Lecture At Bharati Vidya Bhavan

18 Oct 73 , Bombay

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Prabhupada: (chants mangalacarana prayers) Sriman Nandaji, Ladies and Gentlemen, this scarcity of Krsna consciousness was felt long, long ago. When, before starting this movement, I tried to approach many friends in India... Sometimes I think I approached late Mr. Munshi also, when he was governor in U.P. I requested that everyone may contribute a son from the family so that I can convert him an actual brahmana. Because the education at the present moment is creating sudras. Actually, there are two kinds of dharmas: pasu-dharma and manava-dharma. Pasu-dharma means eating, sleeping, sexual intercourse, and defending. This is pasu-dharma. Ahara-nidra-bhaya-maithunam ca samanyam etat pasubhih naranam. Eating, this is essential. Try to understand what is dharma. Dharma means which you cannot give up. Dharma does not mean you accept this dharma today and tomorrow another dharma. That is not dharma. Dharma means the natural characteristic. Just like sugar is sweet. That is its dharma. And chili is hot. That is its dharma. A snake bites. That is his dharma. Water is liquid. That is its dharma. Stone is solid. That is its dharma. You cannot change. So what is the dharma of the living entities, or the human being? Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu has enunciated the dharma of the human being: jivera svarupa haya nitya krsna-dasa [Cc. Madhya 20.108-109]. This is dharma, that every living entity is eternally servant of Krsna. He cannot give it up. If he does not serve Krsna, then he will have to serve maya. Service is there. Nobody can say that "I don't serve anyone." Is there anybody who can say boldly that "I do not serve anyone?" You must serve. That is your dharma. Either you become a Christian or a Muslim or a Hindu or this or that, your real characteristic is that you have to serve. That service attitude, when it is misunderstood, it is applied to maya, and we are not happy. When it is applied to Krsna, then we are happy. Service you must render. That is your position. You cannot become master. Even the politicians, they promise, "I shall give you such and such service. Please give me vote." So the service is promised, because we have to serve.

So this definition given by Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, that jivera svarupa haya krsna nitya-dasa: "The real, original characteristic of the living entity is to serve Krsna." That is confirmed in the Bhagavad-gita. Krsna says, mamaivamso jiva-bhutah: [Bg. 15.7] "All these living entities, they are My parts and parcels." Just try to understand. What is the duty of the parts and parcel? Suppose this finger -- they are the parts and parcel of my body. What is the duty of the finger? The finger has to catch the foodstuff or prepare the foodstuff and put into the mouth. The finger cannot enjoy; it has given to the stomach. Similarly, if we are parts and parcel of Krsna, we cannot enjoy anything directly without giving Krsna. That is our duty. Jivera svarupa haya nitya krsna-dasa [Cc. Madhya 20.108-109]. So Krsna also said in the Bhagavad-gita, dharma-samsthapanarthaya sambhavami yuge yuge.

yada yada hi dharmasya
glanir bhavati bharata
abhyutthanam adharmasya
tadatmanam srjamy aham
 [Bg. 4.7]

So what for Krsna comes? Does he come to establish Hindu dharma, Muslim dharma or Christian dharma? If Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, why He should be interested in particular type of dharma, Hindu dharma, Christian dharma or Muslim dharma? No. Therefore after giving instruction throughout the whole Bhagavad-gita, at last says Krsna, "The most confidential part of My instruction, Arjuna," sarva-guhyatamam, "is this: sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]." This is dharma. If you are not surrendered soul to Krsna, or God, your dharma has no meaning. It is useless. And where the definition of dharma is given by Krsna at the last stage of His instruction of Bhagavad-gita, sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja, if one can catch up this point, then he begins bhagavata-dharma. Bhagavata-dharma.

Prahlada Maharaja said, kaumaram acaret prajno dharman bhagavatan iha. Kaumara, from the very beginning of childhood, one should be taught about dharma, especially bhagavata-dharma, the relationship with God. Similarly, in other place it is said,

sa vai pumsam paro dharmo
yato bhaktir adhoksaje
ahaituky apratihata
yenatma suprasidati
 [SB 1.2.6]

Yena atma suprasidati. Sa vai pumsam paro dharmo [SB 1.2.6], highest type of religious system, yato bhaktir adhoksaje, by which one can learn how to love God -- that is dharma. Anything else, that is not dharma. That is pasu-dharma. Nandaji has invented a very nice word, manava-dharma. So manava-dharma means what is the distinction between manava and pasu. That distinction is that a man eats, an animal eats; a man sleeps, an animal sleeps; a man has got sexual intercourse, animal has got sexual intercourse; a man also tries to defend, an animal also tries to defend. So these four principles of dharma, bodily necessities of life, is equal to the man and the animal. If you manufacture very nice palatable dishes for eating, that does not mean you are advanced in civilization. No. It is eating. So what is the difference between manava-dharma and pasu-dharma? Manava-dharma means what Krsna teaches -- sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. This is manava-dharma. Except this, anything, that is pasu-dharma. That is pasu-dharma. Therefore Bhagavata says, dharmah projjhita-kaitavo atra: [SB 1.1.2] "All cheating type of dharma is kicked out from this bhagavata-dharma."

So actually, if we are interested in manava-dharma, we should take instruction from the authorities. Don't try to manufacture dharma. That is not possible. You cannot manufacture. Dharmam tu saksat bhagavat-pranitam. Dharma means the codes given by God. That is dharma. Just like law means given by the state. You cannot manufacture law at your home. That is not possible. Nobody will care for that. Nobody will care for that. Just like on the street we have got the law, "Keep to the left." So if you say, "Why not go to the right?" you will be immediately arrested. You are criminal, because it is law by the state. By your consideration, where is the difference between going... In some countries, in England... England is "Keep to the left," India. America is "Keep to the right." So this may be changed in different countries and different laws, but law means which is given by the state. Similarly, dharma means which is given by God. You cannot manufacture dharma. That will not be applicable. So therefore Krsna says, the Supreme Personality of Godhead says that "I descend." Yada yada hi dharmasya glanir bhavati bharata [Bg. 4.7]. What is that glanih? When one forgets Krsna, or God, and manufacture his own religion, pasu-dharma, he cannot be happy. That is not possible. Just like if you make your own laws, you cannot be happy. You must obey the laws of the state. Similarly, what is the law of God? That is dharma. Dharmam tu saksat bhagavat-pranitam. Dharma cannot be manufactured by any man or any demigod or any saintly person or... No. The dharma is given by the Supreme Personality of Godhead, which He says as the last instruction in the Bhagavad-gita. Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. And actually it is happening all over the world. Since we have presented this dharma, to serve Krsna, it is working very wonderfully. We have got branches all over the world, and you will find... Some of the samples you will see, those who are chanting Hare Krsna mantra, these Europeans, Americans, Canadians -- we have got even branch in Iran also -- Muhammadans, Christians, African. Everyone is taking to this dharma, this Krsna consciousness movement.

Therefore Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu enunciated, ceto-darpana-marjanam bhava-maha-davagni-nirvapanam [Cc. Antya 20.12]. Bhava-maha-davagni-nirvapanam. There is a conflagration of flame all over the world on account of godless civilization, this nonsense civilization. We have to stop it. Then you will be happy. You cannot become happy without God. That is not possible. Therefore if you actually interested to spread dharma, you take the principles of Bhagavad-gita, standard, Bhagavad-gita as it is. Don't try to interpret in a fashionable way: "This means that, that means that." No. "Krsna" means Krsna. Krsna means... Krsna says, mattah parataram nanyat kincid asti dhananjaya: [Bg. 7.7] "My dear Dhananjaya, there is no more superior authority than Me." You have to accept that. Krsna says, mam eva ye prapadyante mayam etam taranti te. You have to accept that. Krsna says, man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru [Bg. 18.65]. You have to accept that. Then you will be able to... You will be successful. Otherwise it is useless waste of time. Srama eva hi kevalam. Srama eva hi kevalam.

dharmah svanusthitah pumsam
visvaksena-kathasu yah
notpadayed ratim yadi
srama eva hi kevalam
 [SB 1.2.8]

You can execute your so-called dharmas, but if it does not help you to understand what is God, then it is useless waste of time. It is useless waste of time. Srama eva hi kevalam. So actually, this Bharata-varsa is the land of dharma. Even some Communist Chinese gentleman, he has written a book... That is recommended in the New York University. He says that "If you want to know about dharma, you must go to India and learn there." We have got so facility. Caitanya Mahaprabhu said,

bharata-bhumite manusya-janma haila yara
janma sarthaka kari' kara paropakara
 [Cc. Adi 9.41]

Anyone who has taken birth as a human being in the land of Bharata-varsa, first of all let him become perfect and distribute the knowledge all over the world. That is paropakara.

So I shall request that there is great need of this Krsna consciousness movement all over the world. It is only one man's attempt. If persons like Nandaji and others, living persons... Yad yad acarati sresthah lokas tad anuvartate [Bg. 3.21]. Nandaji is one of the srestha-vekti of India. He was minister in the Central government. Now he is out of office. But the man is the same. I was very glad when I received the literature. I thought, "At least one man in India is thinking that India is so much downfallen." So I was very much encouraged. Otherwise I was very much discouraged that there is no human being in India, because they have forgotten Krsna, forgotten God. Now I see there are still. So I shall request Nandaji that take the standard method as prescribed in the Bhagavad-gita. Then you will be successful. Not only Nandaji -- anyone. The example is already there. I am preaching all over the world Bhagavad-gita as it is. There is no fashionable interpretation. No. As it is. And how they are being accepted. So why not in this country? And in this country Krsna consciousness is natural. It is not artificial. From the birth of a man, (he) is Krsna conscious. Artificially he is being cut down, "Forget Krsna." This nonsense dharma should be stopped. Take Krsna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. He is being accepted all over the world. Why not in India? Why you present competitors of Krsna? Don't do this. Take this instruction of Bhagavad-gita, that sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. You will be successful. If you manufacture something, you will never be successful. I tell you. So anyone. The standard is there, the instruction is there, everything is there. Why should we try to manufacture something new? Mahajano yena gatah sa panthah [Cc. Madhya 17.186]. Dharmam tu saksad bhagavat-pranitam [SB 6.3.19]. Dharmasya tattvam nihitam guhayam mahajano yena gatah sa panthah. That is our process. Tarko 'pratisthanam. Simply by argument, you cannot reach the confidential part of dharma. Srutayo vibhinna. And if you study Vedas, that is also..., Sama, Yajur, Rg, Atharva, you will be puzzled. So, nasau munir yasya matam na bhinnam. He is not a philosopher or a muni who cannot give a separate theory.

So these things are going on. Therefore how to know what is the purpose of dharma? That is stated that dharmasya tattvam nihitam guhayam mahajano yena gatah sa panthah [Cc. Madhya 17.186]. Just follow, try to, mahajana. Who can be better mahajana than Krsna? Is there anybody in this world still now better than Krsna, who can give good instruction, more beneficial than Krsna? No. There is not. So take this principle, Bhagavad-gita as it is, the instruction of Gita, instruction of Krsna, and try to follow. It will be successful not only in India, all over the world. That is my practical experience.

Thank you very much. (applause) [break] (end)

 

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Lecture at Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan -- Bombay, October 18, 1973

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18 Oct 68 , Seatle

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Prabhupada: (sings "Govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami **.'') So we are worshiping Govindam, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the original person. So this sound, govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami, is reaching Him. He is hearing. You cannot say that He is not hearing. Can you say? No. Especially in this scientific age, when television, radio messages are broadcast thousands and thousands of miles away, and you can hear, now why can you...? Why Krsna cannot hear your prayer, sincere prayer? How can you say it? Nobody can deny it. So, premanjana-cchurita-bhakti-vilocanena santah sadaiva hrdayesu vilokayanti [Bs. 5.38]. Just like thousands and thousands of miles away you can transfer the television picture or your radio sound, similarly, if you can prepare yourself, then you can see always Govinda. It is not difficult. This is stated in Brahma-samhita, premanjana-cchurita-bhakti-vilocanena. Simply you have to prepare your eyes, your mind in that way. Here is a television box within your heart. This is the perfection of yoga. It is not you have to purchase one machine, or television set. It is there, and God is also there. You can see, you can hear, you can talk, provided you have got the machine. You repair it, that's all. The repairing process is Krsna consciousness. Otherwise, everything is supplied, complete, complete set of machine you have got within you. And just like for repairing, an expert mechanic required, similarly, you require the help of someone expert. Then you'll see that your machine is working. It is not difficult to understand. Nobody can say that it is not possible. In the sastra we hear also. Sadhu sastra, guru vakya, tinete kariya aikya. Spiritual realization can be perfected by three parallel process. Sadhu. Sadhu means saintly persons, who are realized souls, sadhu. And sastra. Sastra means scriptures, authoritative scriptures, Vedic scriptures, sastra. Sadhu, sastra, and guru, a spiritual master. Three parallel line. And if you place your car or vehicle on these three parallel line, your car will go direct to Krsna. Tinete kariya aikya. Just like in the railway line you see two parallel lines. If they are in order, the railway carriages are carried very smoothly to the destination. Here also, there are three parallel lines -- sadhu, sastra, guru: saintly person, association of saintly person, acceptance of bona fide spiritual master, and faith in the scriptures. That's all. Then your carriage will be going nicely, without any disturbance. Sadhu sastra guru vakya, tinete kariya aikya.

So here in the Bhagavad-gita, the Supreme Personality of Godhead explaining Himself, Krsna. So if you say, "How can I believe that Krsna said? Somebody has written in the name of Krsna that 'Krsna said,' 'God said.' " No. This is called disciplic succession. You will see in this book, Bhagavad-gita, Krsna, what Krsna said, and how Arjuna understood. These things are described there. And the sadhu, saintly person, beginning from Vyasadeva, Narada, down to many acaryas, Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya, Visnu Svami, and latest, Lord Caitanya, in this way, they have accepted: "Yes. It is spoken by Krsna." So this is the proof. If saintly persons have accepted... They have not denied. Authorities, they have accepted, "Yes." This is called sadhu. And because sadhu, saintly persons have accepted, therefore it is scripture. That is the test. Just like... It is common sense affair. If the lawyers accept some book, then it is to be understood that this is lawbook. You cannot say that "How can I accept this is law?" The evidence is the lawyers are accepting. Medical... If the medical practitioners accept, then that is authoritative medical. Similarly, if saintly persons are accepting Bhagavad-gita as scripture, you cannot deny it. Sadhu sastra: saintly persons and scriptures, two things, and with spiritual master, three, three parallel lines, who accept the sadhu and the scripture. Sadhu confirms the scriptures and spiritual master accept the scripture. Simple process. So they are not in disagreement. What is spoken in the scripture is accepted by saintly person, and what is spoken in the scripture, the spiritual master explains only that thing. That's all. So via media is the scripture. Just like lawyer and the litigants-via media is the lawbook. Similarly, the spiritual master, the scripture... Saintly person means who confirms the Vedic injunction, who accepts. And scripture means what is accepted by the saintly person. And spiritual master means who follows the scriptures. So things equal to the same thing are equal to one another. This is axiomatic truth. If you have got one hundred dollars, and another man has got hundred dollar, and if I have got hundred dollar, then we are all equal. Similarly, sadhu sastra guru vakya, when these three parallel lines in agreement, then life is success.

So here Krsna is speaking Bhagavad-gita, mayy asakta-manah, about the yoga system. He has already concluded in the Sixth Chapter the yoga system. In the first six chapters it is explained what is the constitutional position of the living entity. There are eighteen chapters in the Bhagavad-gita. The first six chapters explains only the constitutional position of the living entities. And when it is understood... Just like when you understand your actual position, then your activities actually begin. If you do not know what is your actual position... Suppose in the office, if your post is not settled up what duty you have to execute, then you cannot do anything very nicely. Here is a typist, here is clerk, here is a peon, here is a this and that. So they are executing their work very nicely. So one has to understand what is the constitutional position of the living entity. So that is explained in the first six chapters. Adyena sastena upasakasya jivasya svarupa-prapti-sadhanam ca pradhanam nim proktam (?). Baladeva Vidyabhusana, a very nice authorized commentator on the Bhagavad-gita, he says that in the first six chapters the constitutional position of the living entity has been very nicely explained. And how one can understand his constitutional position, that is also explained. So the yoga system means to understand his constitutional position. Yoga indriya-samyamah. We are busy with sense activities. The material life means business of sense activities. The whole world activity, when you go stand on the street, you will see everybody's very busy. The storekeeper is busy, the motor-driver is busy. Everyone is very busy -- so busy that so many accidents in business. Now, why they are busy? If you minutely study what is their business, the business is sense gratification. That's all. Everyone is busy how to gratify senses. This is material. And yoga means to control the senses, to understand my spiritual position, my constitutional position. Just like a boy who is accustomed to playing only, he cannot concentrate in his study, in understanding his future life, or in elevating himself, a higher position. Similarly, if we are engaged like child without knowing the future of life, simply playing with the senses, that is called material life. The difference between material life and spiritual life is that if somebody is simply engaged in sense gratification business, that is called material life. And out of many thousands of such materialistic persons, if somebody is trying to understand, "What I am? Why I have come here? Why I am put into so many miserable condition of life? Is there any remedy...?" these questions, when arises, then, practically, his spiritual life begins. And the human form of life is meant for that. In animal life they do not know anything except sense gratification. They have no power. Their consciousness is not developed. Just like in the Green Lake park, there are so many ducks. As soon as somebody goes there with some little food, oh, they go gather: "quack! quack! quack! quack!" (laughter) That's all. And after eating, they are enjoying sex life. That's all. So, similarly, like cats and dogs and these animals, the human life is also like that if there is no question "What I am?" If they are simply directed by the sense urges, they are no better than these ducks and dogs.

So therefore, in the first six chapters it has been decided that a living entity is a spiritual spark. It is very difficult to find out where the spark is, because it is so small, minute. There is no material microscope or machine to find out. But it is there. It is there. The symptom is, because it is there in my body, because it is there in your body, therefore you are moving, you are talking, you are planning, so many things you are doing -- simply for that spiritual spark. So we are very minute spark of the supreme spirit. Just like there are in the sunshine minute particles, shining particles. With shining, these shining particles, when they are mixed together, that is sunshine. But they are molecules. They are separate, atomic molecules. Similarly, in relationship with God and ourselves, we are also minute particles of God, shining. Shining means we have got the same propensities, thinking, feeling, willing, creating, everything. Whatever you see in yourself, that is there in God. So God cannot be impersonal, because we are all persons. I have got so many propensities -- that is very minute quantity. The same propensities are there in Krsna, or God, but that is very great, unlimited. This is the study of Krsna consciousness. Simply greatness, my position is very small. And we are so small, infinitesimal; still, we have got so many propensities, so many desires, so many activities, so many brain work. Just imagine how much greater brain work and desire and propensities are there in God, because He's great. His greatness means all these things, what you have got, that is existing in Him in greatness. That's all. Qualitatively, we are one, but quantitatively, we are different. He's great; we are small. He is infinite; we are infinitesimal. Therefore the conclusion is, just like infinite particles of fire, sparks, when they are with the fire, they look very nice with fire and sparks. But when the sparks are out of the fire, main fire, they extinguish. No more fire. Similarly, we are sparks of Krsna or God. When we associate with God, then our, that illuminating power, fire, is renovated. Otherwise, we are extinguished. Although you are sparks, our present life, this material life, is covered. The spark is covered, or extinguished almost. This is only example. It cannot be extinguished. If it is extinguished, how we are manifesting our living condition? It is not extinguished, but it is covered. Just like when fire is covered, you'll feel heat on the covering, but you cannot see the fire directly. Similarly, this spiritual spark is covered by his material dress; therefore we cannot see. The doctor says, "Oh, the bodily function has failed; therefore heart has failed. He is dead." But why heart fails he does not know. There is no medical science, calculated. They will say so many reasons, that "Because the blood corpuscles, red corpuscles has ceased to function, it has become white; therefore it is..." No. This is not right answer. The blood can be made red... Or redness is not life. There are many natural product which is red by nature. That does not mean there is life. So this argument, that red corpuscles have ceased; therefore life has ceased -- no. There are so many arguments and counterarguments.

Actually, this is the fact, because we are speaking on the strength of scripture, saintly persons and spiritual master. That is the way of understanding. You cannot manufacture with your teeny brain, imperfect senses. Human being, they're imperfect, always. Just for example, that a child is seeing the sun, and a scientist is seeing the sun. By nature, the child, their knowledge of the sun is imperfect. The same child, when he takes instruction from a scientist, he can understand the sun is so great. Therefore direct perception of knowledge by our the senses is always imperfect. You have to approach authority -- in every sphere of life. Similarly, if you want to understand what is God, then you have to take shelter of this Bhagavad-gita. There is no alternative. You cannot speculate that "God may be like this, God may be like that," "There is no God," "God is dead," "God is not dead." This is simply speculation. Here Krsna says,

mayy asakta-manah partha
yogam yunjan mad-asrayah
asamsayam samagram mam
yatha jnasyasi tac chrnu
 [Bg. 7.1]

If you believe that Krsna, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is speaking personally, as Arjuna believed, then you can understand what is God. Otherwise it is not possible. Asamsayam.

So the process is, the first process is, mayy asakta-manah. You have to constantly engage your mind in Krsna. That is the yoga process, which is, which we are presenting as Krsna consciousness. Krsna consciousness... Just like if you constantly join yourself with the electric powerhouse, there is incessant supply of electric energy. Similarly, if you constantly engage your mind in Krsna, that is also not very difficult. Krsna is all-attractive. Krsna is beautiful. Krsna has so many activities. The whole Vedic literature is full of Krsna's activities. This Bhagavad-gita is full of Krsna's activities. Simply by understanding that God is great, that is neutral state of understanding. But you have to elevate more and more, how great He is. How great He is, it is not possible to understand, because our senses are always imperfect. But as far as possible you can hear about the activities of God, about the position of God, and you can think over it, and you can make your judgment, you can put your argument. Then you will understand without any doubt what is God. The first beginning is, mayy asakta-manah. In the last chapter Krsna has explained that one who is constantly absorbed in the thought of Krsna, he is first-class yogi, first-class yogi. In your country the yoga system is very popular, but you do not know who is a first-class yogi. The first-class yogi (is) explained in the Bhagavad-gita: yoginam api sarvesam mad-gatenantaratmana [Bg. 6.47], that out of many, many thousands of yogis, the yogi or bhakta-yogi who is always seeing within himself, within his heart, the form of Krsna, he's first-class yogi, he's first class.

So you have to continue that first-class yoga system, and that is explained here, mayy asakta-manah: being attached. Mind is the vehicle for being attached. If you are attached to somebody, some boy, some girl, some person... Generally, we become attached to a person. Impersonal attachment is bogus thing. If you want to be attached, that attachment must be personal. Is it not a fact? Impersonal attachment... You cannot love the sky, but you can love the sun, you can love the moon, you can love the stars, because they are localized person. And if you want to love the sky, it is very difficult for you. You have to come again to this sun. So yoga system, culminating in perfection, in love... So you have to love somebody, person. That is Krsna. Just like here is a picture. Radharani is loving Krsna and offering His (Her) flowers to Krsna, and Krsna is playing with His flute. So you can think of this picture nicely, always. Then you (will) become constantly in yoga, samadhi. Why impersonal? Why you something, something void? Void cannot be. If you think something void, there will be something light, something color, colorful, so many things we will find. But that is also form. How you can avoid form? That is not possible. Therefore why don't you concentrate your mind to the real form, isvarah paramah krsnah sac-cid-ananda-vigrahah [Bs. 5.1], the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the controller, the supreme controller, who has got a body? How? Vigrahah, vigrahah means body. And what sort of body? Sac-cid-ananda, eternal body, full of bliss, full of knowledge. That body. Not like body like this. This body is full of ignorance, full of miseries, and not eternal. Just opposite. His body is eternal; my body is not eternal. His body is full of bliss; my body is full of miseries, always something troubling me -- headache, toothache, this ache, that ache. Somebody is, has given me personal trouble. So many... Adhyatmic, adhibhautic, severe heat, severe cold, so many things. This body is always under threefold miseries, this material body.

So if you think of Krsna, that is the process, Krsna consciousness. Then mayy asakta-manah partha yogam yunjan mad-asrayah, if you practice this yoga system, Krsna consciousness, how? Mad-asrayah. Mad-asrayah means "taking shelter of somebody who is in touch with Me." Mad-asrayah. Mad-asrayah means directly in touch with Him. Directly you are in touch with Him as soon as you think of Him, His form. But unless you take shelter of a spiritual master who knows about Him, you cannot concentrate for a long time. It may be temporary. Therefore you have to hear from a person who knows about Krsna. Then your concentration of mind on Krsna will continue. You have to act according to his direction everything. Your life should be molded in such a way under the direction of the spiritual master. Then you can continue this yoga system perfectly. What is that yoga system? That yoga system explained in the Bhagavad-gita, in the Sixth Chapter, last verse. Yoginam api sarvesam mad-gatenantaratmana: [Bg. 6.47] "One who is always thinking of Me," mad-gata, "He is first-class yogi." In many places it is stated. Premanjana-cchurita. How you can think of Krsna unless you develop love for Krsna? Just like Radharani. Radharani, She has come. She was married, and household life, but She has come to Krsna to worship Him. Similarly, we have to place Krsna always in our mind, think of Him. Then this very process, mayy asakta-manah partha yogam yunjan mad-asrayah, "Under the protection of Myself, of My representative, when you understand samagram, perfectly well, then your life is successful." Asamsayam: "without any doubt." Not that because your spiritual master says that "Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead." No. If you have got any doubt, just question, just try to understand. It is a fact that He's the Supreme Personality of Godhead, undoubtedly. But if you have got some doubt, you can clear it. Asamsayam. In this way, if you practice this yoga system, Krsna consciousness, the topmost of all the yoga systems, asamsayam samagram mam yatha jnasyasi [Bg. 7.1], then you'll understand Krsna, or the Supreme Personality of Godhead, perfectly well, without any doubt, and your life will be successful.

Thank you. (devotees offer obeisances) Any question?

 

Jaya-gopala: What is the difference between bhava and prema?

Prabhupada: Prema is mature condition of bhava. Just like a ripe mango and green mango. Green mango is the cause of ripe mango. But to taste ripe mango is better than unripe mango. Similarly, before attaining love of Godhead, you have got different stages. Just like the same mango, it passes through different stages, then one day it comes nice yellow color, fully ripened, and taste is so nice. The same mango. The mango does not change, but it comes to the mature stage. So this... As this example, the mango is in the beginning a flower, then gradually a little fruit. Then gradually it grows. Then it becomes very tight, green, and then, gradually, it becomes little, little yellowish, and it becomes fully ripe. This is the process of everything. In material world also, there are six processes, and the last process is vanquish.

This mango example or any other material example, we can accept it so far the growth is required, concerned, but material example is not perfect. Just like mango, when it is ripe, somebody eats, that's all right. Otherwise it will overripe, it will decompose, it will fall down, and finish. That is material. But spiritual is not like that. It is not finished. If you once come to the stage of mature stage of love, then that perfectional stage continues eternally, and your life is successful. Prema pum-artho mahan. There are many different types of perfection in this material world. Somebody is thinking, "This is perfection of life." Materialists, they are thinking, "If I can enjoy my senses very nicely, that is perfection of life." That is their point of view. And when they are frustrated, they find out, or try to find out, something better. So if he's not guided, something better means the same -- sex and intoxication. That's all. Simply becomes irresponsible. That's all. Because there is no guide. He's finding out, searching out something better, but because there is no guide, he comes to the same sense or sex and intoxication -- to forget. A businessman, when he's failure, so much disturbance. He tries to forget him by drinking. But this is artificial way. This is not actually the remedy. How long you can forget? Sleep -- how long you can sleep? Again wake up, again you are in the same position. That is not the way. But if you come to the stage of love of Godhead, then naturally you forget all this nonsense. Naturally. Param drstva nivartate [Bg. 9.59]. If you find out something more palatable, more relishable, you give up nonsense things which is not so nice to taste.

So Krsna consciousness is such a thing. It is leading you to a standard where going you will forget all this nonsense. That is real life. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma [Bg. 18.54]. As soon as you come that state, then your symptom will be that you are jolly. You are feeling everywhere. There is a... There are many instances. So when you accept this material world in relationship with Krsna, you'll taste that love of Godhead, even in this material world. Actually, material world means completely in forgetfulness of God, or Krsna. That is material world. Otherwise, if you are in full consciousness of Krsna, you'll find only spiritual world, even in this material world. Consciousness -- it is all consciousness. The same example. Just like the king and the bug is sitting on the same throne, but the bug knows that "My business is simply to get some blood." That's all. The king knows that "I have to rule. I am the ruler of this country." So sitting on the same place, but the consciousness is different. Similarly, if you change your consciousness to Krsna consciousness, wherever you are, you are in Vaikuntha. Wherever, it doesn't matter. Yes?

Guest: I would like you to explain the origin and significance of what you, what they call the Jagannatha car festival.

Prabhupada: Jagannatha festival significance is that when Krsna left Vrndavana... Krsna was raised by His foster father, Nanda Maharaja. But when He was grown up, 16 years old, He was taken away by His real father, Vasudeva, and They left Vrndavana, Krsna and Balarama, two brothers, and They were resident..., Their kingdom was in Dvaraka. So in Kuruksetra -- Kuruksetra is always dharma-ksetra, pilgrimage -- there was some lunar, solar eclipse, and many persons from many parts of India, they came to take bath. Similarly, Krsna and Balarama and Their sister Subhadra, They also came in royal fashion, with so many soldiers, and so many..., just like king. So these residents of Vrndavana, they met Krsna, and especially the gopis, they saw Krsna, and they lamented that "Krsna, You are here, we are also here, but the place is different. We are not in Vrndavana." So there is a long story how they lamented and how Krsna pacified them. This is a feeling of separation, how the inhabitants of Vrndavana felt separation from Krsna. So this... When Krsna came on chariot, that is called Ratha-yatra. This is the history of Ratha-yatra. So any pastimes made by Krsna, that is observed in ceremonial form by the devotees. So that is Ratha-yatra.

Guest: How may we recognize yogamaya?

Prabhupada: I do not know what is your question.

Tamala Krsna: He wants to know how we may recognize yogamaya, how we may know.

Prabhupada: Yogamaya? Yogamaya means that which connects you. Yoga means connection. When you are being gradually advanced in Krsna consciousness, that is the action of yogamaya. And when you are gradually forgetting Krsna, that is the action of mahamaya. Maya is acting upon you. The one is dragging you, and one is pushing you opposite way. Yogamaya. So, just like the example, that you are always under the laws of government. You cannot deny. If you say, "I don't agree to abide by the laws of government," that is not possible. But when you are a criminal, you are under the police laws, and when you are gentleman, you are under the civil laws. The laws are there. In any situation, you have to obey the laws of government. If you remain as a civilized citizen, then you are always protected by the civil law. But as soon as you are against the state, the criminal law will act upon you. So the criminal activities of law is mahamaya, threefold miseries, always. Always putting in some sort of misery. And the civil department of Krsna, anandambudhi-vardhanam. You simply go on increasing the, I mean to say, depth of the ocean of joy. Anandambudhi-vardhanam. That is the difference, yogamaya and mahamaya. Yogamaya is... Yogamaya, the original yogamaya, is Krsna's internal potency. That is Radharani. And mahamaya is external potency, Durga. This Durga is explained in Brahma-samhita, srsti-sthiti-pralaya-sadhana-saktir eka chayeva yasya bhuvanani bibharti durga [Bs. 5.44]. Durga is the superintending goddess of this whole material world. Everything is going on under his, under her control. Prakrti, prakrti is energy. Energy is accepted as feminine. Just like these materialistic persons, they are also working under some energy. What is that energy? The sex life. That's all. They're troubling so much: "Oh, at night I'll have sex life." That's all. That is the energy. Yan maithunadi-grhamedhi-sukham hi tuccham [SB 7.9.45]. Their life is based on the sex. That's all. Everyone is working so hard, culminating in sex. That's all. This is material life. So energy. The material energy means sex. So that is energy. If a person who is working in the factory, if you stop sex, he cannot work. And when he's unable to enjoy sex life, then he takes intoxication. This is material life. So energy must be there. Here in the material world the energy is sex, and in the spiritual world the energy is love. Here the love is misrepresented in sex. That is not love; that is lust. Love is only possible with Krsna, nowhere else. Nowhere else love is possible. That is misrepresentation of love. That is lust. So love and lust. Love is yogamaya, and lust is mahamaya. That's all. (long pause) Is that all right?

Tamala Krsna: Oh, yeah. (soft laughter)

Prabhupada: So, any other question?

Jahnava: Christ consciousness and Krsna consciousness, the words are so similar. Please combine the words, explain how the words came to us.

Prabhupada: That I've explained many times: a pocket dictionary and international dictionary. You cannot say that pocket dictionary is no dictionary, but it is meant for a certain class of student. And international dictionary is meant for a certain class of student. They are all student. Was Christ... What was spoken by Christ, that is also God consciousness, but that was meant for a certain class of men. And what class of men they were? They're not even perfectly civilized. Because Christ was explaining God consciousness, that was his fault, and they crucified him. What class of men they were? Judge. His only fault was that he was explaining God, and they crucified him. The reward was crucifixion. So what kind of class of men they were? The status of that society, just try to understand. Therefore what spoke..., what was spoken by Lord Jesus Christ, for them, that was sufficient. But when Bhagavad-gita is spoken to a person like Arjuna, that is different thing. So we have to speak according to the time, according to the circumstances, according to the audience. Don't you see that here only a few persons are attending? Why? They cannot understand this Krsna science, Krsna consciousness. It is not meant for all classes of men. It is highest standard of God consciousness. Love. Love of God. So there is also teachings of love of God, undoubtedly. That is the difference. The same thing. Always try to understand. The small pocket dictionary for students while in the primary stage, and international dictionary for higher students, postgraduate students -- the both of them are dictionaries. But it is meant for somebody, it is meant for somebody. And the test is phalena pariciyate. Phalena pariciyate, you have to understand. Suppose you are traveling in a forest. So many trees are there. But you cannot understand what is this tree, what is that. But as soon as you see the flower, "Oh, here is apple. Oh, this is apple tree." Just like the other day you were telling me, you never saw apple tree? Yes. Now, as soon as you saw the apple, you understood, "This is apple tree. Oh!" The test of any scripture is how one is developing love of God. Phalena pariciyate. If you find that following some religious principles you are developing your love of God, then it is perfect. It doesn't matter whether it is Bible or Koran or Bhagavad-gita. It doesn't matter. We have to see what is the fruit. If the fruit is that people are developing love of Godhead, then it is perfect. Don't try to understand whether this is good, this is good, this is bad, this is... No. Try to understand by the result. Just like the same way: if you see the fruit, then it is first class. So it doesn't matter whether it is Bible or Gita. If you can develop love of Godhead by reading Bible, it is first class, and if you can develop love of Godhead by Bhagavad-gita, it is first class. And if you do not, then either it is Bible or the Koran or Bhagavad-gita, it has no effect for you. So it is up to you. Not by comparison, but by your own activities. If you actually follow the instruction given by Lord Jesus Christ, you will also develop love of Godhead. There is no doubt. Similarly, if you follow the instruction of Krsna, you will also develop. So it is up to you. You try to follow. If you do not follow, simply try to make a comparative study "This is good" or "This is bad," "This is bad" or "This is good," that is called srama eva hi kevalam [SB 1.2.8] -- simply laboring. Why comparative study? Just see how much you are developing love of Godhead, that's all. Phalena pariciyate. "Whether it is apple is there, that's all right; never mind what is this tree. I'm concerned with the apple." Yes.

Upendra: Prabhupada, sometimes there may be differences between what is love of Godhead between Christian and Moslem, Moslem and Buddhist, Buddhist, Hindu. They may quarrel at what is love of Godhead.

Prabhupada: The quarrel, they, those who are not in love of Godhead, they must quarrel. That is the... Because they are cats and dogs. You cannot expect any peaceful condition between cats and dogs. They will fight. So whatever they may be, so long they are fighting, that means they are not on the perfectional stage. Where is the fighting? If you love God, then you love everyone. That is the sign. Samah sarvesu bhutesu mad-bhaktim labhate param [Bg. 18.54]. After attaining the stage of equality, then you can enter into the realm of loving God. Before that, you have to pass. Just like before entering law college you have to become graduate, similarly, before entering the realm of devotional service you have to realize that all living entities are on the same platform. That is realization. You cannot make any distinction that "This is lower," "This is higher." No. Panditah sama-darsinah [Bg. 5.18]. When a person is fully learned, he does not make any distinction that "He is human being, he is cow, he is dog." He sees that he is spirit soul covered in different dress. That's all. That is his vision, universal equality vision. You cannot say that dog has no life, the cow has no life. How can you say that there is no life? That is lack of your knowledge. What is the symptom of life? You will find the symptom of life is there in human being, in ant also. How you can say that small creatures, lower animals have no life? That is lack of your knowledge. Even trees, plants, they have got life. So perfect knowledge required. So love of Godhead on the basis of perfect knowledge is real love of God. Otherwise it is fanaticism. So the fanatics, they may fight. That is not love of Godhead. (pause) Of course, it is very difficult to come to that stage, but one should try. That is Krsna consciousness. We are all student. We are trying. But there are degrees also. Just like in a educational institution there is tenth class, eighth class, fifth class, sixth class. And with the yoga, it is just like a staircase or a lift. So there are different stages of perfection. The highest perfection is who is always thinking of Krsna. That is yoginam api sarvesam mad-gatenantaratmana sraddhavan bhajate... [Bg. 6.47]. The highest perfectional is Krsna, thinking always Krsna, and Radharani. That is the highest perfectional stage. She has no other business: simply thinking of Krsna.

Visnujana: While we are chanting our rounds, or while we are chanting out loud in kirtana, is it all right to be engaging our mind in thinking?

Prabhupada: Is it not?

Visnujana: He is already (indistinct).

Prabhupada: This is practical way? (laughter) If you are not minding, the chanting will force you to mind upon Him. You see? Krsna sound will by force. Chanting is so nice. And this is the practical yoga in this age. You cannot meditate. Your mind is so disturbed, you cannot concentrate your mind. Therefore chant, and by the sound vibration, it will forcibly enter it into your mind. Even if you don't want Krsna, Krsna will enter within your mind. By force. (laughter) This is the easiest process. You don't require to endeavor. Krsna is coming. (laughter) (Prabhupada laughs) It is very nice process. This is recommended therefore, for this age. And others also will be benefited. You chant loudly. Others who are not accustomed, they will also. At least... Just like on the street, in the park, they say "Hare Krsna!" How they have learned? By hearing this chanting. That's all. Sometimes the children, as soon as they see us, they say "Oh, Hare Krsna!" In Montreal the children, when I was walking on the street, all the children, the shopkeepers, the storekeepers, they will say "Hare Krsna!" And that's all. So we have forced Hare Krsna within the mind. If you practice yoga, meditate, it may be beneficial for you, but this is beneficial for many others. Suppose something very good, you are enjoying yourself, some sweetballs -- that is one stage. But if you distribute sweetballs, that is another stage. So by chanting on the road, on the street, you are distributing sweetballs. (laughter) You are not miser, that you are eating yourself. You are so liberal that you are distributing to others. Now chant, distribute. (laughter) (kirtana) (end)

 

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Lecture -- Seattle, October 18, 1968

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Demons' Symptoms 75/10/18 South Africa, Bhagavad-gita 16.6

Demons' Symptoms

75/10/18 South Africa, Bhagavad-gita 16.6



Srila A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada



Prabhupada:

dvau bhuta-sargau loke 'smin
daiva asura eva ca
daivo vistarasah prokta
asuram partha me srnu
[Bg. 16.6]

There are two classes of men throughout the whole universe. One class is called daiva and the other class is called asura. Daiva asura eva ca. Daivo vistarasah proktah. So far the devas are concerned, Krsna has explained in various ways in the last chapters, ahimsa, ksanti, arjavam, how to practice this things. So visnu-bhakto bhaved devah asuras tad-viparyayah. These two classes, how they are ascertained? One who is a devotee of the Supreme Lord Visnu, they are called deva, or demigods, and persons who know Visnu or may not know -- on the whole, they are not devotees of Visnu -- even they are devotee of other demigods, they are called asura. Just like Ravana. Ravana, he was a great devotee of Lord Siva, but he is described as asura, raksasa. Similarly, Hiranyakasipu was a great devotee of Lord Brahma; still, he is accepted as raksasa. So unless one is Vaisnava or devotee of the Lord Visnu, he is asura or raksasa. This is the instruction of the sastra.

In modern days also, practically nobody is devotee, so how they are described in the Bhagavad-gita? They are described as duskrtinah, mudhah, naradhamah, mayayapahrta-jnanah, asuram bhavam asritah [Bg. 7.15]. These asuras also divided into so many classes. The first-class asura is the duskrtina, one who is engaged in sinful meritorious action. Sinful meritorious. Just like a big thief. There are many organization of smugglers, black market, thieves. They have got brain to organize. Without brain they cannot organize. Now, in the Western countries there are big, big organizations simply for smuggling, cheating, bluffing, and very good brain, educated, lawyers. I have seen practically in New York these cheating concerns. There are many lawyers to help them how to cheat. And they make arrangement, take money from one, cheating. Many organizations. So they are called duskrtina. They are educated. They have got good brain, they can act very nicely, but their intelligence is being used for sinful activities. They are called duskrtina. They do not know how they shall use their brain. That is going on.

That is jada-vidya, mayar vaibhava. They can expand the influence of maya. We are already influenced by maya. Prakrtim mohinim sritah. We have taken this material world as very fascinating, very attractive. We want to stay here and enjoy. This is material life. Everyone who is attracted to the material world, they are sinful or fallen. Krsna-bahirmukha hana bhoga vancha kare. The, our material life begins... We are spirit soul. When our material life...? When we try to deny, try to not serve Krsna but independently we want to enjoy life, that is called material life. Independently we want to enjoy without Krsna, without God. That is called material life. So such persons are called demons.

So the symptoms of demon... Krsna says, daivo vistarasah proktah: "I have already spoken elaborately about the persons who are daiva, who are on the platform of demigods. Now..." Prokta asuram partha me srnu: "Now I am describing who are the asuras. Just try to understand." The first symptoms of asura is, it is said,

pravrttim ca nivrttim ca
jana na vidur asurah
na saucam napi cacaro
na satyam tesu vidyate
[Bg. 16.7]

Very nicely described. The first symptom is pravrtti and nivrtti. Why we are in this material world, when it has begun -- that the asuras do not know. Sometimes they ask that "Why we have come to this material world? We are suffering, we can understand." Or sometimes they say, "God is unjust, unkind, that they have created this material world and we have been put into it," so on, so on. But actually this pravrtti, this intention or this purpose of enjoying this material world, is not given to you by God. We have created. God's desire is that you become a devotee. Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. That is God's desire. But you don't want it.

We don't want to stop the tendency of material enjoyment. No nivrtti. The human life is meant for nivrtti. The cats' and dogs' life is for pravrtti. The sex desire, they cannot stop it. It is not possible. If you teach some dogs that "You forget the sex life," it is impossible. That is not possible. So they cannot stop this desire of sex life. But if a human being can be induced... Therefore there is brahmacarya system, there is Vedic education, there is Bhagavad-gita, so many other things. If people take advantage of these books they can stop this pravrtti, this intense desire for enjoying this material world. But the asuras, they do not know that what we should accept and what we should not accept. Pravrtti means to accept something, and nivrtti means to deny something. So they do not know. This is the first symptom of the asuras. Pravrttim ca nivrttim ca na viduh. Pravrttim ca nivrttim ca jana na vidur asurah, asurah janah [Bg. 16.7], those who are demons, asuras, they do not know it.

Then next symptom? Na saucam: They are very unclean. These things you will find nowadays everywhere, all over the world. They are not clean. The cleanliness is next to godliness. To rise early in the morning and cleanse yourself, evacuate, then take bath, cleanse your teeth, cleanse your hands, legs, and be refreshed, that is required. Saucam. Suci. This is the brahmana's business. Just like brahmana's another name is suci. And one who does not observe the cleanliness process, he is called muci, means cobbler. So this is the symptom, that the asuras, they do not know which way is their goal of life. Na saucam: "They are very unclean." Na saucam.
Napi ca acarah: "They do not know etiquette." Acara. Acara means one should learn how to behave. That makes a gentleman and a rough person. Napi cacarah. Acarah means... Acaryavan puruso veda. Acarah, this is... Acarah means he learns from the sastra how we should live, that, preliminary, that you must take bath, you must wash your hands after eating or you must take bath after evacuating. So many things are there. Nitya-karma-vidhi. In the Vedic literature you find all these directions, but now they have given up. Especially Vedic culture was there long, long ago all over the world. But now that is finished. Now in India, also, where little Vedic principles were still glowing, that is now being finished also. Napi ca acarah. They are learning from the Westerns how to remain unclean, how to eat meat, how to drink wine, and so on, so on, so many things.

Napi cacaro na satyam tesu vidyate. And they do not know what is truth or what is truthfulness. Or, in other words, everyone is liar. I have seen many big, big gentlemen that for nothing they will speak lies, for nothing, without any profit. They will speak so many lies. Na satyam tesu vidyate. To become truthful is one of the brahminical qualifications. Satyam. That is required. But the asuras, they don't care for. They will go on, telling lies, volumes of lies. They don't mind for it. These are the symptoms. Na saucam napi cacaro na satyam tesu. And their life is aimless, not actual life. Real life means with aim. The asuras, they have no aim. They do not know what is the aim, neither they follow. Then? Other symptom?

asatyam apratistham te
jagad ahur anisvaram
aparaspara-sambhutam
kim anyat kama-haitukam
[Bg. 16.8]

Their other philosophy is that there is no God. Jagad ahur anisvaram [Bg. 16.8]. As soon as you say that "God has created the cosmic material world, the sky. God has created," they will laugh at you "Ha, God has created. Why you bring God?" Someone was telling me that in some scientific conference they first of all warn that "Don't bring God in any of your statements." What is that? Do you know? So these asuras, their first business is how to convince people that everything has taken place by accident or by combination of matter. There is no question of accepted God, the creator. That's all. What is that?

Devotee: This one I'm offering to you. (?)

Prabhupada: So asatyam apratistham. And the so-called sannyasi, because they are atheist, they say that asatyam: "This material world is maya. It has no truth. What you are seeing, it is illusion." Asatyam. But we do not say like that. We say as we learn from Bhagavad-gita, we say that Krsna says, bhumir apo 'nalo vayuh kham mano buddhir eva ca bhinna me prakrtir astadha [Bg. 7.4]. Krsna says, "They are My prakrti, My energy." Bhumir apah analah. So because it is Krsna's prakrti...

Just like I am a person. I can create something very good, and I can create something not very good. But I can create something not very good... Just like another practical example. I cook something and some of the preparation, people say, "Oh, it is very good," and some of the preparation, they say, "It is not so good, but it is nice." But you cannot say any of the things as mithya. That you cannot say. You are practically eating, and somebody has prepared it, so how you can say it is mithya, it is false? No. That is not our version. You can say... That is also according to taste. You like some sour things; another likes some sweet things. So the person who likes sour things, he says, "Oh, it is very nice." And one who likes sweet things, he may say, "No, it is not so good. This is very nice, the sweet." But either the sour or the sweet thing is prepared by the same cook. You cannot say it is false. It is the energy of the same cook, so you cannot say it is false.

So it is a false... When the Mayavadi sannyasis say that jagan mithya, Jagad ahur anisvaram [Bg. 16.8], "There is no God..." The Bauddha philosophers, they say that "This jagat, this world, has come into existence by combination of matter." The modern scientists also say. They say that "Chemical evolution, by combination of chemicals, everything has come out, but there is no creator." They will deny this. This is the symptom of the asura. So from this instruction you can understand who is a rascal and asura. As soon as they say that "There is no God. The world is created by chance. By chance..." Aparaspara-bhutam. Aparaspara: "One thing mixed with another thing..."

How the example? The example is kim anyat kama-haitukam. Just like a man and woman, by chance they become lusty and have sex, and the woman becomes pregnant, and the child is coming, just like this is a creation, accidentally, accident. The man or woman becomes lusty accidentally, and there is sex and therefore the creation of the child. This is their theory, not that "This child is a living entity, and he is coming from his last birth, and he's taking particular type of body according to his last birth," no conclusion like that. "God is the judge what kind of body he should get." Daiva-netrena.

Karmana daiva-netrena [SB 3.31.1]. There are so many things behind this child's birth. Why this child is coming to a poor father or rich father if it is accident? Why one child is suffering, one is not, is very comfortable position? So there is behind so many things, but they do not know. Because they are asura, they think, "It is accident" or "there is no life. Kill it. If you feel botheration then kill it. Finish this business." These are the asuric conclusion. Jagad ahur... asatyam apratistham. This is false. They say that jagan mithya, "So we have nothing to do." Brahma satyam and... Brahman is satya, that's fact, but we say, we Vaisnavas say, that "The jagat is created by Brahman. How it is false? How the satya can create asatya?" This logic they cannot understand. If the man who has created, who has cooked so many nice things, so if he is a fact, then the cooking is also a fact. How you can say the cooking is false? That is not knowledge.

Therefore sometimes we find that although they say it is mithya, jagan mithya, and take sannyasa and for some days they remain meditation or aloof from any worldly affairs, but later on, when they do not find Brahman, they come again to this maya to open hospitals, schools, as sannyasi. Just like in our country there are many. The beginning we see that... Vivekananda Swami, he took sannyasa and meditation. Later on, after his touring in the Western countries, he came to India to open hospitals, schools, like that. But if the world is false, then why you are coming to open school and hospitals? Because they could not get... And some other sannyasi also, he is now taking part in politics. If jagat is mithya, why you are taking part in politics? These question are there.

Actually they do not know what is what, what is the adjustment. But our philosophy, Vaisnava philosophy, we don't say that "There is no God" or "This world is created by accident or combination of matter." We don't say that. We say that God is the creator. Not we say, but the Vedanta says. The essence of Vedic knowledge, Vedanta philosophy, Vyasadeva, he says that janmady asya yatah: [SB 1.1.1] "The source of janma or creation, the maintenance and annihilation, the source..." Where it is? Yato va imani bhutani jayante. This is Vedic information. That is Brahman, wherefrom everything is coming. The same thing is said in the Vedanta-sutra. Janmady asya yatah [SB 1.1.1]. Athato brahma jijnasa.

So janmady asya yatah, that is explained in the Srimad-Bhagavatam. What is that janmady asya yatah, the original source of everything? What is that? It is a matter or a living being? But the two things, we have got experience. We see that everything is coming... Suppose this microphone, it has come from matter and... Actually it has not come from matter, it has come from the living being who has manufactured it. But we foolishly concluding that it is a combination of matter. Who has combined this matter to make it usable? So this is less knowledge, that this is combination of several parts of material things and it is working. But who has manufactured those different parts of the electronics and other things? It has not come out all of a sudden from the sky. It has been manufactured by some living entity. So this is knowledge.

So janmady asya yatah [SB 1.1.1], the atheist class, the so-called scientists, asuras, they say it is a chemical combination, by accident. We don't say like that. We say the janmady asya, the original source of everything, is a person. Janmady asya yatah anvayad itaratas ca arthesu abhijnah [SB 1.1.1]. Just like this microphone, if I say accidentally all the material things, electronics parts, mixed together and became a micro... No, we don't say that. We say, "This is manufactured by somebody who is very expert in dealing with these parts." That is our knowledge. Janmady asya yatah anvayad itaratas carthesu abhijnah. The person who has mixed together these different parts is very expert, abhijnah. That is right conclusion. And if you, as a rascal, if you say that "All of a sudden the material parts -- there are many parts -- they became assembled; just like one lusty man becomes accidentally lusty desire and the woman also becomes, they unite," it is not like that. It is not accident. There is brain. So every creation has got a brain behind it. Therefore it is said, abhijnah. Janmady asya yatah anvayad itaratas carthesu abhijnah [SB 1.1.1]. That abhijnah is God, Krsna, one who knows things, how to do it. So in this way, if we study that the asuras, their symptoms are described... So asuras are condemned. They cannot have any happiness. They'll simply go on theorizing. There is no solution, so one has to become deva. Visnu-bhakto bhaved devah. If we remain asuras, rascals, then our life is spoiled. Thank you very much. [break]

Devotee (1): These qualities that you were talking about, saucam, do they develop naturally?

Prabhupada: If you practice as they are described in the sastra, then gradually you become released from the asura stage and come to the deva stage. Then you understand everything rightly. And if you keep yourself as asuras, then you will never be happy.

Pusta Krsna: The statement here is that the material world is founded on lust. This is the asuric conception. So everything...

Prabhupada: The Sankhya philosophy is also like that.

Pusta Krsna: Yes. So this lust... The godly qualities, they come from Krsna.

Prabhupada: Everything comes from Krsna.

Pusta Krsna: Even the demoniac qualities?

Prabhupada: Oh, yes. Krsna is the origin of everything. Aham sarvasya prabhavah [Bg. 10.8]. When Krsna says, "I am the origin of everything," so the demonic quality is also coming from Krsna. Ye yatha mam prapadyante [Bg. 4.11]. If you want to become a demon, Krsna will supply the quality. You become first-class demon. Without Krsna's help you cannot become even demon. It is said, sarvasya caham hrdi sannivistah: [Bg. 15.15] "I am situated in everyone's heart." Sarvasya caham hrdi sannivistah. (aside:) What did you get by, while I speaking, taking photograph? I repeatedly ask you. You are obstinate.

Bhargava: Pardon?

Prabhupada: What do you get, special feature, when I talk? You take photograph?

Bhargava: I asked the other day if I could take during...

Prabhupada: Not during while I am talking. You don't take. That disturbs me. My attention goes to your photograph. It is very much disturbing.

So Krsna is the origin of everything. So in the sastra it is described just like my front portion and my back portion. So the back portion is also my bodily part, and the front portion is also my bodily part. So asuric propensities and irreligious things, they are just like Krsna's back portion, darkness, that this darkness, material energy, is called mama maya. The material energy is keeping everyone in darkness. But Krsna says, daivi hy esa gunamayi mama maya [Bg. 7.14]. So this... The darkness is another side of the light. Because there is light there is darkness. Darkness there is no independently. You can understand darkness because there is light. So light and darkness, they are simultaneously there, and everything is janmady asya yatah; [SB 1.1.1] everything's source is Krsna.

So, but Krsna... The darkness cannot act on Krsna. It acts on you. That is the difference. Just like we have discussed this verse, apasyat purusam purnam mayam ca tad-apasrayam. The sunlight... You just stand before the sun, facing the sun. Immediately there is darkness behind me. So darkness is there. But when you keep sun in your front there is no darkness. So darkness is also another creation of the light. But we are put into the darkness, the sun is not put into the darkness. The darkness behind me is captivating for me, not to the sun. So those who are devotees, those who are facing the sun, Krsna, for them there is no darkness. But those who are asuras, they are put into the darkness. So darkness is temporary, and it is dependent on light. Therefore it is creation of Krsna. That is the conclusion.

Pusta Krsna: When Krsna steals or does anything, we glorify it because He is absolute. So the Mayavadis, they say that the living entities are also absolute. Is that correct?

Prabhupada: No. That is a wrong theory. If Mayavadi is absolute..., jiva is absolute, then why they have become conditioned? Why? What is the answer?

Pusta Krsna: They are dependent on some higher absolute.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Devotee (2): Srila Prabhupada, is it possible for one person to be part demon and part devotee in the same person?

Prabhupada: If he's a devotee, he's not demon at all, if he's devotee.

Devotee (2): But he may have some demoniac qualities?

Prabhupada: Yes. That, if he is seriously devotee, that demonic qualities will disappear very soon. Ksipram bhavati dharmatma. Api cet su-duracaro bhajate mam ananya-bhak sadhur eva sa mantavyah [Bg. 9.30], ksipram bhavati dharmatma. Just like electric fan is moving, and you make the switch off. Still you will find, it is moving. But that movement will stop very soon because switch is off. Similarly, a devotee, if it is sometimes found that he is demonic, that demonic, if he is sincerely a devotee, that demonic qualities will go very soon.

ksipram bhavati dharmatma
sasvac-chantim nigacchati
kaunteya pratijanihi
na me bhaktah pranasyati
[Bg. 9.31]

So if one is strongly a devotee, then, gradually -- it may take little time -- all good qualities will be manifest in his body. So, any other question?

Devotee (3): Srila Prabhupada, does Krsna know that He's sitting in everyone's heart?

Prabhupada: Huh?

Devotee (3): Does he know when... "The Supreme Lord sits in anyone's heart, O Arjuna, and He's directing the wandering of all living entities." Does He know when the living entities are going to surrender unto Him?

Prabhupada: So?

Pusta Krsna: The question is: if Krsna is sitting in everyone's heart and He knows the wanderings of all living entities -- He's directing the wandering of all living entities -- then does Krsna know the time, or does He direct the living entity at some certain time to surrender or is this the will of the living entity?

Prabhupada: He knows. Yes, He knows. What is your...? Is there any doubt?

Devotee (3): No, it wasn't a doubt, but...

Prabhupada: So what is the time He knows, do you know that? He knows that he will surrender, but when he will surrender... Then? That question must be there. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gita. Mam eva ye prapadyante mayam etam taranti te [Bg. 7.14]. He knows that "He'll be happy provided he surrenders unto Me, otherwise not." That He knows also. Is it all right? He knows that "As soon as he is surrendered unto Me he'll be free from the clutches of maya," and He knows it also, "If he does not know do so, then he'll never be free from maya." Both things He knows. Is it clear or not?

Pusta Krsna: But it's the living entity's choice to surrender.

Prabhupada: Yes. He knows everything.

Pusta Krsna: But then they give the argument, "If He knows, then how does the living entity have choice?"

Prabhupada: Yes, that is given to him. He knows that "I have given him the independence," so you can use your choice. That He knows also. Yathecchasi tatha kuru [Bg. 18.63]. He knows.

Pusta Krsna: This is understanding things in proper light.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Devotee (3): See, the argument could come that "If He is directing the wanderings of all living entities then I don't have to worry about surrendering. He will direct me to it."

Prabhupada: Yes. But ye yatha mam prapadyante [Bg. 4.11]. Why don't you see other verse? He is directing according to your desire -- unless you surrender. There are two kinds of direction. One kind of direction is when you do not surrender, and one kind of direction, when you have surrendered, because these things are there. My position is either surrender or not surrender. So the not surrender will get one kind of direction and the surrender will get another kind of direction. Both ways, there is direction. Without His direction he cannot act. Is it clear or not? He gives direction to both of them, but this both, one who is surrendered is a different person from the person who is surrendered. So they, both of them, get different direction in different position, but without His direction he cannot act, either the surrendered or not the surrendered. He has to give direction. So if you think, "My Lord, send me to the hell. I will be very much satisfied," "All right, you go to hell in this way. This is the path." And if you say "My lord, kindly take me to Your shelter," then He will give you direction, "You come in this way."

tesam satata-yuktanam
bhajatam priti-purvakam
dadami buddhi-yogam tam
yena mam upayanti te
[Bg. 10.10]

He says, tesam satata-yuktanam. Anyone who is twenty-four hours engaged in serving the Lord, bhajatam... This is called bhajana, always engaged in Krsna's service, bhajana-priti..., with love and faith. To such person, He gives a direction. What is that direction? Buddhi-yogam dadami tam: "I give him that buddhi-yoga." What for? Yena mam upayanti te. "By the process by which he is anxious to come to Me, I give intelligence, 'Yes, come this way. You come to Me.' " And those who are not devotee, they want to eat and sleep and sex life and defense in different types of bodies. The dog is also defending with his claws and teeth. The tiger is also defending. The man is also defending. And man is also have sex life, or the tiger has also sex life. The dog has also sex life. The dog is eating. The man is eating. In these affairs they offer, "Give me this facility, my Lord. I want to eat without everything with any dis..." "All right. You take the body of a hog and you eat stool." This direction. Ye yatha mam prapadyante tams tathaiva bhajamy aham [Bg. 4.11]. So as you want...

So these different types of want is different type of people. A demon's want is different and a demigod's want is different. But Krsna in both cases is the director. If he wants to prosper in this line, "All right, take My direction. Do it. You become a first-class demon like Hiranyakasipu, Ravana, and become very powerful and create a situation by which both you and your whole family will be killed." That direction is there. And to a demigod, devotee, His direction he has. He he goes back to home. He plays with Krsna as cowherds boy. He dances with Krsna as gopi. He becomes Krsna's father, Krsna's mother. Clear it. Is it clear or not?

Pusta Krsna: Yes.

Devotee (3): Yes.

Prabhupada: Krsna gives direction according to the person, he wants. If he wants like a demon, Krsna will give him very good direction how he can become a first-class demon. And if he wants to become an associate of Krsna, devotee, then He will give you first-class direction how you can become. [break] Without His direction you cannot go even a step forward. You are dependent in both the cases. You are not independent. You are dependent in both the cases. Now, as you want, whether you want to become a demon or whether you want to make a devotee and make progress in that line, that is your decision. Is that clear? Yes.

Devotee (3): Yes.

Girl: Srila Prabhupada, even if... All living entities are part and parcel of Krsna. Even if we don't surrender to Krsna in this lifetime, eventually we'll surrender to Him, each and every one of us.

Pusta Krsna: Everyone... Even if we don't surrender to Krsna in this life, will everyone surrender to Krsna? Will everyone go back to Godhead eventually?

Prabhupada: Hm? So you have got doubt? Rest assured not everyone will do that. So you have no worries. It is not that everyone will do that. Therefore Caitanya Mahaprabhu says, ei rupe brahmanda bhramite kona bhagyavan jiva [Cc. Madhya 19.151]. Unless one is bhagyavan, very fortunate, he'll not go back to home, back to Godhead. He will rot here. So this Krsna consciousness movement means we are trying to make people bhagyavan. If he wants, he can become bhagyavan. That is our attempt. We are creating so many centers. We are teaching how to become bhagyavan, fortunate, how to go back to home, how he can be happy. Now, if one is fortunate, they will take this instruction and turn his life. Therefore this is mission. But without becoming bhagyavan, nobody can go. Fortunate. So we are giving them chance to become fortunate. This is our mission. The most unfortunate is getting the chance of becoming fortunate. Any one of us can consider this, how from unfortunate life they are coming to fortunate. This is Krsna consciousness movement, that we are giving chance to the unfortunate. Everyone is unfortunate, everyone is a rascal. We are giving chance how to become intelligent and fortunate. This is Krsna consciousness. If the people are not so unfortunate and rascal, then what is the meaning of preaching? Preaching means that you have to turn the rascals and unfortunate to become intelligent and fortunate. That is preaching. But unless you are fortunate and intelligent, you cannot take to Krsna consciousness. That is a fact.

Pusta Krsna: Can intelligence be created in an unintelligent person?

Prabhupada: Everyone is intelligent. That I have already explained. Everyone has got brain and intelligence, but he has to use it properly. That is wanted. That is education. You cannot teach a stone how to manufacture this microphone. That is not possible because he has no intelligence. But even one is dull brained, you can teach him by education how to manufacture this microphone. So intelligence is there, every living entity. Now, to train them how to utilize his intelligence... So one who is fortunate, he becomes trained up in intelligence how to go home, back to home, back to Godhead. And one who is not fortunate, his intelligence is used how to go to hell. That's all. That is duskrtina. To become a member of the hellish condition of life, that also requires intelligence. How to become first-class thief, how to become first-class cheater, first-class drunkard, first-class smuggler -- does it not require intelligence? It requires intelligence. But their intelligence is being used for going to hell. Another intelligence is being used to going back to home, back to Godhead. Intelligence is there in both the cases. Now, it is the technique, how to use it. That's all. That requires.

So duskrtina: "Those who are simply engaged in sinful activities and utilizing intelligence in that way," na mam prapadyante, "they cannot surrender to Me." So the intelligence is there. Everything is there. Senses are there. They have to be purified. Tat-paratvena nirmalam [Cc. Madhya 19.170]. The Krsna consciousness movement is to purify intelligence, not that intelligence is external, pushed in, within him, no, intelligence there, but at the present moment he is polluted. His intelligence is covered with so many dirty things. That has to be cleansed. Ceto-darpana-marjanam [Cc. Antya 20.12]. That is Krsna consciousness movement. His intelligence has to be cleansed. Other... Intelligence is there. Without intelligence, how one can be living being? Then he is stone. The Buddha philosophy, they mean to say that "Kill your intelligence. Then no more suffering from pain or pleasure. Just like stone. It has no feeling or suffering or pleasure." So that is not possible for the living entity to become as dull as the stone. That is not possible. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Bhagavad-gita 16.6 -- South Africa, October 18, 1975