"Krishna's Hypnotism"

Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.18
June 22, 1969, New Vrndavana

Srila A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

Prabhupada: So Narada Muni is advising Vyasadeva, tasyaiva hetoh prayateta kovidah. Kovida means intelligent, expert. One who knows things as they are, he's called kovida. So one who is intelligent, he should try to achieve that thing which is not available -- na labhyate yad bhramatam upary adhah -- which is not available even by wandering up and down. This we have already explained in the last meeting, that according to our karma, we are being sometimes elevated to the very high position, and sometimes we are being degraded to become an insignificant creature like ant. This is going on. (baby crying in background) (aside:) This boy... She, she can go to the... Yes. This is very disturbing child.

Nanu sadharmam atradapi karma pitr-loka iti sruti pitr-loka-prapti phalam aptaiva hatrasapi kovidah viveki; tasyaiva hetoh tad artham yartham na kuryad yad upary brahmaloka paryantam adhah sthavara paryantam brahmad bija na labhyate; tato visaya sukham anyatha eva praptino sva karmana sarvatra narakadapi labhyate duhkhavat; yatah duhkham prajadnavina labhyate tadvad; tad uktam apraptithani duhkhani tathaiva ayam hi dehinam sukhani api tatha manye daivatra atir-icyata(?).

So our duty is as, I mean to say, indicated by Narada Muni. Our only duty is how to achieve full Krsna consciousness. Other things, there is no need of trying. Actually, I have seen that in India... Everywhere the same case. A person without any education, even without any, practically illiterate... I have seen so many merchants, he cannot sign even his name. In Calcutta I've seen practically a Marwari, merchant. He, he cannot... He has deposited money in the bank. Simply he can sign his own name with great difficulty. So he's canvassing, "Will you kindly write here..." That means the check to be paid to the gentleman, he cannot write. He's asking somebody's help, "You write the name of the person whom I can pay." And he'll simply sign. If he writes something wrong, he'll have to accept. If he writes his own name... (laughter) So that man is earning millions of dollars. You see? And I have seen also very educated medical man, England-returned, M.R.C.P I am speaking from my practical experience. So he goes to a hospital, big doctor, but I have seen in his house. He had not even a good utensil at home. He's so poor in spite of so much education and highly qualified, England-returned doctor.

So the statement of Srimad-Bhagavatam that tal labhyate duhkhavad anyatah sukham. You don't try for so-called economic development. You cannot have more than what you are destined to get. It is already settled up. This, this living entity... You see different grades of standard of living condition. So they're according to the past karma, daivena, daiva-netrena, karmana. So you cannot change that. That nature's law, you cannot change. Why you have got varieties of life, varieties of position, varieties of de...? It is destined. Visayah khalu sarvatah syat. Visaya, these material enjoyment -- means eating, sleeping, mating and defending -- these... Only standard is different. I am eating something, you are eating something. Maybe, in my calculation, you are eating not very good. In your calculation I am not eating very good. But the eating is same. You are eating. I am eating.

So in the material world the standard of happiness, taking the basic principle, it is all the same. But we have created, "This is good standard. That is bad standard. This is very nice. This is very bad." Caitanya-caritamrta says, dvaite bhadrabhadra sakali samana. In the material world, "This is good," "This is bad" -- actually, it is the same thing. As it is explained in the Bhagavad-gita, sitosna-sukha-duhkha-dah: it is due to the skin that we are sometimes feeling warm and sometimes feeling cold. The material nature is the same. Similarly, our feelings of happiness and distress is just like feeling the warmth and, I mean to say, chilly cold. Due to the skin, due to this body. Actually, there is no happiness in the material world. Krsna says, duhkhalayam asasvatam: [Bg. 8.15] "This place is full of misery, full of misery." Now, how you can make it happy? Caitanya-caritamrta also says that dvaite bhadrabhadra sakali samana. In this material world it is our mental creation: "This is happiness. This is distress." Actually, it is all distress. After all, we have to die. After all, we have to finish this business. So what is happiness or distress? Bhagavata also says that "Don't bother yourself to make yourself happy by working day and night without trying for Krsna consciousness. This is simply waste of time." There is no question of happiness in this material world. If you actually want to be happy, anandamayo 'bhyasat, if you want to be placed in real happiness, that is Krsna consciousness. Tasyaiva hetoh prayateta kovido na labhyate.

So this chance we have got in this human form of life. I can execute the business of Krsna consciousness very nicely. In other form of life I cannot do that. Even if I try, it is not possible. That the dog cannot because it is not a human being. But we can because we are... So why should we lose this chance? Tasyaiva hetoh prayateta.

na vai jano jatu kathancanavrajen
mukunda-sevy anyavad anga samsrtim
smaran mukundanghry-upaguhanam punar
vihatum icchen na rasa-graho janah

Krsna consciousness is so nice that, if once adopted, he'll not degrade like ordinary man. This is stated here clearly. Na vai jano jatu kathancanavrajen mukunda-sevy anyavat. Anyavat, others, as they have become a tool in the hands of material nature, a Krsna conscious person, because he has surrendered to Krsna, he is not under the jurisdiction of the material nature. Mam eva ya prapadyante mayam etam taranti.

So whole stress is being given that "You take, you preach Krsna consciousness. If some way or other..." The whole, the three verses, are stressing that "Even if he falls down, there is no harm. Preach to take Krsna consciousness." Caitanya Mahaprabhu also says like that, yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa: [Cc. Madhya 7.128] "Whomever you meet, you simply try to make him convinced or to preach him the importance of Krsna consciousness." That is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's... Some way or other, if he takes to Krsna consciousness, then his life become successful. Yad uktam yatra kva va abhadra abhud amusya kim yad upavadayiti mukunda-sevi jana kadacit kathancana kujanim kato'pi samsrtim na vrajet na viset.(?) Sridhara Svami says, mukunda-sevi. Mukunda, Krsna's another name is Mukunda. Muk, muk. Muk means liberation, mukti. So... And ananda. So Krsna can give you liberation from this distressful, miserable condition of material existence and give you transcendental pleasure. Therefore His another name is Mukunda. So mukunda-sevi. Sevi means one, he's engaged in the service of Mukunda, or Krsna, Sridhara Svami says that mukunda-sevi va jana kadacit kathancana kujanim gato 'pi samsiddhin na vrajet.(?) Even a Mukunda-sevi, by chance... There is chance. Every... Just like Bharata Maharaja. He began Krsna consciousness, but by chance he, at the time of death, he was too much affectionate with a deer cub and he become a deer in the next life. So although it is degraded life, still, he did not forget that "For this reason I have become now deer." So he was very cautious. He was keeping company... Just like here. We have got dogs. They are keeping company with devotees. That is very nice. His dog life also be coming perfect. It may be some pious man. Somehow or other, it has become dog. Now he has... Krsna has given them the association of the devotees. He's eating prasadam. He's chan... He's hearing, chanting. He's giving some service to the devotees. So they are not in vain. They are not in vain. No. They, they're acquiring.

So mukunda-sevi. Similarly, anyone who has taken to Krsna consciousness, even if he falls down... Generally, he does not, but even, taking for accepted that he, somehow or other, he fallen, still, he'll not have to suffer like others. Just like here, the animals, under the protection of the devotees, at least he has no fear of his life. No devotee will kill. Here the cows, the horse, the dog, they're assured of their life. Therefore they're not like ordinary dogs. They're not ordinary cows. Therefore it is said, Sridhara Svami says, mukunda-sevi, even if he's degraded, he's not degraded as ordinary man. He's not degraded as... Mukunda-sevi na vrajet anga, anyavat kevala karma nisthavat iti vaidharma nistha.(?) Just like other karmis. They are, according to their karma, they're given birth in a specific species of life. So their case, a devotee's case, is different.

So kuto ityataha mukundanghry-upaguhanam alinganam punah smaran vihatum necchet yathan jana asad graha rasena na grhyate.(?) Just like we see sometimes... The other day, the boy, Jayarama, he went away. Again he came. We have got experience that many boys, they go away. But they cannot find out... Just like I received many letters from Jayagovinda when he was India, in India, that he's missing the company of devotee-Godbrothers. He's missing. So there is a feeling. Anyone who has associated in Krsna consciousness, I mean to say, association, he cannot forget. Rasa-graho janah. Here it is stated that smaran mukundanghry-upaguhanam punar vihatum icchen na. Vihatum means "to give up." He may fall down by maya's influence for time being, but he cannot give it up. This is the sign. He cannot give... Just like... The example is given: just like hot sugar juice. It is very nice. Because it is hot, one is feeling uncomfortable to take it, but because it is sweet, it cannot give way. Hot sugar juice. Similarly, this Krsna consciousness is so nice that if somebody, being..., becomes attracted by some kinds of maya's, I mean to say, influence, still, he does not like to give up this Krsna consciousness like others.

This is the specific qualification of a Krsna conscious person. Smaran mukundanghry-upaguhanam punah. One who has chanted Hare Krsna, he cannot give it up. Cannot give it up. He has to come again. This life or next life, Krsna will not leave him. Krsna... Once surrender sincerely, "Krsna, I am Yours," Krsna will never leave him. He will protect you. But if he had become little stronger, then there is no question of falling down. Rasagra rasena grhyate vasi kriyate.(?) Krsna vasi kriyate. Vasi kriyate means hypnotized. It is so nice that one becomes hypnotized. Otherwise, why the boys are working so hard? They are... (laughter) They're all qualified. They can earn money outside. In your country sufficient money is paid for work, but they are hypnotized here. (laughter)

So Krsna is so nice. Yes. He's the all-attractive. He hypnotizes His devotee in spite of... Just like the Pandavas. The Pandavas, they were Krsna's friends. Arjuna was friend. All the brother... Arjuna was very intimate friend, but other brothers, four brothers, they were also Krsna's friend. And Kunti, the Pandavas' mother, she happened to be the aunt of Krsna. So they were well, mean, established in relation with Krsna. But as a result, they were banished for twelve years. They lost the game, so they were banished. And their wife, Draupadi, was insulted. Not... They could not insult her, but they tried to insult her. They tried to make her naked in the assembly. And they lost their kingdom, and they were banished for twelve years. So Narada met Krsna. His devotee, he could speak Krsna with little criticism, "My dear Sir, Krsna, by becoming Your devotee the Pandavas are very happy. They have lost their kingdom. Their wife is insulted. And now they are banished for twelve years. So it is very good thing. (laughter) But the wonderful thing I see, now, in spite of all these inconveniences, they have increased their love for You." So Narada, he is astonished, "What kind of hypnotism you do, I do not know. (laughter) In spite of being placed in so much inconveniences, their love for You has increased." That is the position of Pandavas. This is Krsna consciousness. Tat te 'nukampam su-samiksamanah. The devotee, pure devotee, if they are put into difficulty they take it, "Oh, it is Krsna's grace. It is Krsna's grace." Tat te 'nukampam su-samiksamano bhunjana evatma-krtam vipakam. They take it in this way, "Krsna, I was to suffer hundred times more than this due to my bad activities in my past life, but You are giving me a little out of it. So it is Your grace." So devotee never takes any...

Therefore narayana-parah sarve na kutascana bibhyati: "One who has become narayana-parah, Krsna conscious, he's never afraid of any condition of life." Bhagavad-gita also, Krsna says, yasmin sthito na duhkhena vicalyate: "If one is situated in Krsna consciousness, then he's never disturbed." Gurunapi duhkhena: "If he's put in the severest type of difficulty, he's never..." Just see the Pandavas. That is the effect of Krsna consciousness. Therefore Narada is trying to convince Vyasadeva that "You preach Krsna consciousness. Whatever you have so..., so far written books, they have been useless. Now you write something, by reading which, one will become immediately Krsna conscious." Sadyo hrdy avarudhyate. In the beginning of the Srimad-Bhagavatam it is said that "Srimad-Bhagavatam is so nice that simply by reading, immediately one can capture the Supreme Lord within his heart." Sadyo hrdy avarudhyate susrusubhis tat-ksanat. Tat-ksanat means immediately, provided if he's little willing. That's all. Susrusu. That is the word.

So our whole program is that Krsna is very kind, always kind upon us, but we have to become little willing to take Krsna's favor. That... What is the example? My Guru Maharaja used to give a very nice example. I remember. Just like here is a well. Somebody has fallen down; he's crying, "Please get me out! Get me out! Get me out!" Now, if somebody drops a, a, I mean to, tight, strong rope and asks him, "All right, you catch this rope tightly. I'll get you out," and if he says, "No, that I cannot do," then how he'll be saved? That much endeavor he must have, to catch the rope. Then he'll be lifted immediately. Similarly, Krsna says that sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. So we have to do that. Simply to surrender unto... Then everything is there. That is the only. Because... Now the rope is there. Now we have to capture. Now, if you don't use your independence to catch it, then how can you expect to be lifted? That much you have to do. Because you have got... You are living. You are not a dead stone. You have got the independence. Therefore you have to capture, and Krsna will do everything. Then Krsna will do everything. Simply you have to capture, that "Krsna, from this day I am Yours. Whatever You like, You do."

Just like Bhaktivinoda Thakura says, manasa deho geho, jo kichu mora, arpilun tuwa pade, nanda-kisora. Krsna's another name is Nanda-kisora. Krsna has thousands and thousands of names, but this word, Krsna, is the original name, the exact name, "all-attractive." So here Nanda-kisora. Nanda-kisora means the young boy of Maharaja Nanda, Nanda-kisora. So Bhaktivinoda Thakura addressing, "My dear Nanda-kisora, young boy of, young child, or young son of Nanda Maharaja," manasa deho geho, "my mind, my body, my family," manasa deho geho jo kichu, "whatever I think ‘This is mine...' " Because we are conditioned souls, "my," "I," and "mine," this is our disease. "So whatever I am thinking ‘It is mine'... First of all, ‘This body's mine,' or ‘The home, the family, that is mine.' " So manasa deho geho, jo kichu... "Whatever I have got in my possession, now I am surrendering unto You." Arpilun tuwa pade nanda-kisora. This is surrender. "So I am giving unto You my family, my home, my body, my mind, everything." Arpilun tuwa pade nanda... "Now, whatever You like, You do." That is very nice song. So we have to do that. Then Krsna will take care. That's all. The same example: you simply have to capture the rope. Then you'll be lifted immediately.

So, so here it is said that a Krsna conscious person, even if he is fallen down, he is not so degraded. Sridhara Svami, here, herewith quotes a verse from Bhagavad-gita. It is nice.

yatate ca tato bhuyah
samsiddhau kuru-nandana
purvabhyasena tenaiva
hriyate hy avaso 'pi sah

Just like so many boys and girls come to our association just like somebody forcing him, forcing him, "You just remain in this association." That is Krsna's grace. That means in their past life they had been Krsna conscious. Some way or other, it was not being fulfilled. Now again the chance is being given. That is stated in Bhagavad-gita, that yatate ca tato bhuyah samsiddhau. The percentage up to which he finished in his last birth, that is not lost. That is there, fifty percent or forty percent, thirty percent, whatever one executed in the last birth. Now next, this birth, unwillingly or by force, by Krsna's force, he'll have to accept again Krsna consciousness.

Just like Bilvamangala Thakura. I think I have several times spoken about Bilvamangala Thakura. So Bilvamangala Thakura, he raised himself in his previous life to the bhava-bhakti. Bhava-bhakti means always feeling for Krsna. That is the prior stage of loving Krsna, bhava-bhakti. So he, in his previous life he was raised, but somehow or other, he fell down. But it is assured, sucinam srimatam gehe yoga-bhrasto 'bhijayate: "Even such Krsna consciousness person falls down, he is given chance to take birth in nice brahmana family or suci, pure family, and rich family." So Bilvamangala Thakura was very rich man. He was born in a very rich brahmana family. And he was addicted to prostitute. By some way or other, he had some inclination like that. So he could not finish Krsna consciousness. He fallen down. But at a opportune moment he got again the Krsna consciousness.

How is that? The incidence is that he was performing the sraddha ceremony of his father, but he had a girlfriend, prostitute. So he wanted to go there very quickly. So somehow or other he finished. And he wanted to go there. But on the road he found that it was very heavily raining and he had to cross the river. So he did everything. And he... The prostitute was... She thought that "Bilvamangala is not coming today. It is very..., so much raining." So when she saw that Bilvamangala is at the door, she was astonished. She said, "Bilvamangala, how did you come here in this rainy, torrents of rainy...?" So he disclosed everything that how he catched one dead body in the river, then he crossed the river, then he jumped over the wall. So she was astonished, and she simply said, "Oh, this much affection if you would have with Krsna, how you would have been... Your life would have been nice." Immediately it was... "Oh, Krsna...?" Immediately, he left everything. Immediately he left everything and went to Vrndavana. He is... So Krsna is so nice. Just at the right point He will remind. Yatate ca tatah. Here, in the Bhagavad-gita, yatate ca tato bhuyah samsiddhau kuru-nandana, purvabhyasena. He was accustomed, so immediately reminded, immediately.

So these are the, I mean to say, facilities for Krsna consciousness. And this is the only business one should take. All other things, simply waste of time. That is the instruction of Narada. Narada is the spiritual master within, spiritual master of the whole Vaisnava sect. So he's giving the right direction, that "Don't try for anything else. Don't think that you'll be happy this way or that way. Never... Whatever happiness or distress..." (coughing) Where is water? So example is given here that tal labhyate duhkhavat. Nobody expects a calamity or distress, but sometimes calamity overcomes us. Similarly, you should not, I mean to say, try for any artificial happiness. Whatever Krsna gives you, be satisfied. That was the basic principle of Vedic civilization. Nobody was trying to make any artificial economic development. No. The whole history of India is like that. They were satisfied, "All right..." Even now the mass of people... In 1942 there was famine. People were dying. Still, they were..., "All right. Krsna has given us. God has given us." That was the mentality.

So our main business is how to improve Krsna consciousness. We should not divert our attention in any other material condition of improvement. That is actually not improvement. It is simply illusion, that "I am making improvement." What improvement? Suppose you are earning now, say, five hundred dollars per month. If you earn, say, five million dollars, so then what? Will you eat more than four capatis? (laughter) You'll eat the same four capatis. And you'll occupy the same six feet bed. You may acquire the whole property of West Virginia, (laughter) but you'll have to lie down on six feet. (laughter) That's all. And you'll have to eat four capatis. So this is maya. This is maya, "I am improving." What you are improving? You'll not be taller. You'll not be great eater, nothing of the sort. Whatever you have already, you'll have so the same thing. You see?

So tad eva bhagavad-lila pradhanarena anuvarnaya; ity uktam bhakti-bhavam ka ca kasya lila iti apeksama ilam bhagavan eva satu asmad iti araha.(?) So Narada Rsi, Narada Muni says, "You just try to describe the glories of Krsna." And what is that? The question may be, "Then how shall I glorify Him?" He says, idam hi visvam bhagavan ivetarah: "You study everything and dovetail with Krsna." Idam: "This world, this cosmic manifestation..." Idam jagat. Jagat means this cosmic manifestation, idam, this, bhagavan... "It is Krsna." That means, "Try to preach or try to teach the people in general that everything belongs to Krsna, everything is manifestation of Krsna's energy." But not impersonalism. If... The impersonalists' view is that if everything is Krsna... That is the... That is their material way of thinking. Just like if you big paper and, I mean to say, cut into pieces and the pieces are distributed, strewn over, then the original paper is lost. So their theory is, "If Krsna is everything -- Krsna has expanded in this world, in cosmic manifestation -- then Krsna has no form, separate form." That is their theory. But the Vedic injunction is: "No, it is not like that." Purnasya purnam adaya purnam evavasisyate: Krsna is so full that even Krsna expands million times, still, He's the same thing, Krsna. That is Krsna. Krsna is person. And even He expands, Krsna, in many ways... Parasya saktir vividhaiva sruyate. This is the fine philosophy. One has to understand how Krsna, in spite of His being a person -- He's person, without any doubt -- He has expanded in so many universes, so many manifestations. Yes.

So I was... This morning, while I was walking, I was talking with Devananda that how Krsna expands. It is commonsense affair. Just like a small seed in a fruit -- that seed you sow, it becomes a big tree. And from that big tree, again millions of fruits come out. And again from that, each fruit, there are millions of trees. We can see the potency. Even in our material existence we see so much potencies in everything. Why not Krsna's potencies? We see the sunshine, the potency of the sun. The sunshine is spread all over, and everything is existing on the sunshine. Even the sunshine has got the so much potency. That we can experience. And how much potential is Krsna, who is the creator of the sun also. Yac caksur esa savita sakala-grahanam raja samasta-sura-murtir asesa-tejah. So we have to study like that everything. Everything is Krsna's expansion. Just like the fire. Fire is situated in one place, but here... Just like here there is a fireplace. But if there is fire, the heat will be experienced up, up, upstair, and here and that other side. Similarly, Krsna, although He's person, He's situated... Goloka eva nivasati. He's enjoying there in Goloka Vrndavana. By His energy, He is expanded. This is simple truth. Anyone, any man with common sense, he can experience.

So Vyasadeva is teaching Narada Muni, idam visvam bhagavan. Isvarad prapanca na prthak.(?) This world is not different from Krsna, na prthak. Prthak means different. The world is not... But that does not mean Krsna has lost His personality. This is the difference between Mayavada philosophy and Vaisnava philosophy. Mayavada philosophy is: "If the whole cosmic creation is God, then where is God again separately?" That is their poor fund of knowledge. That is God who, expanding Himself in so many ways, still He remains as He is. That is God. Otherwise, how He is God? It is material thing. If by expanding, He loses His identity, then it is material. In the material sense, that we experience. The same example: you take one big paper and cut into pieces and throw it. The original paper is lost. That is material. But in the Isopanisad we hear that purnasya purnam adaya purnam idam purnam adah purnam purnat udacyate, purnasya purnam adaya purnam eva avasisyate [Isopanisad, Invocation]. Just like when Krsna was sporting on this earth as cowherd boy, Brahma became doubtful, "How is that? Krsna has become a cowherds boy here?" So he wanted to test whether He's Krsna. So he, he sifted all the cows and cowherds boys from the pasturing ground, and again he saw that millions times the same cows, boys and cowherd, cows and cowherd boys, are present there. So that is Krsna. He can expand. Brhatvad brhannatvad. Brahman means He can expand unlimitedly. And He can shrink also to the minute. Just like we are very minute. We are also part and parcel. And this cosmic manifestation is also part and parcel of Krsna. Therefore He's called param brahma param dhama pavitram paramam bhavan [Bg. 10.12].

So in this way we have to study to become Krsna conscious. The, everything is there. Simply we have to become little serious. Then we can understand what is this world, what is Krsna, what we are, how they have expanded, how this world is created, everything. All answers are there. It is not a sentiment, that we are accepting something by sentiment. All reasons, all philosophy, arguments, are there. We shall discuss by and by.

Thank you very much. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.18 -- New Vrindaban, June 22, 1969

"At Least Lift Your Anchor"

Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.15
June 19, 1969, New Vrndavana

Srila A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

Prabhupada: ...is not our Vaisnava. If you say, you have to say this also. Yes.

Kirtanananda: Whole thing?

Prabhupada: Yes. Otherwise keep everything.

om ajnana-timirandhasya jnananjana-salakaya
caksur unmilitam yena tasmai sri-gurave-namah

sri-caitanya-mano-'bhistam sthapitam yena bhu-tale
svayam rupah kada mahyam dadati sva-padantikam

vande 'ham sri-guroh sri-yuta-pada-kamalam sri-gurun vaisnavams ca
sri-rupam sagrajatam saha-gana-raghunathanvitam tam sa-jivam

sadvaitam savadhutam parijana-sahitam krsna-caitanya-devam
sri-radha-krsna-padan saha-gana-lalita-sri-visakhanvitams ca

he krsna karuna-sindho dina-bandho jagat-pate
gopesa gopika-kanta radha-kanta namo 'stu te

tapta-kancana-gaurangi radhe vrndavanesvari
vrsabhanu-sute devi pranamami hari-priye

hare krsna hare krsna krsna krsna hare hare
hare rama hare rama rama rama hare hare

(aside:) So you keep there. You can keep here. It is open? Yes.

jugupsitam dharma-krte 'nusasatah
svabhava-raktasya mahan vyatikramah

So in our last meeting we have been discussing that sastras, scriptures, if they simply deal with material activities... Of course, material activities should be regulated to come to the spiritual platform. But if we do not come to the spiritual platform, simply some regulative principle on the material platform will not help us.

Religiosity means to prepare the ground, prepare the ground for being elevated to the spiritual platform. Just like it is said,

dharmah svanusthitah pumsam
visvaksena-kathasu yah
notpadayed yadi ratim
srama eva hi kevalam
[SB 1.2.8]

Dharma, religious faith -- everything is very punctual. One is going punctually to the church or to the temple and executing all ritualistic ceremonies very rigidly, following the rules and regulations. But at the end if he has not developed love for God, then, Bhagavata says, srama eva hi kevalam: "This is simply laboring, formalities." Caste priest, caste gosvami, caste spiritual master -- simply a formality. But the objective is not Krsna. Objective is material happiness. That sort of religiosity or following the regulative principle will not help.

So Vyasadeva says, jugupsitam: "This is abominable, because if you simply stick to that principle... You are authority. People will understand that this is religion, nothing more." Na manyate tasya nivaranam janah, yad-vakyatah. Nanu yad pravrtti-marga nindate 'tha nivrtti-marge sarva-kriya-tyagena paramesvara-sukhasya rupe anubhuteh kim tad yasah-kathanenapi tatraha vicaksanaiti, vicaksana ati-nipunah kascid eva nivrttitah sarva-kriya-nivrttya, asya bibhah sukham nirvikalpaka-sukhatmakam svarupam veditum jnatum arhati.(?) One may be very expert in the matter of executing religious performances, but that does not mean he can be elevated to the spiritual platform.

vicaksano 'syarhati veditum vibhor
ananta-parasya nivrttitah sukham
pravartamanasya gunair anatmanas
tato bhavan darsaya cestitam vibhoh

This may be little helpful to rise to the spiritual platform, but unless one is actually engaged in the service of the Lord, it cannot be achieved perfectly.

Then Vyasadeva says, Narada Muni says, tatah karunarthe vibhu anatmanah deha-vimana athaiva gunaih satyadibhih pravartamanasya gunair janasya darsaya bhavan iti.(?) "Therefore you write literature in such a way that people will become attracted to Krsna, or the Supreme Lord." Simply official understanding of Krsna -- "God is great" or "Krsna is all-powerful" -- but my attention is only how to improve any material condition... So this picture was given in our Back to Godhead. Perhaps you all remember that a bridegroom party was to go to the bride's home. In India the marriage party, bridegroom party, the bride, his father, his relatives, go with the bride, bridegroom, to the bride's home, and the marriage ceremony takes place there in the presence of all kinds of relatives. That is the system. So the marriage was to take place in a different village some miles away, and in Bengal the land is full of rivers. The rivers are considered to be high roads. So it was settled that the bridegroom's party will start in the evening before the marriage day and reach there in the morning and rest whole day, and in the evening the marriage will take place.

So they got up in a boat, and the boat was started and the, all the members of the bridegroom's party, the, they fell asleep. It was on the river. The breeze was very pleasing. And next morning when they arose, they saw they were standing on the same place. Then they were surprised, "How is that?" The boatman was asked, "How is that, we are in the same place? We have not proceeded even a few yards. How is that?" The boatman said that "We were plying the whole night. We do not know how it happened." Then one boatman found out that the anchor was not taken out. The anchor was fixed up, and the whole night they were plying meant the boat was round about the anchor only, moving, and it was... It did not go a step forward.

Similarly, if our anchor, that we want this material happiness, for which we worship God, we may go to the temple, go to the church, offer our respect... Arto artharthi. That is accepted as good. But one has to go far above that position. That means if one, being distressed, approaches Krsna, that "My Lord, I am in distress. Please help me," the qualification is good in this sense, that he, somehow or other, he has approached God. But his motive is not pure. His motive is material enjoyment. So Vyasadeva says, "This kind of instruction in your book will not help people to come to the standard of pure devotional service, which can save him from all material bondage." That is the whole purport. Then what is to be done? The same thing, as Krsna advises, that sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. You haven't got to do anything. Simply be engaged in Krsna consciousness.

So here, of course, I am very pleased that the boys and girls who have come to me, they have immediately taken to Krsna. But India, although the Bhagavad-gita is the scripture of Hindus and the Indians, still, they are not so easy to accept Krsna consciousness. Because their brain is puzzled. Somebody says that "You worship goddess Kali." Somebody says that "You worship Lord Siva." Somebody says, "You worship Brahma." So mostly, in temples, in, I mean to say, temples which are meant for earning some money, they have got all kinds of deities. In one place there is Lord Siva, one place there is Goddess Kali, one place there is Ramacandra, one place is... Just like store, store. You go to a store, and you'll find all kinds of goods are ready there. Whatever goods you want, you pay price and take. So that is another business, that "Whomever you may love, please come to my temple, pay something, and you see. Your God is there." You see? So... And there are some missionary activities also. They say that "Whatever God you may worship, it is the same."

But our Vaisnava philosophy does not say that. Vaisnava philosophy says, "God is one." Not in... Vaisnava philosophy, you do not think that it is a sectarian. This is based on Vedic conclusion. In the Rg Veda also it is said, "God is one." Tad visnoh. Visnu is paramam padam. He is Supreme. Vedas does not say that Brahma is supreme, or Lord Siva is the supreme, or Goddess Kali is supreme. No. Tad visnoh paramam... This is Rg Veda mantra. And so far Bhagavad-gita is concerned, it is clearly said there by Krsna. He says, "I am the Supreme. Nobody's greater than Me." We find in Brahma-samhita also the same thing, isvarah paramah krsnah [Bs. 5.1]. So actually in the Vedas the Supreme Lord is accepted -- Visnu, or Narayana, or Krsna, different names of visnu-tattva. Even Sankaracarya, he also accepts, narayanah parah: "Narayana is the Supreme, Narayana."

So God is one, but there are different kinds of demigods. That is also a fact. They are accepted as different parts and parcels of God, as we are also. The demigods are also living entities. They are not visnu-tattva. There are visnu-tattva, jiva-tattva and sakti-tattva. Visnu-tattva is the Supreme Absolute Truth, jiva-tattva is part and parcel, and sakti-tattva is the energy of God. So the demigods... You can become a demigod. You can become. If you follow the process how to become, then you become one day the demigod in the sun planet. It is not difficult. You can become one day even Lord Brahma. Just like you can become one day President Nixon, like him. That requires your qualification. But you can... But you cannot become Krsna or Narayana. That is not possible. God is one. You cannot become God, but you can become part and parcel of God, more powerful. That is possible. Just like you are all Americans, but some of you can become a big officer in the government, the president, the secretary, the governor, but their position is better than ordinary man, similarly, the demigods are like that. They are different officers of the Supreme Lord, Krsna. These things are described in Bhagavatam, that the sun rises under the order of the Supreme Lord. The moon rises under the order of the Supreme Lord. The ocean is not disturbing, it is calm and quiet... Not calm and quiet. It is in its position by the order of the Supreme Lord. So everyone is acting under the Supreme Lord. And Caitanya-caritamrta says, ekale isvara krsna: "Yes, the Supreme Lord is only Krsna." Ekale isvara krsna, ara saba bhrtya. Ara, "Any other demigod or even visnu-tattva, even Narayana, Visnu" -- there are so many, I mean to say, manifestation of visnu-tattva -- "they're all subordinate to Krsna." Isvarah paramah krsnah [Bs. 5.1].

So here the point is that just direct people to Krsna, or the Supreme Lord. Don't misguide them that "Here is another god, here is another god, here is another..." The Bhagavad-gita also, in the last instruction, Bhagavan says, mam ekam. Ekam means one. "Only surrender to Me." So this is the verdict of all Vedic literatures. But if somebody thinks that "I can worship Brahma, I can worship Kali, I can worship Siva, or many other demigods, and still the same thing," this is impersonalist view. It is not a fact. Because according to them, "The Absolute Truth is impersonal. There is no question of personality. But because we cannot concentrate our devotional energy or attention in the impersonal feature, therefore let us imagine some form of God." This is the, I mean to say, principle of the impersonalists. They imagine some form of God, and they get perfection. And ultimately they become impersonal, merge into the effulgence, brahmajyoti. That is their philosophy. The Mayavada philosophy and Vaisnava philosophy differs here. Our Bhagavata says that ultimate truth, Absolute Truth, is a person. Brahman, Paramatma, and Bhagavan. Brahmeti paramatmeti bhagavan iti. Vyasadeva says that "You direct people, attention, to the Supreme Personality of Godhead."

Now, the question may be that one may take to the service of the Supreme Personality of Godhead without understanding the truth, by sentiment. Just like sometimes... It is mostly in this country. Some of the disciples, some of the students, they are coming, not that one has understood this philosophy very nicely and he is convinced. Some of them are coming by sentiment: "All right, let me join this Krsna consciousness movement." So in that case what happens? Suppose one does not understand the philosophy, but he comes to join this Krsna consciousness movement, then what is the effect? That is also clearly explained by Naradadeva, that,

tyaktva sva-dharmam caranambujam harer
bhajann apakvo 'tha patet tato yadi
yatra kva vabhadram abhud amusya kim
ko vartha apto 'bhajatam sva-dharmatah
[SB 1.5.17]

So Narada says that "Giving up all other engagements..." Just like it is instructed in the Bhagavad-gita that "Give up all other engagements. Simply surrender unto Me." So if somebody, out of sentiment, without understanding, out of sentiment, surrenders, comes to Krsna... Here he had many duties to perform, his family life, his duty to the country, so many duties. Everyone has got so many duties. But one gives up all other duties, simply comes to Krsna. Then what happens to him? This is very important version of Narada Muni. He says, sva-dharma: "Everyone has got some occupational duty. So he gives it up according to the instruction of Krsna," and caranambujam hareh, "and begins devotional service, Krsna consciousness. Then, after some time..." Just like many... When I came, in the beginning, there were many, not many, a few, say within five or six, they were working with me, but now they are not working. So that is possibility. Because one may come by sentiment. Then, after staying for some time, he may find it: "Oh, what is this Krsna consciousness? Let me do something else." Or "Let me join in my previous occupation." So Narada Muni says that "Even a person joins Krsna consciousness, giving up all other occupational duties and without being mature, falls down, some..."

There are so many reasons one may fall down. Not only... Actually, the reason is maya. Maya, maya. It is a fight. To take to Krsna consciousness means it is a fight against maya. Maya is trying to keep you captivated within this material world. But if anyone takes to Krsna consciousness, he, maya has to give him up. Maya cannot control anymore. That is not the jurisdiction of maya. Because you have read in the Bhagavad-gita that Krsna says, daivi hy esa gunamayi mama maya duratyaya: [Bg. 7.14] "It is very, very, very difficult to get out of the grip of the strong maya." It is not... But mam eva ye prapadyante: "If anyone comes to Me or surrenders unto Me," mayam etam taranti te [Bg. 7.14], "he immediately becomes out of the jurisdiction of maya." So maya is strong always. Just like I was explaining this morning what is maya. Maya is already there, side by side, Krsna and maya. Just like this light. This side is light; this side is darkness. Take this example. This light, the one side is very bright; another side is dark. So this darkness and this light is always side by side. Similarly, Krsna and maya... Because maya is one of the energy of Krsna. When Vyasadeva by bhakti-yoga meditation experienced the whole thing, what did he see? He saw Krsna. Apasyat purusam purnam: "He saw the Supreme Person." Mayam ca tad-apasrayam: "And he saw also maya on the back side." Just like when you, if you stand, the light side, your shadow is not on the light side. The light... The shadow is on the back side.

So in our back side the maya is there, although you are in front of Krsna. So as soon as you become little slack in Krsna consciousness, immediately maya is ready to capture you. Maya is always going side by side. As Krsna is all-pervading, the maya is also all-pervading. As soon as there is lack of Krsna consciousness, there is immediately maya.

krsna-bahirmukha hana bhoga vancha kare
nikata-stha maya tare japatiya dhare

Japatiya dhare means embrace. What is that? What is called, to capture like this?

Devotee: Hug?

Devotees: Hug, hug, embrace?

Prabhupada: Embrace? Yes. So as soon as one, krsna-bhuliya, forgets Krsna... Forgetting Krsna means sense enjoyment. Two things are there. One, the materialistic persons, they are engaged in the activities of sense enjoyment, forgetting Krsna; and the transcendentalists, the devotees, they are, even though they are not forgotten, but they are not interested in sense enjoyment. They are interested in Krsna. That is the difference. This is maya and Krsna.

So maya is always strong. As soon as we little slack in Krsna consciousness, maya will capture us in the same process. So here it is said, bhajann apakvo 'tha. If one is not very strong, not very much advanced, not mature, and falls down under the clutches of maya again, so, Narada Muni says, yatra kva vabhadram abhut: "There is no," I mean to say, "loss." Abhadra means great loss, or inauspicity. There is no... "It is still good, even if he falls down." Why? Yatra kva va abhadram amusya kim ko vartha apto 'bha...: "In comparison to the person who is simply sticking to the formalities of religious principles without any development of love of Godhead, simply following the routine work, in comparison to that person, this person who came to surrender to Krsna, either by sentiment or some way or other but falls down, this man is better. This man is better. There is no," I mean to say, "any great loss. Rather it is a great gain."

How it is gain? Krsna has confirmed in the Bhagavad-gita that yoga-bhrasto 'bhijaya... Sucinam srimatam gehe. This question was raised by Arjuna, that "Krsna, one person is engaged in bhakti-yoga. It is very good. If he can execute bhakti-yoga to the perfect point and becomes liberated, goes back to Krsna, it is very nice. But if he falls down, then what is his position? He loses both things? He loses Krsna consciousness and all this material enjoyment. Then he is nowhere?" Krsna said, "No, no, no, no. It is not like that. His position is not like that. His position is better still, even if he has fallen down."

What is that? Now, sucinam srimatam gehe yoga-bhrasto 'bhijayate: "If one, anyone, immaturely falls down, then in next life he will have the opportunity to take birth in very rich family or in a family of a, I mean, real brahmana." Real brahmana means suci, always pure. That is real brahminical qualification. Truthful, clean, wise, God consciousness -- these are brahminical qualifications. We are giving thread ceremony to our disciples to recognize him that he has got the brahminical qualifications. He has given up this meat-eating, illicit sex life, gambling and intoxication. He is chanting Hare Krsna mantra. He is being purified gradually. He's trying to understand Krsna. Therefore he's always pure. This is the recognition. This thread ceremony is recognition. But if we simply make it a show, that "Now I have got thread. I have become liberated. I may not do anything," and then again I fall down... The same principle is always going on, maya and Krsna.

Just like in India, those who are born in brahmana family, they are falsely proud that "We are born in brahmana family. Now we are perfect. Now we can do any nonsense thing. Still I am brahmana." And it is actually being done. They are doing work less than a sudra, and still, they are passing on as brahmana. That is the cause of India's spiritual falldown. Some people, they have exploited simply being born in high family. But actually that is not the position. Actual position is by quality. If one has got the quality of a brahmana, then he should be recognized as brahmana, as we are doing here. Here nobody is born in a brahmana family, but how we are offering him sacred thread? By the quality. That is recommended by Sanatana Gosvami. Sanatana Gosvami gives a very nice example in his Hari-bhakti-vilasa, that yatha kamsyam,

yatha kancanatam yati
kamsyam rasa-vidhanatah
tatha diksa-vidhanena
dvijatvam jayate nrnam

He gives that "Just like by chemical process one can turn gun metal into gold, similarly, by the process of initiation, one can become dvija." Dvija means twice-born, or brahmana.

So the chance is given. If one falls down immaturely from the standard of bhakti-yoga, devotional service, or Krsna consciousness, then he gets next birth either in a very nice brahmana family, or very rich family. So is not...? So what is the loss there, even if I fall? But that does not mean I shall wait for falling down. No. Just like in India, formerly, in medical college there were two designations -- one as M.D., and another was L.M.S. So what is the distinction? Now, after passing, after regularly attending the class, say, five or six years, if one passes the examination, he takes the title M.D., Doctor of Medicine, or something like that. And if he fails, then he is given the title L.M.S., Licensed in Medical, Medicine and Surgery. So after studying in medical college for the regular years, five or six years, so even if he fails, he is recognized, but not to the standard of that passed medical man, but he is given license: "All right, if you don't wish to study more, you get the license to practice." License. Similarly, a devotee, a person in devotional service, in Krsna consciousness, even if he falls down by some reason or other, without being mature, then he has, he's not in loss.

He says, Narada Muni says, that evam tavat tat karma-karmadi anartha-hetutva tam vihaya harer lilaiva bandhaniya tam.(?) Therefore everyone should be engaged in Krsna consciousness. If we pass Krsna consciousness examination at the end of our life, it is very good, but even if we fail, just like the medical man, failing, as we can execute, we can work as a medical man, we get the license, just like to take birth in a nice family, that means again devotional service. In India, a rich family means they must have their own private temple. Generally they have got private temple, all rich men. Now they are not constructing. Just like in your country, those who are rich, now they are not constructing any churches. They... Everyone, people are losing interest in religion. But in formerly, say, even twenty-five years ago, both the Hindus and Mussulman, if one becomes rich, immediately he tries to construct a temple or a mosque. I have got personal experience. When I was doing medical business, one Muhammadan... His name was Abdullah. He was supplying me bottles. So he was very poor man, but by making business in bottle supply he became rich. So one day I asked him, "Abdullah, you have got now money. How you are going to utilize your money?" So he said, "Babaji, majjhi banabhan(?)" He said that "My dear sir," that, "I have got an intention to construct a mosque." So people, either Christian or Jew or Muhammadan or Hindu, formerly they were religious and, according to their faith, they used to construct either synagogue or church or mosque or temple all over the world. Now they have lost interest. You see?

So to get birth in the family of a pure brahmana means he gets the association. Because in a brahmana family or a rich family the worship of Krsna is there. Every brahmana family, according to Vedic culture, must worship Narayana, every brahmana family. If he is not worshiping Narayana, then he's rejected from brahmana family. That was the stricture. And srimatam. Srimatam means rich family, very rich family. So every rich family had a temple, private temple. Just like I was born in a family. Although I was not a member of that family, but I was born in a very rich family. They had a temple. Still that temple existing. When I last year went to India, I stayed in that temple. Acyutananda, recently he was there. He informed me that he is staying in that temple. Because we were born in that family, from the very beginning of our life we got the idea of Radha-Krsna worship. It is very nice.

So sucinam srimatam gehe yoga-bhrasto 'bhijayate. So there is no loss. He begins again worship of Radha-Krsna, either in the brahmana family or in the rich family. And ko vartha apto 'bhajatam sva-dharmatah: "And if anyone does not take to Krsna consciousness, devotional service, simply engages in his, mean, prescribed duties as a brahmana or ksatriya or a sudra, and he's very strict moralist, he may get, he may get also." There is... Because this life, as it is stated in the Bhagavad-gita, yes, Vedas, Upanisad, ksurasya dhara iti duratyaya.(?) The people do not understand that how we are stationed. Any little difference, we may fall down. As there is chance of falldown from Krsna consciousness, there is chance of falldown from any position. This human life, human form of life, should be very carefully and cautiously utilized. This verse I was explaining yesterday, labdhva sudurlabham idam bahu-sambhavante.

So Narada Muni advises that "Induce everyone to be engaged in Krsna consciousness. Never mind if he, even if he falls down. There is no loss." This is the principle. If he becomes successful, oh, the greatest boon. That greatest boon is described in Bhagavad-gita, samsiddhim paramam gatah, highest perfection. Highest... Samsiddhim. Samsiddhim means perfection. Paramam, the supreme.

mam upetya punar janma
duhkhalayam asasvatam
napnuvanti mahatmanah
samsiddhim paramam gatah
[Bg. 8.15]

So if we become successful in Krsna consciousness, we achieve the greatest success of life, but even if we fall down, oh, there is no loss. Because we are going to get birth in sucinam, in nice brahmana family, or rich mercantile family where it is supposed...

Nowadays, at the present moment, there is no brahmana, no ksatriya, no vaisyas. Everyone is a sudra. Kalau sudra-sambhavah. The situation is different. Therefore Caitanya Mahaprabhu has made the thing very easy. Either you become brahmana or sudra or ksatriya or less than sudra, candala, or, or anything, it doesn't matter. Take to this chanting of Krsna, and if you stick to this and if you follow the regulative principles, your success is sure. That is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's gift. And that is confirmed here by Narada Muni, that "There is no loss even one falls down from Krsna consciousness platform." That does not mean we shall fall down. We must be very steady and rigid and with vow, drdha-vratah. Bhajante mam drdha-vratah. Krsna says that te dvandva-moha-nirmuktah. How we can become fixed up in Krsna consciousness? That is also explained in the Bhagavad-gita, yesam anta-gatam papam: "Anyone who is completely free from all sinful reaction..." Yesam anta-gatam papam jananam punya-karmanam. And who can be completely free from all sinful reaction? They are always engaged in pious activities. Such persons... Because if you engage yourself in pious activities, there is no chance of your being engaged in sinful activities.

So this activity, Krsna consciousness activity, is not only pious; it is transcendental. So if you stay on this platform of Krsna consciousness, the easy process, just like we are executing in New Vrindaban, chanting, dancing, eating bhagavata-prasadam, hearing Bhagavata or Bhagavad-gita, trying to understand, simple process... It is not very difficult. And you are satisfied with little prasadam. Never mind what it is. This process will make you stay firm. So don't deviate. Whatever little regulative principles are there, they are not very difficult. Just stick to this principle, chant Hare Krsna, eat prasadam, and your life will be successful.

Here is the assurance by Narada Muni, that "Even if he falls down, still, there is no loss. But the, on the other side, those who are not in Krsna consciousness, if he's very regular businessman or regular worker, so many things, still, his gain is nothing." He... Srama eva hi kevalam. He's simply laboring, because he has no connection with Krsna consciousness. The life mission, this human form of life mission, is to understand Krsna and relation. He's neglecting that. He has no information. Therefore he does not gain. If you... Suppose if you go to a place, to a..., where you can earn money, as much as you like, and if you go there, and if you do not earn anything, you come empty-handed, so, as your mission becomes unsuccessful. Similarly, if in the human form of life you are simply engaged in the animalistic way of life -- eating, sleeping, mating, and defending in a nice way than the birds and beasts -- then you are not gaining anything. Parabhavas tavad abodha-jatah. In many places these things are very nicely explained. Abodha-jatah. We are born... We are born ignorant. A child is born ignorant. If the father, mother, guardians, do not give him education, then his life is spoiled. The child has no fault. It is the fault of the guardian. In this human form of life, if the state, the father, the teacher, the school, college, and every, who are responsible for raising the child to knowledge, to become wise, if they do not care and simply they have trained for eating nicely, sleeping nicely and mating nicely and defending nicely, then there is no gain. The life is the... A chance is missed. Narada Muni says that "Without coming to Krsna consciousness, if he's simply engaged in a polished way to this animalistic way of life -- eating, sleeping, mating and defending -- then he does not gain anything. On the other side, if a person without any knowledge, without any understanding, by sentiment takes to Krsna consciousness, and, being immature, if he falls down, there is no loss." This is the conclusion.

Thank you very much. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.15 -- New Vrindaban, June 19, 1969

"One Has To Live In God"

Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.13
June 16, 1969, New Vrndavana

Srila A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

Prabhupada: So Narada Muni is instructing his disciple Vyasadeva to write books specially by which one may be helped, everyone will be helped, to cross over the nescience, akhila-bandha-muktaye, to become liberated from all conditional stage. We are spirit soul. We cannot be under any material condition. Just like our normal condition is healthy life, not under feverish condition. That is abnormal life. If one is attacked with fever, that is not his normal life. That is temporary, abnormal life. Actual life is healthy life. We should nicely eat. We shall nicely sleep. We shall work very nicely. We..., our brain must work very nicely. These are healthy signs. But when I cannot work nicely, I cannot sleep nicely, I cannot work nicely, I cannot act my brain very nicely, that means abnormal condition. So at that time, he requires to be treated by expert physician.

So here is the expert physician, Narada Muni. And he is advising his disciple to make him expert. This is called parampara system. In the same way, we are coming from the same disciplic succession. As Narada Muni was expert physician for curing this material disease, similarly, he made Vyasadeva expert physician; Vyasadeva made Madhvacarya expert physician. So one has to come down in that disciplic succession and become expert physician, or bona fide spiritual master. Here, as we require to go to a physician, to a medical man, for curing our material, I mean, bodily diseases, similarly, to cure our material disease, one has to approach an expert spiritual, bona fide spiritual master. Otherwise it is not possible. Tad-vijnanartham sa gurum eva abhigacchet [MU 1.2.12]. That is the injunction of the Vedas. Tad-vijnanartham. If you want to know what is your healthy life, normal life, spiritual life...

Spiritual life means normal life, and material life means diseased life. Therefore we are always suffering in materialistic way of life. Diseased condition means suffering. So when we have got suffering, how we can say, "It is normal life. It is healthy life"? The common sense. Can any materialistic way, those who are living in a materialistic, can say that "I am very happy"? No. That cannot be. That cannot be. This is diseased condition. One who is intelligent, he can understand that "This is diseased life. Why I am suffering?" That is intelligence.

Just like Sanatana Gosvami. He was minister, a very big post, government minister, chief man. Not only minister -- Nawab Hussain Shah entrusted the whole kingdom in his hand: "You manage, whatever you like." Because he knew that "Here is a trustworthy man. He'll do very nicely." And he was a Muhammadan Nawab, so he was engaged in hunting and dancing with girls. But he was confident that "Sanatana is there." His name was changed, Sakara Mallika... Dabira Khasa. His name was Dabira Khasa, and his brother Rupa Gosvami's name was Sakara Mallika. They almost became Muhammadan. Very responsible officer. When they wanted to resign, oh, Nawab Hussain Shah became topsy-turvied: "Oh, what do you say? I am depending on you. The whole thing is depending on you. And you want to resign? Oh, you have gone crazy. I cannot allow you." So actually... But he was thinking... Since he met Lord Caitanya, he was thinking that "I am diseased. What is the value of my this education and this post? I am diseased."

This is intelligence. People are enamored by so-called education, so-called high post or nationality or family or beauty or opulence. These things will not save. We are under the grip of material nature. The... Karmana daiva-netrena. You are working under the influence of certain material quality, and you are preparing your next life. You cannot say, "All right, I am very happy. I am... I'm born in America. My nation is very great nation, and we are very rich. So I shall, next life also, I shall come to America. I shall take my birth here and enjoy like this." Oh, that is not in your hand. That you cannot say. That is daiva-netrena. Daiva. Daiva means that is in the supernatural power. Daiva. The same thing: daivi hy esa gunamayi mama maya [Bg. 7.14]. You cannot say. Daiva-netrena. You are preparing your life. The higher authorities will give you chance. If you prepare yourself nicely, you get good chance; you get birth in higher planet. Or if you prepare himself, yourself nicely, then you go to Krsna even. Now it is your choice. It is your choice. But we must know that "What is my condition." If I am in darkness, I do not understand what is, in what condition I am living, this is conditional life. That's... Everyone can understand. That Sanatana Gosvami understood. And we should follow the footprints of Sanatana Gosvami.

So he understood that "Although I am minister, although I am very educated..." Educated, what do you mean by educated? He said, gramya-vyavahare kahe pandita: "Some, my neighbors, they call me very learned man, my neighbors." Gramya-vyavahare kahe pandita. Because he was minister, and he was Sanskrit scholar, Urdu scholar, actually, from scholastic point of view, very educated... So he was born in brahmana family. So people used to... A brahmana family. A brahmana is addressed as pandita. Pandita. Pandita means learned, because brahmana's business is to become learned. So he was called "Panditji." But he was thinking that "People call me very learned man, but what sort of learned man I am?" So he submitted his defects to Caitanya Mahaprabhu, that gramya-vyavahare kahe pandita, tai satya mani: "These people, my neighbors, they address me ‘Panditji,' a learned man, and I am also such a fool that I accept that I am very much learned." "Why you disagree that you are not learned? You are learned." Now, he said that tai satya mani, apanara hitahita kichui na jani: "I am so learned that I do not know what is my destination, what is good for me."

This is the position of conditional life. Everyone is thinking that "I am very learned," "I am very rich," "I am very opulent," but if you ask him that "Why you are suffering? Wherefrom you have come? Where you are going next life? What is God? What is your relationship with...," he is silent. He's silent. You ask anybody, any learned professor in the, in the university, these questions, and let him... He will simply answer, "Perhaps," "Maybe," "Like this," "Like that...," no definite answer, because he does not know. This is our conditional life. This is our conditional life, that we do not know our position.

Therefore the same principle, as Narada is asking Vyasadeva, that "You try to meditate upon the activities of the Supreme Lord." Tad-vicestitam, samadhina anusmara tad-vicestitam. "And you are already..." This, this meditation cannot be done by ordinary person. And that qualification he has got. He has already said that "You have got so many qualifications. So you can do that. And why you are, you shall meditate?" Now, the reason is, urukramasya akhila-bandha-muktaye: "You shall yourself be liberated from all conditional stage of life, and you shall be able to make others also." Unless you become liberated from the conditional life, you cannot make others liberated. You cannot imitate.

Caitanya Mahaprabhu says,

bharata-bhumite haila manusya-janma yara
janma sarthaka kari' kara para-upakara.
[Cc. Adi 9.41]

That is the message of Lord Caitanya, that "Anyone who has taken birth as a human being in the land of India, Bharatavarsa..." "India" is given by foreigners, a name to the country, but actual name is Bharatavarsa. Not only that portion, the whole, this whole planet is called Bharatavarsa. So Caitanya Mahaprabhu says that "Anyone who has taken birth on this land of Bharatavarsa, India," janma sarthaka kari', "just become, yourself, liberated, and then make others liberated." Para-upakara. "Just make yourself first liberated." Unless you are liberated, how you can make others liberated? If your hands are tied up, how you can open the hands of others? That is not possible. So therefore Narada Muni, he said the same thing, that urukramasya, urukramasya akhila-bandha-muktaye: "You just become yourself liberated and make others liberated."

Next verse is:

tato 'nyatha kincana yad vivaksatah
prthag drsas tat-krta-rupa-namabhih
na karhicit kvapi ca duhsthita matir
labheta vatahata-naur ivaspadam

Now, Vyasadeva can say, "Yes, I have already thought about the Supreme Personality of Godhead. I have inserted the activities of Krsna in the Battlefield of Kuruksetra -- His teachings, Bhagavad-gita -- in the Mahabharata." So Narada Muni says, "Yes, that you have done. I admit. But that will not help much." Just like Bhagavad-gita is being read practically all over the world, but they cannot understand. Why? The reason is, here it is stated, that na karhicit kvapi ca duhsthita matir labheta vatahata-naur ivaspadam: "The little idea of God is there, certainly, in every literature, every scripture, but those who are too much disturbed, they cannot accept it." Vata. Just like if your ship is on the ocean and it is being tossed by heavy wind, you cannot sit very nicely. I have got experience when I was coming to your country. So it is moving like that. "Similarly, those who are too much disturbed by these material affairs... Mahabharata is the history. So there are politics, sociology, intricacy, so many nonsense things, in which you have given Bhagavad-gita, little portion. That's all right. But that will not help very much."

The idea is that one has not only to understand little about God, but one has to live in God. Then his life will be successful. Not that "Yes, God is great, and I go weekly in the church or in the temple. I offer my respect." No, that will not make you liberated. You have to be very serious to understand your relationship with God and go back to Godhead. Then your life will be successful, not that simply by understanding little. No. That is the same position. Just like you cannot derive any benefit or you cannot sit down very nicely in a tottering ship, so if you keep your life always tottering... That tottering, that stage, or, I mean to say, what is called, tilting stage of life can be stopped only by devotional service, Krsna consciousness. Evam prasanna-manaso bhagavad-bhakti-yogatah [SB 1.2.20]. One has to make his life tranquil. How this is possible? By this Krsna consciousness. Otherwise, it is not possible. We have to disinfect us, counteract all result of sinful activities. Asat. Narottama dasa Thakura says that sat-sanga chadi' kainu asate vilasa, te-karane lagila ye karma-bandha-phansa. If we give up sat-sanga, association of Krsna consciousness or God consciousness, and if we simply take pleasure in the materialistic way of life, then we shall be entangled, simply entangled. Sat-sanga chadi kainu asate vilasa.

So people, generally, even though they have some kind of religion, all over the world, religion has become a secondary thing. Understanding of God, it is something like recreation, weekly recreation. That sort of life will not help. Of course, that is the beginning. That's nice. That is not bad. In the Bhagavad-gita, two classes of men have been described. One class of men:

na mam duskrtino mudhah
prapadyante naradhamah
mayayapahrta-jnana
asuram bhavam asritah
[Bg. 7.15]

There are two classes of men all over the world. One class of men is called deva, devata, or demigods, and one class of men are called demons. And what is the difference between demons and the demigods? The difference is, visnu-bhakto bhaved daiva asuras tad-viparyayah: "Those who are devotees of the Supreme Lord Visnu, they are demigods." Demigod does not mean that you have got a bigger head or so many legs or so... No. Simply this is the qualification: visnu-bhakto bhaved daiva. Only visnu-bhakta, not other, demigod's devotee. No. Visnu-bhakto bhaved daiva asuras tad-viparyayah. Just like Ravana. Ravana is designated as asura. Hiranyakasipu is designated as asura. Ravana is designated as raksasa. He was very civilized. He was materially very well-to-do. His kingdom was described as made..., "golden kingdom." Everything was there, but he's described as raksasa. Why? He was against Rama. That was his disqualification. (aside:) Don't bother now. That was his disqualification.
So visnu-bhakto bhaved daiva asuras tad-viparyayah. Unless, even after having all the qualifications, material qualifications, if one is simply nonsense about God, he is raksasa, or demon. That is the injunction, or that is the verdict of Vedas. You may have all material qualifications. That's all right. You may be very great man. You may be very well situated man, very much educated, but if you are godless, then you are demon. Visnu-bhakta... That is also confirmed in the Bhagavad-gita. Krsna says, na mam duskrtino mudhah prapadyante naradhamah [Bg. 7.15]. Duskrtinah. Duskrtinah means these rascals, these demons, these atheists, these godless men can act in any way for their sense gratification. They can do any sinful act, never mind, however grievous it may be. If it is applicable for their satisfaction of senses, they'll do it. They'll do it. They don't care anything. "Oh, I can satisfy my senses by this way. Never mind. Oh, we don't care for God, don't care for sin or hell or this or that. They are all simply allegory." Hedonism.

So whatever "ism" -- "ism" is nowadays there -- they were all experimental in Indian philosophy. Just like Carvaka Muni. He was atheist. Amongst the sages there are atheist philosophers also, as in the modern days there are atheist philosopher also. So this Carvaka Muni, he said, rnam krtva ghrtam pibet. Ghrtam. Ghrtam means butter, clarified butter. If you want to have very palatable dishes, then you require ghee. Without ghee, you cannot make. Either sweetball or kacuris, srngara,(?) so many nice things. So we require sweetball. So... And in India, of course, they wanted palatable dishes, but not otherwise it is made of ghee. But too much eating of these palatable dishes is not good. That makes our senses very strong. So we should not take much of it, but we can take something of krsna-prasadam and satisfy ourself. So he says that, Carvaka Muni, rnam krtva ghrtam pibet: "Beg, borrow or steal. Get some money and eat, as much as possible, ghee." You see? This is modern civilization. "Any way, bring money and satisfy your senses. That's all. Finish business."

So he, he propagated this philosophy, Carvaka Muni, that rnam krtva ghrtam pibet. In India, according to Vedic civilization, one is very much afraid of taking loan from others because he has conviction, "If I do not pay, then in my next life I'll have to pay many times. So I must liquidate my debt." That's a fact. If you take one cent from somebody else without doing something good to him or without exchanging something, then you are debtor, and you have to pay him with interest and compound interest. That is the law of karma. You cannot take anything. We are debtor to so many things. People have no idea. Devarsi-bhutapta-nrnam pitrnam [SB 11.5.41]. These are stated in the sastras, that we are indebted, debtor to the demigods. Just like we are getting so much sunlight. We are enjoying: "Oh, today is a very nice day." But do we pay any tax? Do we pay anything? No. But in the Vedic injunction there is sun-god worship. Therefore we find that so many demigods' worship, yajnas. The feeling that "I am taking so much advantage from the sunshine, so I must give him something," this is called sacrifice.

So everything is arranged by God. Everyone... Ekale isvara krsna ara saba bhrtya. Everyone is... So if you worship Krsna, then your everything is... Just like if you pay tax to the government, you satisfy all the department -- the vehicle department, this department, that, light department, water department. You pay once. Similarly, sarvarhanam acyutejya. Acyuta means Krsna. If anyone is not Krsna conscious, if he, one is not sacrificing for Krsna, he's becoming indebted to the demigods, to the sages, rsi. Rsi. Just like Narada Rsi is giving us good literature. He is instructing Vyasadeva, "Give this literature to the people." We are taking advantage of Srimad-Bhagavatam. Are we not debtor? We go to school, college, and pay so much fees to the teachers. Are we not debtor to Vyasadeva and Narada? But we don't care for it. So acyutejya. If you become Krsna conscious, naturally you will try to propagate the teachings of Bhagavad-gita and Srimad-Bhagavatam. That means you are paying. You have learned something from them, and you are distributing the knowledge. That was their mission. If you keep it for yourself, then you are simply debtor. You are not paying. So there are so many complications. So all these complications can be solved simply by Krsna consciousness. Sarvarhanam acyutejya. That is the verdict of Veda.

So the godless creature means they are demons. That is described in the Bhagavata. Asuram bhavam asritah. Asuri. Asuri-bhava means the attitude of a demon. "What is God? Oh, this is all nonsense. Who is God? I am God. Everyone is God. Oh, don't you see? So many Gods are loitering in the street. Why you are finding out another God?" These are the going on. Vivekananda said that "Why you are bothering yourself, finding out God? Don't you see, so many Gods are loitering in the street?" You see? So "God is loitering in the street, daridra-narayana. God has become daridra, poor, and He has come to my door to beg. God is suffering. God is..." Like that. Laksmi-sahasra-sata-sambhrama-sevyamanam [Bs. 5.29]. We read from Vedic literature that "God is being served by millions of goddesses of fortune" -- and He has become daridra, poor. Wherefrom he got this language, where, how he applied, I do not know.

Anyway, this godlessness, atheism, is called asuram bhavam, asuram bhavam. So those who are demons and naradhama... Na mam prapadyante mudhah duskrtino naradhamah, mayayapahrta-jnana asuram bhavam asritah [Bg. 7.15]. Demons. Demons, they are mudha -- mudha means rascal -- and duskrtina, always acting sinful. Their life is simply full of sinful activities. So Krsna consciousness cannot be accepted by persons who are full with sinful activities. That is not possible. That is not possible because in the Bhagavad-gita we understand, Krsna says, yesam anta-gatam papam: "One who has finished his sinful activities, or sinful life...," yesam anta-gatam papam jananam punya-karmanam, "always engaged in pious activities..." If you don't engage yourself in pious activities, naturally you'll be engaged...

Just like this child. He wants some activities. He's fortunate by the association. He is engaged with Jagannatha, with Hare Krsna, with Krsna's picture, with Prabhupada's picture. He's engaged. And chanting in his way, Hare Krsna. We must have engagement. But if the same child was not engaged in this way, he would be naughty. He would be doing something mischief, this way and that way. We must have engagement. Mayavadi philosophers, they do not understand it. They want to make stop. Of course, that stop, for the time being, may be. Just like if this child is very naughty, I can stop him: "Don't do this. Sit down here, silent." But how long he'll sit silently? He wants some engagement. Similarly, this meditation process is like that. They... In order to stop him for doing some nonsense activities, better let him sit down, like this. But how long he'll sit down like this? As soon as he is free from that so-called meditation, he will immediately engage himself in all nonsense activities.

Therefore he must have pious activities. These pious activities is the Krsna consciousness. Everyone is engaged for Krsna, working from morning to..., early rise in the morning, chant Hare Krsna, have arati, prepare prasadam, go, work, this way and that way. So we must have always engagement, pious activities. The same example. Otherwise, our nature is we must have some engagement, if not Krsna, then maya. You cannot be without engagement. Therefore Krsna says, yesam tv anta-gatam papam jananam punya-karmanam. Punya-karmanam means always being engaged in pious activities. And the most pious activity is Krsna consciousness, always be engaged in Krsna's service.

So in one way you stop your impious activities; in other way you improve your spiritual understanding in this way. Yesam anta-gatam papam jananam punya. Anta-gatam papam means you stop. Anta-gatam. So if you engage yourself in pious activities, in Krsna consciousness activities, where is the scope of dong nonsense work? Therefore it is stopped. Automatically it is stopped. So yesam anta-gatam papam jananam punya-karmanam, in this way, te dvandva-moha-nirmukta [Bg. 7.28]. They have no other engagement. They do not know anything else except Krsna. Dvandva-moha. Dvandva means duality, and illusion. Moha means illusion. Nirmukta: "He becomes liberated from these two things." Duality means "Whether I shall become Krsna conscious or this conscious, material conscious or this...?" This is duality, "Whether this or that?" But one who is firmly convinced... Vyavasayatmika buddhir ekeha kuru-nandana. One who is firmly convinced that krsne bhakti kaile sarva-karma krta haya: "If I become Krsna conscious, then every perfection is there," this conviction, then there is no duality, "Whether I shall do it or not do it?" "I must do it." Dvandva. And moha, and illusion. And except Krsna consciousness, everything is moha, illusion, except Krsna consciousness, all illusion.

So these things are stated in the Bhagavad-gita. Yesam anta-gatam papam jananam punya-karmanam, te dvandva-moha-nirmukta [Bg. 7.28]. Duality. Actually, we are monists. We do not know anything except Krsna. The Mayavadis, they say they are monists, but they're dualists. They say, brahma satyam jagan mithya. Why? Wherefrom the jagat come? If Brahman is satya, if the Absolute Truth is truth, then janmady asya yatah [SB 1.1.1], this world has emanated from the Absolute Truth. Then how it can be untruth? Does it mean that truth produces untruth? This is the defect of Mayavada philosophy. They are not actually monists. They are dualists. They are distinguishing Brahman and maya. But we say that only Krsna. Ekale isvara krsna ara saba bhrtya. Maya is the servant of Krsna. That is a, that is confirmed in Bhagavad-gita, in Brahma-samhita. In all the Vedic literature this is confirmed. In the Bhagavad-gita it is said, mayadhyaksena prakrtih suyate sa-caracaram: [Bg. 9.10] "This prakrti, this maya, this material energy, is acting under My superintendence, under My guidance."

So we don't accept this material nature as final. We have Krsna on the background, that He is, only, the master. So therefore we are monists. Simply we know Krsna and everything emanating from Krsna. That is described everywhere. In the Brahma-samhita the same truth is... Srsti-sthiti, srsti-sthiti-pralaya-sadhana-saktir eka chayeva yasya bhuvanani bibharti durga [Bs. 5.44]. This material energy is called Durga, but she is so powerful... Srsti-sthiti.... She can create wonderful things. She can maintain wonderful things. She can dissolve wonderful things, so powerful, but she is acting under the direction... Chayeva yasya bhuvanani bibharti durga. Chayeva. Just like shadow moves by the movement of the reality, similarly, this material nature is working under the direction of the Supreme.

Therefore, any way you, either way you go, if you become Krsna conscious, simply come to this understanding that Krsna is everything, and "By serving Krsna, all my objective, all my perfection is there" -- this conviction makes you perfect. And this is real, this is reality. There is no imposition. It is reality. Simply one has to understand. The same thing is expressed here by Narada, urukramasya. Who is urukrama? Wonderful actor. The wonderful actor is Krsna, Urukrama. So Narada Muni says, "Although you have mentioned in other puranas or in itihasa, Mahabharata, about Krsna, some of the activities of Krsna..." Just like this same thing, as I told you. So many people are reading Bhagavad-gita, but all nonsense. They do not understand what is Krsna, because they are disturbed. They are not situated in Krsna. Narada Muni says that "Be situated in Krsna. You write something, simply Krsna's activities." Akhila "Then you'll be liberated, and those who will stick to this principle, they'll be liberated."

Akhila-bandha-muktaye... Vipakse dosam anta, that "If you do not do this..." Sridhara Svami comments, vipakse. Vipakse means if you do not understand this philosophy, that simply Krsna consciousness can save the human race, then you are faulty. If you do not understand... If you understand it nicely, it is very good. But if you do not understand it, if you direct your activities in a, in a different way, then it is faulty. You'll never be happy. Because the whole thing has begun -- Vyasadeva was unhappy. Even after producing a literature like Vedanta-sutra, he was not happy, and Narada is giving him instruction how to become happy. Here is the answer, that "If you do not accept this proposition, that you have simply to be in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, then vipakse, it is just against your welfare." Vipakse dosantaram ahah tatah urukramasya vicestitam prthag drsah, athaiva anyatha prakarantrena yat kincit athantaram vipaksyatha taya vibaksaya itaih sphuritaih namabhis ca bhaktabhya:(?) "So whatever little activities of Krsna you have described..."

Just like people are understanding... By reading Bhagavad-gita, somebody is taking Krsna as a great politician. Everyone accept Krsna as a great personality, but somebody's accepting Him as a great politician, a great diplomat, or in this way, according to one's angle of vision. Just like in Bombay... There are in India and all over the world, I calculated, there are more than six hundred commentary on Bhagavad-gita, more than. And each one is presentation of the author's own view. One Doctor Rele(?) in Bombay, he has also explained Bhagavad-gita in his own way. He says that it is a talk between a diseased person, a patient, and the physician. Because he is physician, he has made Krsna as physician. Of course, Krsna is physician in other way. But he has tried to explain the medical science through the Bhagavad-gita -- anatomy, physiology, medicine, like that. Just like Gandhi, he wanted to prove Bhagavad-gita as nonviolence. In this way, everyone is trying. But actually who is understanding Krsna? That is being explained by Narada, that "In this way, people will misunderstand. You simply apply, simply write and explain the science of Krsna."

Therefore in the, from the Srimad-Bhagavatam, from the beginning, Vyasadeva offers his obeisances to the Supreme, satyam param dhimahi, janmady asya yatah: [SB 1.1.1] "I am just offering my obeisances unto the Supreme Absolute Truth, who is the source of everything." And in the beginning he also writes, om namo bhagavate vasudevaya. Then he aims Krsna. Vasudeva means Krsna. But he explains philosophically what Krsna is: janmady asya yatah anvayat itaratas ca arthesu abhijnah [SB 1.1.1]. "Krsna, the Vasudeva, is the original source of everything." Janmady asya yatah. That is the Vedanta philosophy.

So under instruction of Narada he... So Narada says that "If you do not, I mean to say, cent percent simply be in Krsna consciousness, then it will be faulty. I admit that you have mentioned something about Krsna's activities in other literatures like Mahabharata and other Puranas, but that will not do." Yate kadacit kvapi visaya kono sthanam:(?) "That will not be very steady understanding of Krsna." Vatahata-agunvitah naur iva:(?) "Just like you cannot be steady on the ocean when there is tossing wind," I mean to say, "there is hurricane, you must be always tilting, similarly, unless we are firmly convinced about Supreme Lord, we must be tilting. So that, you must prepare some literature by which one shall be firmly steady, steadily convinced about Krsna consciousness, God consciousness." Vatahata-agunvita, yad uktam gitasuh.(?) And here also, Sridhara Svami... Gita is so authoritative that he, he is giving quotation from Bhagavad-gita,

vyavasayatmika buddhir
ekeha kuru-nandana
bahu-sakha hy anantas ca
buddhayo 'vyavasayinam

Bhagavad-gita also, Krsna says, vyavasayatmika buddhih... Those who are convinced for making a sure progress of life, he's called niscayatmika buddhih. That is determination. Drdha-vrata, drdha-vrata. These are Sanskrit words: "firmly convinced, steady." They have got only one business, one business. Vyavasayatmika buddhir ekeha...bahu-sakha hy anantas ca buddha... Those who are not steady, they have got many business, many business. Why many? If that one is the source of everything, take that one.

The example is that just like the root of the tree is the source of distribution of energy. Then pour water in the root, not in the leaves, not in the branches. So people are enamored by the branches and leaves and flowers. They are inventing so many societies, humanitarian societies, altruistic societies, nonviolent societies, United Nation, this, that, all nonsense. Simply concentrate in Krsna consciousness movement. Everything will be right. That they do not know. Vyavasayatmika buddhir ekeha... One. This is intelligence, how to act. Just work on one switch, and everything will be right. That they do not know.

So we have got very great responsibility to spread this Krsna consciousness movement to the world. By switching on this Krsna consciousness, you solve all the problems, as much as by pouring water in the root of the tree, all energy is distributed to the tree -- to the leaves, to the twigs, to the flowers, to the leaves. Thousands and millions of leaves are there and flowers are... Everything will be nourished. Just like putting your foodstuff through one way. The rascal says that "You can accept any way." No! Only one way: Krsna consciousness. You cannot supply foodstuff to your body by so many holes. You have got nine holes in your body. One hole, this hole. You have to supply food to, not this hole, rectum.

Devotee: But the navel you can... Sometimes it does that...

Prabhupada: When you are diseased. That is not normal. And if you have to take food from rectum for many days, then you finished.

So this is the philosophy taught by Narada Muni to Vyasadeva, and Vyasadeva taught to Madhvacarya. So this Krsna consciousness movement is on that authority and Krsna also. Krsna taught Brahma, Brahma taught Narada, Narada taught Vyasadeva. Vyasadeva taught... In this way, evam parampara-praptam imam rajarsayo viduh [Bg. 4.2]. In the Fourth Chapter of Bhagavad-gita it is said, "By this disciplic succession..." So our business is not to make any research work, not to invent something, not to write voluminous books, something mental concoction. We have got everything ready, given by this, received through the parampara system. Everything, real fact, real goods, not bogus things. So we have to simply accept. Just like Caitanya Mahaprabhu says, amara ajnaya guru hana tara' ei desa, yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. Caitanya Mahaprabhu says that "Every one of you just become... Each and every one of you become a spiritual master under My order." "Oh, so what is Your order?" Yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa: [Cc. Madhya 7.128] "Whomever you meet, simply you say what Krsna has spoken or what about Krsna has been spoken." The Krsna has spoken the Bhagavad-gita. You simply speak about Bhagavad-gita. And this Bhagavata is also spoken about Krsna. This is also krsna-katha; that is also krsna-katha. One is spoken directly by Krsna, and the other is spoken about Krsna. So they're practically the same thing. So Caitanya Mahaprabhu recommends that yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa: [Cc. Madhya 7.128] "You simply deliver the instruction of Krsna, and you become a spiritual master."

So you haven't got to make yourself very learned scholar or... Just like a postal peon. He's not necessarily very learned scholar or even a very literary man. His only business is to take the envelope and put it in the right place. That's all. Similarly, to spread this Krsna consciousness, you haven't got to become a very learned scholar or literary man. You have simply to understand... Sravanam kirtanam. You hear and spread this. People will be happy. Akhila-bandha-muktaye. They will be liberated from all problems. It is so nice thing.

Thank you very much. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.13 -- New Vrindaban, June 16, 1969

"Don't Call It Religion"

Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.14
June 18, 1969, New Vrndavana

Srila A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

Prabhupada:

tato 'nyatha kincana yad vivaksatah
prthag drsas tat-krta-rupa-namabhih
na karhicit kvapi ca duhsthita matir
labheta vatahata-naur ivaspadam

Now we are discussing instruction of Narada to his disciple, Vyasadeva. Such a learned scholar, Vyasadeva. He's known as Vedavyasa, the authority on all Vedic literature. And he's supposed to be incarnation of Narayana, exalted position. Still, he requires the instruction of a spiritual master. That is the way of Vedic way. Avaroha-pantha, aroha-pantha. Aroha-pantha means inductive process. To know from here, from the lower status to the higher status, speculative method, or ascending process. And avaroha-pantha is deductive process, getting knowledge from higher authorities. So our Vedic understanding is to receive knowledge from the authorities. That is perfect knowledge.

So there are three kinds of processes to receive knowledge: pratyaksa, aitihya and sabda. Pratyaksa means by direct perception, experimental knowledge. And aitihya, or anumana. Anumana, hypothesis, "It may be like this," "Perhaps like this." Just like modern scientists say, "Perhaps it is like this." That is called anumana, hypothesis. And another process is sabda-pramana. Sruti-pramana. Sabda means sound vibration, and sruti means aural reception. So out of three processes, the sabda-pramana, or receiving vibration, sound vibration from authorities by aural reception, that is considered to be the perfect.

So Narada Muni says... Before this, Narada Muni has advised Vyasadeva that "In order to release all these conditioned souls, you just describe the wonderful activities of the Supreme Personality of Godhead." Simply by hearing... Uttama-slokasya gunanuvadat. Uttama-sloka. Uttama-sloka means the Supreme Lord who is described by transcendental literature or very fine, scholarly language. He's called Uttama-sloka. Uttama-slokasya urukramasya. "That will save all conditioned souls from being implicated in the clutches of maya." Now, Vyasadeva has already described... He has made many puranas, eighteen puranas. So there is mention of God's activities. Just like in Mahabharata he has put this Bhagavad-gita. So Narada Muni says that prthag drsas tat-krta-rupa-namabhih, tato 'nyatha kincana yad vivaksatah: "If you do not exceptionally, exclusively describe simply the pastimes of the uncommon activities of the Lord, the other way, as you have given as a sidelight, as you have described Bhagavad-gita, the activities of Krsna as a sideline, not..." Actually, the whole Mahabharata is full of activities of Krsna, but Krsna is only a scene in the Mahabharata. He's speaking in the Battlefield of Kuruksetra. So Narada Muni says, "That sort of description will not be very much congenial, because the people are not steady. Their anxiety... Their mind is disturbed in so many ways exactly like a boat moving in the tossing of the waves of the sea. So this sort of understanding of God will not give them much benefit. You describe completely on the pastimes, on the activities of the Supreme Lord. That will give people release from these material clutches."

So the next verse says... Vyasadeva may say that "Sir, I have already compiled so many books, eighteen puranas, Mahabharata, even Vedanta-sutra. So are they not sufficient literature to revive Krsna consciousness?" So in reply to that, Narada says,

jugupsitam dharma-krte 'nusasatah
sva-bhava-raktasya mahan vyatikramah

Sva-bhava-raktasya mahan vyatikramah. Sva-bhava-raktasya means by nature. Just like Vedic scripture says, "By nature every living entity has a propensity for sex life, for intoxication." Loke vyavayamisa-madya-seva nitya hi jantoh. Jantoh means living entities. Nitya. So long he is in contact with this material world, he has got a natural propensity for sex life and intoxication. Vyavaya means sex life, and amisa means meat-eating. Amisa, meat-eating. Sex life, meat-eating, and madya-seva. Madya-seva means intoxication, drinking liquor. It is not unnatural. To drink wine or liquor or to eat meat and to have free sex life, that is the desire of all conditioned souls. Therefore, sva-bhava-raktasya, "by nature." Nobody is taught in the educational institution how to drink, or how to eat meat or how to enjoy sex life. Natural. That is natural. Sva-bhava-raktasya. "And if these things you describe as dharma, as religious principles, then they are doomed."

Just like a man is addicted to commit theft. He has got a habit of stealing. And if I say, "Stealing is very nice art. You can go on with you, with it," then where is the reformation? There is no question of... He, he's already addicted. So it is encouragement. So similarly, in the dharma-sastra... Just like in Mahabharata there is... (aside:) Where is that "cut cut" noise? Don't make that sound. Just like in marriage ceremony. Marriage ceremony... Of course, in your country, the marriage ceremony is different. In India still, the people spend as much as possible in the marriage ceremony, millions of dollars. If one man is rich, he'll spend for his son's marriage or daughter's marriage. That is a great credit. "Oh, this man is very rich man. He's spending so much money." So there are so many religious performances, ritualistic performances. You have to spend money. So you must find out so many performances. So they have all these in the sastras.

So Narada Muni says that "What is this, marriage ceremony? The marriage ceremony is to allow the boy and the girl for legitimate sex life. That's all. So that propensity he has already got. And what is the use of making such propaganda and spending so much money?" Very practical proposition. But in the sastras there are. Similarly, drinking or meat-eating. According to Vedic sastra, meat-eating is not allowed by purchasing from the slaughterhouse. No. They... There is motive. The marriage ceremony or the meat-eating, the so much ritualistic performances, there is motive. What is that motive? Motive is restriction. Just like the same example, marriage: the real idea is to restrict the boy and the girl to one woman and one man. That is the idea, main idea. If he's not married, then he will be just like cats and dogs. So idea is very good. But Narada Muni says, "After all, you're coming to the point of sex life. So why so much propaganda?" Similarly, for meat-eating, there is also sanction in the sastras, tamasika-sastra, not sattvika. There are three divisions of sastra -- sattvika, rajasika and tamasika. Those who are meat-eaters, cannot give up meat-eating, for them, the prescription is, "All right, you can eat meat, but you have to sacrifice one goat, but not cow." The... For sacrifice the animal is recommended: goat. So you can, I mean to say, cut throat of a goat in the presence of goddess Kali and you can eat. There are so many prescriptions. But that is also restriction, that Kali-worship is one day in a month, on the dark moon day. What is called, dark moon? Amavasya. Full moon and...? Eh? No, no, no. When there is... On that particular..., there is no moon in the sky.

Hayagriva(?): The dark of the moon.

Prabhupada: It is called dark moon, yes. So that Kali-puja is recommended on the dark moon day. The... That is one day in a month. Similarly, according to marriage life, the sex life is also allowed one day in a month. The whole thing is restriction. Similarly, drinking wine also, there is Devi-puja. That is also once in a year or something like that. The whole point is restriction. But after all, this is drinking and mating and meat-eating.

So Narada Muni says that "You have described these things for which a man has got natural propensity in a religious form. So it is jugupsitam. This is most abominable." Just see. Even the restricted system of marriage, drinking and meat-eating, described in the sastra, that is also condemned by Narada. Jugupsitam. Jugupsitam dharma-krte 'nusasatah: "You are the leader of the sastras. You are writing sastras. People will follow you." Just like in Vedic, Vedas, there is recommendation of sacri..., in the sacrifice, animal-killing, but that animal-killing is not killing. This... There was a discussion between Lord Caitanya and Chand Kazi, the Muhammadan magistrate. That story perhaps you know, that He started civil disobedience movement. And the brahmanas of Navadvipa, they complained to the Muhammadan ma... At that time, Bengal was being governed by Pathans, Muhammadans, and so there was Muhammadan magistrate called Kazi Saheb. So the brahmanas, they lodged complaint to the Kazi Saheb that "This boy, Nimai Pandita, He has started one movement, Hare Krsna, and people are being enthused, excited to chant this Hare Krsna mantra, and He is making propaganda that "Simply by chanting Hare Krsna, you'll get all perfection." So the brahmanas thought that "If this boy makes propaganda and popularize this Hare Krsna movement, then, oh, what about ourself?" They were priestly class. "Then how we will live?" So they lodged complaint to the Chand Kazi that "He's doing something against our Vedic rituals. It is not Hindu religion. And..." Of course, he was Muhammadan magistrate, but after all, he was meant for giving justice to the people. So when big brahmanas complained, he took action and he sent some constables to warn the followers of Lord Caitanya that "You are disturbing. You are disturbing, this Hare Krsna chanting. You cannot do this. There is complaint."

So Caitanya Mahaprabhu was informed that "The Chand Kazi has warned us not to chant Hare Krsna. What shall we do?" Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, "Don't care. Go on chanting. Go on chanting." So then, when the magistrate saw that they have not stopped, then he sent some constables and government police force, who broke their mrdangas and dispersed the crowd. So this information was given to Caitanya Mahaprabhu, and He said, "All right, then we shall, I mean to say, issue this civil disobedience." So He called for many thousands of people. He was very popular. This incidence shows that even He was at that time sixteen-years-old boy, He was so learned, Nimai Pandita, that He defeated a great scholar, and at the same time, He was very popular because by His simple calling, many hundred thousands of people gathered with mrdangas, and they began kirtana in the street and went to the house of that Kazi.

So at that time Kazi thought that "This is a mass movement. So my order will not be... There will be some disturbance." So he came to his senses. Then he wanted to make some compromise with Caitanya Mahaprabhu. And first of all there was some discussion, because he was also very learned scholar, Chand Kazi, and Caitanya Mahaprabhu was also very learned scholar. So first of all he compromised, Chand Kazi, "Nimai, You are a boy, and in our village relationship You are just my nephew because Your grandfather, Your mother's father, I call him ‘Caca.' " Caca means uncle. "So, in that sense, Your mother is my sister. So You are my nephew. Why You are so angry upon Your uncle?" So He said, "Yes, My dear uncle, I have come My uncle's house to be received very nicely, but you went upstairs. Why? I am very glad that you have come down." In this way, the things were... Then He first of all asked Chand Kazi, "Yes, My dear uncle..." He was maternal uncle, mamu... Mamu or mama. Mama means maternal uncle. "My dear mama, Uncle, what is your religion, that you eat your father and mother?" That was His challenge, first. "What sort of religion you have got?" He said, "What You say? We eat our father...?" "Yes, because you eat cow. So cow gives you milk. She's your mother. You drink milk and kill your mother. And the bull, she (he) helps you in agricultural..., producing grains just like father gives you grains to eat. So you are killing your father and mother. How is that?"

So Chand Kazi was also very learned scholar. He said, "Well, this cow-killing is also recommended in Your Vedas, because there is cow sacrifice." So Caitanya Mahaprabhu replied... Now, we should know it that the animal sacrifice, according to the Vedic scripture, that is not killing. That is explained by Caitanya Mahaprabhu. He said that "In the previous time, this cow sacrifice was actually being done. That's all right. But that was not for killing. That -- to give the cow, the old cow or bull, a new life. By the power of mantra, just to give evidence of the Vedic mantras, the brahmanas would sacrifice a cow, old cow or old bull, in the fire and give, give him, again, new life. That was... No, in this age, there is no such powerful brahmana who can chant the mantras rightly and give again rejuvenation, another new life. It is not possible. Therefore in the sastras, these sort of sacrifices are forbidden."

asvamedham gavalambham
sannyasam pala-paitrkam
devarena sutotpattim
kalau panca vivarjayet
[Cc. Adi 17.164]

So there was nice discussion, and the compromise was that "No more Your sankirtana movement will be checked by my men."

So the point is that although in the Vedic scripture there is recommendation that animal sacrifice allowed, but that is not meant for killing. That is giving a new life. So when this animal sacrifice was going on simply for eating, simply for eating... Just like in a particular mission they say that "We are devotees of goddess Kali." Their real mission is to eat meat. Therefore they have become devotees of goddess Kali. But actually, these sacrifices were not meant, as explained by Caitanya Mahaprabhu, for killing the animals. That was to test the power, the strength, of the Vedic mantras. So Lord Buddha's movement was therefore started... When people began to eat meat like anything on the plea of Vedic sacrifice, so Lord Buddha, at that time -- Lord Buddha means he's also incarnation of Krsna -- he appeared to stop this animal killing. That is the prayer of Lord Buddha we sing:

nindasi yajna-vidher ahaha sruti-jatam
sadaya-hrdaya darsita-pasu-ghatam
kesava dhrta-buddha-sarira jaya jagadisa hare

The buddha-sarira... We offer prayer to Nrsimhadeva,

tava kara-kamala-vare nakham adbhuta-srngam
dalita-hiranyakasipu-tanu-bhrngam
kesava dhrta-narahari-rupa jaya jagadisa hare

Similarly, there is prayer for Lord Buddha also. The, that prayer is: nindasi yajna-vidher ahaha sruti-jatam, "Although in the Vedic literature there is recommendation for animal sacrifice, you are forbidding, ‘No, this should not be done.' " Therefore Buddhism is not Vedic religion, because he was against this Vedic sacrifice. Sadaya-hrdaya darsi... His main business was to stop this animal killing, but people wanted to give evidence from the Vedas. Therefore he said, "I don't care for your Vedas." Veda na maniya bauddha haila nastika. Therefore Sankaracarya came, and he drove away the Buddhists from the land of India. That's a long history.

So this sacrifice, this animal killing, that is also forbidding, that... Narada Muni said that "Why you have bothered your head in that, that way, that you have made this, this is a type of religion?" Jugupsitam: "This is abominable." Jugupsitam dharma-krte 'nusasatah: "You are authority, and if you recommend animal sacrifice, they will take it. They have got already natural tendency, and they will accept it, ‘This is the religious process.' And when they will be forbidden by other, saner persons, they'll not care for it. So it is jugupsitam. It is abominable." Jugupsitam dharma-krte 'nusasatah sva-bhava-raktasya mahan vyatikramah: "It's a great mistake you have done." Yad-vakyato dharma ititarah sthitah: "They'll accept you authority, and they'll be steady in that assertion, in that conviction." And na manyate tasya nivaranam: "And if you say..." Just like in other religious principles, if we say that "Don't eat meat..." I had some conversation with some Christian priests. They put forward this argument, "Why should we not eat? Our Christ took flesh. And why should we not? We must do it." They say like that. But Christ said that "You should... You shall not kill." So they cannot give any proper explanation why they kill. So in every religion... In Muhammadan religion, there...

So if, if this killing process or this drinking process, or this, which a man has got natural, that is excited under the name of religion, then Narada says, "Then when actually they will be forbidden for higher elevation of life, they'll not accept it. Therefore your description in the sastras of all these nonsense, jugupsitam, is abominable." Jugupsitam dharma-krte 'nusasatah sva-bhava-rakta... "The natural tendency, this. You should not incite them more and more." Here it is said that patrka viruddham eva. It is against... Jatam ita jugupsitam. Jugupsitam nindam kama karmadi(?). Jugupsitam. Sridhara Svami gives note, nindam: abominable; kama karma... Kama karma means that fruitive result. You do, act something, and you want to enjoy the fruit. That is called kama karma. Karma, akarma, vikarma. There are three kinds of activities. First karma is prescribed duties. And akarma means to do act, but the result is not enjoyable by you. And there is vikarma. Vikarma means doing against. So this kama karma. People are engaged in ritualistic ceremony for receiving some result for sense gratification. That is nindam. That is abominable. Nindam.

Sva-bhavata eva raktasya ragina purusasya dharma-krte, dharmartham anusasas tatah mahan vyatikramah(?): "So this is not good for you. It is most abominable." Kutah iti utah yasyeti vakyatah ayam mukhya dharma: "Because they will accept you as authority, and they will think this is religion." They will not make further progress. They will stick to that principle. So therefore it is abominable. Yatasya kama karmadi anyayena tattva-jnanena kriyamanaya(?). Tattva-jnanena. When they'll be advised higher truth... Just like those who are addicted to killing process under the shadow of religious rights, if they are said that "You don't kill. This is not good. After all, this living entity is as good as you are. As you are also part and parcel of Krsna, or God, similarly, this cow, or this animal, is also part and parcel of the Supreme Lord, but he has got a different dress only. That does not mean that you should kill..." If these things are instructed for higher elevation of life, they will not accept. They will not accept. They will say, "Oh, my religion says this. So I must do it."

Tasya nivaranam janah. Raktasya karma nivaram nivaranam samatam etad na manyate kintu pravrtti margam anuviyukta vesan tada vidhi kalpa vidhi(?): "Because he has got already natural tendency. And if he is, there is sanction by religiosity, ritualistic, religious process, then he will stick to it. So you have not done very nice work." That is... Na manyate tasya nivaranam janah. Vicaksano 'syarhati veditum vibhor ananta-parasya nivrttitah sukham: "Because actually, if anyone wants real happiness, that happiness is not by gratifying your senses." In the Bhagavad-gita also it is said that sukham atyantikam yat tad atindriya-grahyam. Real happiness, that is not perceived by this gratification of these material senses. So nivrttitah. One has to cease from this material sense gratification, and then he can enjoy the real happiness, which is transcendental to sense enjoyment. That is... That is the instruction.

In the, in the Padma Purana also there is a verse, ramante yogino 'nante: "Those who are yogis..." Yogi means transcendentalist, not the so-called yogi. Those who have contacted the Absolute Truth, they are called yogis. So yoginah, actually a yogi, ramante, they enjoy. They also enjoy. Why they are, I mean to say, undergoing so much austerities and penances and regulative principles? Because they are trying for being elevated to the real platform of happiness. So ramante yogino 'nante. Everyone is hankering after happiness, either materialistic or spiritualistic, but the difference is that materialistic, materialistic persons, they are satisfied with temporary happiness, and those who are transcendentalists, they are also seeking happiness. That is real happiness, spiritual happiness, eternal happiness. So therefore it is stated in the Padma Purana that ramante yogino 'nante. Anante means unlimited happiness. They enjoy unlimited happiness. Ramante yogino 'nante. And satyanande. And that is real happiness. Happiness does not mean it is for few minutes. No. Happiness should continue, eternally. One should be situated in that happiness so that other, temporary happiness will not attract him.

So ramante yogino 'nante satyanande cid-atmani. Cit, cit means that he's full of knowledge. That is not in ignorance. This material happiness is in ignorance. And spiritual happiness is suddha-sattva. Suddha-sattva means pure goodness. In the material world there are three stages: ignorance, passion and goodness. The goodness platform is very nice in the material world, but there is another platform, which is called suddha-sattva. Sattvam visuddham, visuddham vasudeva-sabditam. That is transcendental platform, and in that platform you can understand God. God is Vasudeva, and in the vasudeva platform... So ramante yogino 'nante satyanande cid-atmani. That is cid-atmani. Cit means knowledge; atmani means self. In that platform. Iti rama-padenasau param brahmabhidhiyate. This is the description, this is the meaning of the word rama. Rama, this word, comes from ramante, ram. Ram-dhatu. Ram means enjoyment. And rama means the full of pleasure. If you contact with Rama, or Krsna, the absolute attractive, then you are placed in the absolute platform for eternal enjoyment.

Enjoyment is the goal of everyone's life. But the difference is that the materialist is trying to hanker after flickering enjoyment, and the transcendentalists, they are hankering after the spiritual enjoyment, or eternal enjoyment. Enjoyment... Anandamayo 'bhyasat. Because enjoyment is our life. We cannot be void. That is not possible. Therefore the impersonalists, about impersonalists, this Bhagavata version is that although they rise up almost to the spiritual platform, but because they cannot enjoy... Impersonalists means there is no enjoyment. There is simply light, a life of knowledge. But simply knowledge will not make me happy. I must enjoyment. I must have enjoyment. Anandamayo 'bhyasat, because my nature is to enjoy. That enjoyment cannot be done in the impersonal or void philosophy. That is not possible. Therefore Bhagavata says, ye 'nye 'ravindaksa vimukta-maninah: "If somebody thinks that he has become liberated after undergoing the process of impersonal philosophy and austerities and penances..." The impersonalists, they also practice severe penances to attain to that Brahman stage. That is also nice thing. But they cannot stay there, because there is no enjoyment.

Therefore, as I was saying the other day, that many sannyasis, they say that "This world is false; Brahman is truth." So in spite of their rising to that platform of Brahman understanding, they again come down. That is described in the Bhagavatam, aruhya krcchrena param padam tatah: [SB 10.2.32] "After undergoing severe penances and austerities, they may rise to the Brahman platform but again falls down." Why falls down? Anadrta-yusmad-anghrayah: "Because they do not enjoy Your association." They have neglected the association of Krsna and company. Therefore they have no, I mean to say, shelter. The same example can be explained: just like if you go on a plane or sputnik very high, very high, it is void, all side void. If you go very high, 25,000 miles, you'll see void. But that, there you cannot stay. You can travel for many years in that void, but if you don't take shelter in a planet, then you'll come back again to this planet. Similarly, the impersonalists, they cannot stay in their impersonal understanding. Simply they suffer some trouble. Klesa... Bhagavad-gita says, kleso 'dhikataras tesam avyaktasakta-cetasam [Bg. 12.5]. Those who are attached, those who are attached to that impersonal feature of the Absolute Truth, they undergo greater trouble. We transcendentalists, we personalists, we also, from the materialistic point, we are... Our standard of living is not very opulent. We lie down anywhere. We are... Our dresses are not so clean. Our rooms are not clean. From the materialistic point of view, somebody comes. He says, "Oh. How wretched these people are living!" That is also another kind of austerity. They have adopted. But that is pleasing. Even they are in so-called wretched condition, they are happy. They are happy. So they're in both ways. But those who are simply attached to the impersonal feature, their trouble is more painful. That is described in the Bhagavad-gita.

So vicaksano 'syarhati veditum vibhoh. So one has to cease. One has to make a stop of this material enjoyment. Then one can approach to the spiritual enjoyment. You cannot enjoy spiritual life if you stick to the materialistic way of... Therefore we have got so..., a little restriction, that "You cannot do this." Although those who are addicted to this life, this restriction is sometimes painful, but it is required. Unless... Just like to cure your disease, you have to follow some regulative principle prescribed by the physician, similarly, in order to cure yourself from this material disease, you have to accept. Nivrttitah. Nivrttitah means ceasing this process of material life. Nivrttitah sukham, pravartamanasya gunair anatmanas tato bhavan darsaya cestitam vibhoh.

So how it can be achieved, nivrtti, ceasing this materialistic way of life? So Narada Muni says that "You simply describe the activities of the Lord, Krsna, and by hearing simply the activities of Krsna, one will be very easily able to cease from this materialistic way of life." Caitanya Mahaprabhu also recommended that people should be given chance to hear Srimad-Bhagavatam or krsna-katha. Krsna-katha means speaking or, I mean to say, narration about Krsna. So Bhagavad-gita and Srimad-Bhagavatam. Caitanya Mahaprabhu also recommended that "Let them be situated in their own position. There is no necessity of changing his position. Give him chance. Give him chance to hear. Then gradually..." Param vijayate sri-krsna-sankirtanam.

So our attempt is... We are opening so many branches. The idea is that people should get chance of hearing about the Supreme Lord, either by chanting this maha-mantra or... This is also chanting. What I am speaking before you from Srimad-Bhagavatam or Bhagavad-gita, that is also chanting. This is also kirtana. Kirtana means describing. So you can describe the glories of the Lord either by musical instruments or by chant, singing, or you can describe the glories of the Lord by reading from authoritative scripture. Both of them are called kirtana. This, this Bhagavata reading is also described as kirtana by Sukadeva Gosvami. Abhavad vaiyasakih kirtane. Kirtane. It is called kirtana. Sravanam kirtanam. The process is sravana and kirtana, hearing and chanting. So Pariksit Maharaja, he attained salvation and perfection simply by hearing. And Sukadeva Gosvami attained salvation and perfection simply by chanting. This chanting means describing the glories of the Lord from Srimad-Bhagavatam.

So he says, pravartamanasya gunair anatmanas tato bhavan darsaya cestitam: "People are so much entangled by the modes of material nature. So in order to get them free from this entanglement, you show the path. Simply let them hear. Let them give aural reception to the wonderful activities of the Lord. That activity..." Because absolute... Krsna is Absolute Truth. So Krsna and Krsna's activities are the same because it is absolute. It is not duality. In the material world, myself and my activities are different. But it is the... This world is dual world. But in the absolute world, Krsna and Krsna's pastimes, Krsna and Krsna's name, Krsna and Krsna's quality, Krsna and Krsna's fame, they're all Krsna. Krsna and Krsna's associates, they're all Krsna. Krsna is cowherd boy. So Krsna and the cows, they're all Krsna. That we have to learn. They're not different from Krsna. Krsna and the gopis, they're all Krsna. Ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhih. So we have to understand that.

So any way, if we try to associate, simply by chanting or hearing, that means we are associating with Krsna. And the more we associate with Krsna, the more we become purified. Just like more you remain with the fire, you become warmer, warmer, warmer. And one day you become so warm you exactly like fire. The example I have given that if you put an iron rod in the fire, it becomes warm, warmer, warmest, and then it becomes red. And when it is red, it is no longer iron. It is fire. Similarly, simply by chanting and hearing you spiritualize yourself. So a day will come when this material body also will be fully spiritualized. The... That fully spiritualized means there will be no more material activities; simply these spiritual activities will be there.

So Narada Muni is instructing Vyasadeva, and we shall discuss next meeting. Thank you very much. (end)

>>> Ref. VedaBase => Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.5.14 -- New Vrindaban, June 18, 1969