. Kalau sudra-sambhavah. Therefore Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu spread this Krsna consciousness movement, chanting Hare Krsna mantra.

So from this place Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu started this movement, Krsna consciousness movement, throughout whole India, and He desired that prthivite ache yata nagaradi grama: "So as many towns and villages are there, this Krsna consciousness movement should be spread." So this Krsna consciousness movement is now in your hand. Of course, in 1922 Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, he wanted me to do something in this connection. He wanted from his, all his disciples. Especially he stressed many times that "You do this. Whatever you have learned, you try to expand in English language." And in 1933, when he was in Radha-kunda, I was at that time Bombay in connection with my business life. So I came to see him, and one friend wanted to give some land in Bombay for starting Bombay Gaudiya Matha. He's my friend. So that's a long story, but I wish to narrate this, the Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Gosvami's mission. So at that time one of my Godbrother was also present. He reminded me about my friend's donation, and Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura Prabhupada immediately took up the land. He continued that "There is no need of establishing many temples. Better we publish some books." He said like that. He said that "We started our, this Gaudiya Matha in Ultadanga. The rent was very small, and if we could gather 2 to 250 rupees, it was very nice, going on. But since this J.V. Datta(?) has given us this stone, marble stone Thakurabari, our competition between the disciples have increased, so I don't like anymore. Rather, I would prefer to take out the marble stone and sell it and publish some books." So I took that point, and he also especially advised me that "If you get money, you try to publish books." So by his blessing it has become very successful by your cooperation. Now our books are being sold all over the world, and it is very satisfactory sale. So on this particular day of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura's advent, try to remember his words, that he wanted that many books should be published about our philosophy and it should be given to the English-knowing public especially, because English language is now world language. We are touring all over the world. So anywhere we speak English, it is understood, except in some places. So on this day, particular on the advent of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, I'd especially request my disciples who are cooperating with me that try to publish books as many as possible and distribute throughout the whole world. That will satisfy Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu as well as Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura. Thank you very much.

Devotees: Jaya Srila Prabhupada. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => His Divine Grace Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Gosvami Prabhupada's Appearance Day, Lecture -- Mayapur, February 21, 1976