Pradyumna: (leads chanting, etc.) "Translation: I do not know what is beneficial for me and what is detrimental. Nonetheless, in ordinary dealings people consider me a learned scholar, and I am also thinking of myself as such."
Prabhupada:
apanara hitahita kichui na jana!
gramya-vyavahare pandita tai satya mani
So in India, still, a brahmana is called pandita, panditaji. Just like you know our Prime Minister was Pandita Jawaharlal Nehru. He happened to be a Sarasvata brahmana. Sanatana Gosvami, he also a Sarasvata brahmana by caste. But he has placed himself:
nica jati nica-sangi patita adhama
kuvisaya-kupe padi' gonainu janama
He could understand that "These people call me pandita." Pandita means one who knows everything. The ultimate pandita is mentioned in the Bhagavad-gita, panditah sama-darsinah [Bg. 5.18]. Pandita means he sees every living entity on the equal level. That is real pandita. Panditah sama-darsinah.
vidya-vinaya-sampanne
brahmane gavi hastini
suni caiva sva-pake ca
panditah sama-darsinah
[Bg. 5.18]
He's really pandita. That is spiritually. And material pandita, that is also mentioned by Canakya Pandita, his moral instruction. He gives description of a pandita:
matrvat para-daresu
para-dravyesu lostravat
atmavat sarva-bhutesu
yah pasyati sa panditah
He never said that anyone who has passed his M.A. degree or Ph.D. degree, he is pandita. No. The test of pandita is here, from moral instruction, that anyone who sees all other woman except his wife as mother, he is pandita. Just see. This is the test. Matrvat para-daresu and para-dravyesu, other's property as garbage in the street, nobody touches. And atmavat sarva-bhutesu, and treat everyone as his own self. If anyone has learned these three things, then he is pandita. And spiritually, when one sees that all living entities, may be in different types of bodies, he is spirit soul, part and parcel of God, then he is pandita.
brahma-bhutah prasannatma
na socati na kanksati
samah sarvesu bhutesu
mad-bhaktim labhate param
[Bg. 18.54]
So these are Vedic instructions, and Sanatana Gosvami, although he was a minister in Muhammadan government, Nawab Hussain Shah's, but in touch with Caitanya Mahaprabhu, he has come to his knowledge that gramya-vyavahare pandita: "Actually, I am not pandita, but in village, in ordinary common sense, because I happen to be a brahmana, they call me pandita. I also accept as pandita. But my real position is that I am such a pandita, such a learned man, that I do not know what is good for me. This is my position." He is submitting to Caitanya Mahaprabhu, his guru. Why guru is necessary? Tad vijnanartham. When we are perplexed that "I do not know what is my actually goal of life, what is benefit here for me..." Just like Arjuna did. When he was talking with Krsna on equal terms, two friends... But when he saw that the actual solution is not coming, then he submitted himself to Krsna, that "Krsna, now we are not friends. We are friends, but treat me as Your disciple." Sisyas te 'ham sadhi mam tvam prapannam [Bg. 2.7]. So "Make me pandita. I am talking all foolishly. I am ksatriya, it is my duty to fight and I am denying it. I know that I am deviating from my duties. So how it has happened? What is the cause? So kindly, sisyas te, I am submitting myself before You as Your student. Sadhi mam prapannam, I am surrendering."
So one has to learn the philosophy of life from the person superior, spiritual master. Tad-vijnanartham sa gurum evabhigacchet [MU 1.2.12]. Do not remain puffed-up, that "I am all-learned, I know everything." That is false. One has to submit. In order to know the solution of life, we have to submit to the proper spiritual master. That is essential. Tad-vijnanartham sa gurum evabhigacchet. This is Vedic injunction. This abhigacchet, this word is used when it is meant "must." There is no escape. We have seen big, big personalities... Just like Caitanya Mahaprabhu; He is Krsna Himself, but He accepted Isvara Puri as His guru. Krsna, He also accepted His guru as Sandipani Muni. Lord Ramacandra, He accepted His guru as Vasistha. So it is (not) necessary, Krsna or Rama. They are Supreme Personality of Godhead. They are the supreme instructor, full of knowledge, everything. Aisvaryasya samagrasya viryasya. There is nothing short, but still, to show us example, They accepted guru. That is essential. So here Sanatana Gosvami, he is also born in a very well-to-do brahmana family. He was well-situated as minister in charge of the government of Hussain Shah. So everything was quite all right, and still, he thought himself as nica jati.
nica jati nica-sangi patita adhama
kuvisaya-kupe padi' gonainu janama
If we remain puffed-up, that "I am born in such and such family. I am educated such and such, and I am posted in such and such post, so now my life is successful," that is false. Life is successful when we understand that... Here it is said, apanara hitahita kichui na jani. When we understand what is the goal of life, then life is successful. Not the temporary position, "I am getting good salary, I am very nicely posted, I have got good family," and so on, so on. No. One must know the goal of life.
The goal of life is that... We are fallen in this material world somehow or other. As Bhaktivinoda Thakura sings, anadi karma-phale pori' bhavarnava-jale. Now when a man is fallen in the ocean or in the water, he's asking help, you cannot say that "How did you fall? What was the cause?" That we shall discuss later on. First of all, save him. So that is the immediately necessity. There is no... Sometimes we are questioned that "How a living entity fallen in this material world?" Yes, that is also stated in the Bhagavad-gita: iccha-dvesa-samutthena sarge yanti parantapa [Bg. 7.27]. Iccha-dvesa. Actually, we are servants of God. That is our real position. But we sometimes become envious, that "Why shall I become servant of God? This is slave mentality." Sometimes we are accused, the Vaisnavas are, of slave mentality because they want to serve God. And the Mayavadis, they think that "We are so exalted that I am as good as God. I am God." That is their position. But actually, nobody is God here. Everyone is servant. He's simply falsely thinking that he's God, he's master, he's this or that. You have got very nice example in the life of Mr. Nixon. He was thinking that he's everything: "I am the President." But now what is his position, you can understand.
So similarly everyone..., nobody is master. The master is Krsna. That is stated in the Caitanya-caritamrta, ekale isvara krsna ara saba bhrtya [Cc. Adi 5.142]. The master is there, that is Krsna, and everyone is servant. Therefore Caitanya Mahaprabhu teaches that jivera svarupa haya nitya krsna dasa [Cc. Madhya 20.108-109]. We living entities, we are eternally servant of God. Krsna means God. One who attracts everyone, that is Krsna, and Krsna is God, accepted by everyone.
isvarah paramah krsnah
sac-cid-ananda-vigrahah
anadir adir govindah
sarva-karana-karanam
[Bs. 5.1]
Krsnas tu bhagavan svayam [SB 1.3.28]. These are the Vedic evidences. So actually nobody can be master; everyone is servant. Either we are servant of God or we are servant of dog. That's all. Nobody can be master. If anyone has no master, then he keeps a pet dog to become his servant. That is nature, we can see. One is servant of his wife, one is servant of his pet or government service or this service. Nobody can claim that "I am the master." That is not possible. That is also temporary. So actually this is the position of all living entities. Everyone is servant. But in the material sense, he is servant of maya, servant of senses. Servant of maya means servant of senses. And spiritual life means instead of becoming servant of maya or servant of senses, we become the servant of Krsna or God. That is the position. Servant we shall remain. We have to change the position. And if we become servant of God, then we become happy, and if we remain servant of dog or maya, then we remain unhappy. This is the position. We have to change the position. Kamadinam kati na katidha palita durnidesas tesam mayi na karuna jata na trapa nopasantih. One intelligent brahmana, he's offering, "My Lord, I have become servant of so many senses, but neither the senses are satisfied, neither I am satisfied. This is the result of my service. Therefore now I have got my intelligence that I want to become Your servant." This is intelligence. So I have experienced that I became a servant of my family, servant of my society, servant of my country, and so on, so on, but nobody, neither my so-called master was satisfied, neither I was satisfied. We see practical examples, there are many examples. In our country, Mahatma Gandhi, he dedicated his life for the service of the country. Nobody can doubt about his service, but what is the result? His master killed him. He worked for his country, he took country as his master, and he worked so hard, and his countrymen killed him. We should take lesson from this that you cannot satisfy in this material world by becoming servant of your family or community, society, nation. No. It is not possible. You can satisfy very easily Krsna by little service. By little service. Svalpam apy asya dharmasya trayate mahato bhayat.
So this is intelligence, how to become a servant of Krsna. That is the perfection of life. That means mukti. Mukti does not mean you'll get four hands and eight heads. No. Mukti means, as it is defined in the Srimad-Bhagavatam, muktir hitvanyatha rupam sva-rupena vyavasthitih. That is mukti. Sva-rupena, legally, constitutionally, I am servant of God, or Krsna. Now I have become servant of dog and maya. So if I give up this service and again become servant of God, that is mukti. That is mukti. Muktir hitvanyatha rupam. We are trying to become... Here maya means "which is not." Ma-ya. We are every one of us, we are thinking, "I am master." "I am the monarch of all I survey." Here is a poetry. Everyone is thinking. I made my plan, I make my survey, and I become king. But that is maya. You cannot become. You are already servant of maya.
prakrteh kriyamanani
gunaih karmani sarvasah
ahankara-vimudhatma
kartaham iti manyate
[Bg. 3.27]
Everyone is under the clutches of these material laws. You cannot violate even an inch. And still the rascal, ahankara-vimudhatma, by false prestige, he's thinking that "I am the master." I was asking this morning that what is this independence meaning? Actually, where is independence? This independence, has it meaning? If you are completely under the rules and regulations of the material nature, what is the meaning of this independence? So those who are pandita, they do not take it as independence. They do not take it. Therefore Sanatana Gosvami said, apanara hitahita kichui na jani. "I do not know what is independence, I am dancing like dog, independence." Therefore he says, apanara hitahita kichui na jani: "How independence I can get, that I do not know." Real independence is, as Krsna puts in the Bhagavad-gita, janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi duhkha-dosanudarsanam [Bg. 13.9]. One who is intelligent, he sees that "My real problem is janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi, birth, death, old age and disease."So when we get free from these four problems, that is real independence. Otherwise, there is no independence. I may dance with independence, but any moment I shall have to leave my country, my society, my friends, my family, any moment, "Get out immediately. No, no independence." That is my position. So that is intelligence.
So in order to know all these problems of life... Just like Arjuna submitted, and any one has to submit. One has to... Tad-vijnanartham sa gurum evabhigacchet [MU 1.2.12]. So Sanatana Gosvami is teaching us by his personal behavior how to approach the bona fide spiritual master and submit before him and putting himself pranipa, blank. Not that "I know something, and what my spiritual master can teach? I know everything. There is no need of spiritual master." No. This will spoil our life. The Vedic injunction is that you must have not a so-called guru but... That is also given definition.
tasmad gurum prapadyeta
jijnasuh sreya uttamam
sabde pare ca nisnatam
brahmany upasamasrayam
[SB 11.3.21]
That is the symptoms of guru. And Caitanya Mahaprabhu says, because we are discussing Caitanya-caritamrta, He said that you become, all of you, become guru. He said. That is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's mission. He said,
bharata-bhumite haila manusya-janma yara
janma sarthaka kari' kara para-upakara
[Cc. Adi 9.41]
This is Indian mission. Para-upakara. Not exploit others -- to give something. That is Indian mission, that he has to give something. He has nothing to take. He has to give something. And what is that? That Caitanya Mahaprabhu teaches, that amara ajnaya guru hana tara' ei desa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. Even if you cannot deliver the whole world or very expansive area, at least, wherever you are, you just deliver them. Amara ajnaya guru hana tara ei desa. "You become a guru by My order." So one may say that "I have no qualification. How can I become a guru or how can I deliver these fallen persons?" So Krsna, Caitanya Mahaprabhu says, "Don't be disappointed."
amara ajnaya guru hana tara ei desa
yare dekha tare kaha 'krsna'-upadesa
[Cc. Madhya 7.128]
Bas. Simply as messenger, as peon, you simply carry the messages of Bhagavad-gita, krsna-upadesa. Then you become guru. Then you become guru. It is not difficult.
So it is the duty of every Indian not to forget their culture, but bring that culture, pure, wherever you are living and behave yourself to that culture and teach others. That is Indian mission.
Thank you very much. [break] What is that question?
Vipina: Mr. Deyani, you have any questions you would like to ask Srila Prabhupada?
Mr. Deyani: Well, I just have one thing here, you stated about Gandhi, and we respect that he was really a great leader of us, but stated one point in your lecture, this thing, that Gandhi, mostly, was a servant of the country, but in India, during that period, I didn't see other religious people or the great leaders of India fighting for the country, and they..., he's the one...
Prabhupada: That is admitted. Why you are bringing that question? I mean to say that Gandhi gave the best service to you, but your country is so ungrateful that he killed him. That is my point. So the point is that the best service you can give, but you cannot satisfy everyone. That is material.
Mr. Deyani: No, but my question, sir, was that at some point you have to be the servant of the God, you will have to be a servant of your family or the country or something to serve.
Prabhupada: Yes, that I'm already explaining, that amara ajnaya guru hana tara: [Cc. Madhya 7.128] wherever you are, you deliver them. That is service. That is service. Wherever you are. Either you are in the family or in the community or in the country or anywhere, you simply give them service, deliver them. Without service, how you can deliver them? And you haven't got to discover anything or make research. What is already there, krsna-upadesa, you teach them, that's all. He'll be delivered. You'll be delivered, he'll be delivered. It is not at all difficult. Not that I have to manufacture some transcendental means. No. The already instruction is there, krsna-upadesa. Yare dekha, tare kaha 'krsna'-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. Then you deliver yourself, you deliver others also. That is the mission. So what we are doing? We are not discovering anything. We are simply presenting Bhagavad-gita as it is. That's all. Krsna said, man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru [Bg. 18.65]. We are teaching all over the world the same thing, that "Here is Krsna. You always think of Him, you just offer your obeisances, you just become a devotee of Krsna, man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji, worship." So we are teaching. So there is no discovery. It is already there. So that we are carrying simply. Yare dekha tare kaha 'krsna'-upadesa [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. Krsna says, man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru [Bg. 18.65]. We don't interpret. There is no need of interpretation; then there is no authority of Bhagavad-gita. If I am a third-class man, if I interpret Bhagavad-gita, then Bhagavad-gita has no authority. Bhagavad-gita should be preached as it is. Then you become guru, you can deliver others. This is the process. (indistinct) Hare Krsna.
Devotee: Srila Prabhupada, sometimes when we go preaching, people do not want to take Krsna consciousness. Sometimes they actually...
Prabhupada: So if they want to take, then where is the question of preaching? Because they do not want to take, you have to preach. Otherwise, where is the necessity of preaching? You have to prepare yourself in such a way that nobody is dying for your Krsna consciousness, but you have to convince him that your life is spoiled without Krsna consciousness. That is your capacity. They are under the clutches of maya. They are thinking... [break]
Women: ...convinced that they have some revelation or some experience that is assuring them of eternal life. So they are not very open to hear about Krsna, and they...
Prabhupada: If they are not open to hear about Krsna, then don't waste your time. The simple thing. There are four things. For a preacher, there are four things:
isvare tad-adhinesu
balisesu dvisatsu ca
prema-maitri-krpopeksa
yah karoti sa madhyamah
When in the lower stage of devotional service, he cannot become preacher. When he's in a little upper, second stage, he can become preacher. So preacher has to see four things. First of all God, isvara, and tad-adhinesu, and those who are devotees. God, His devotees, and balisa, innocent. He does not know anything about... So three: God, devotee, and the innocent. And dvisat, envious, atheist class. He has to see four things, and he has to deal with four persons differently. With God, isvare prema: how to advance my love for God, these dealings. Prema-maitri, and to the devotees, we have to make friendship with them. Prema-maitri. And to the innocent, we have to preach, krpa: "Oh, here is an innocent person. He does not know; he's eager to learn." There teaching is required. Teaching, you cannot teach God or you cannot teach God's devotees. But you can teach the innocent. And those who are dvisat, atheist, upeksa, don't go there, save yourself. These are the four things. So when one is not open to hear, then don't bother yourself. That requires very strong preacher to convince the atheist class, provided he is reasonable also. If he's stubborn, obstinate, then it is also very difficult. But preaching is meant, innocent, that one who is actually sincere but he does not know what is God, what is my relationship with God, there is necessity of preaching. Not to the envious or those who are already advanced, or to God. This is the... Hmm. Baliya. (indistinct)
Indian man: Prabhupada, you are giving a very simple process, which is... I can confirm by (indistinct) ...it is not (indistinct) Indians coming? Why? They are exposed to Krsna from their birth; still they are not interested. Nobody wants to listen.
Prabhupada: Because they have become bara-sab. Especially in the foreign countries, they become bara-sab. So that is the misfortune of India. They are giving up their culture and being misguided. So if they actually feel that they must maintain their own culture, then it is not difficult. It is the duty of every Indian, as Caitanya Mahaprabhu said that,
bharata-bhumite haila manusya-janma yara
janma sarthaka kari' kara para-upakara
[Cc. Adi 9.41]
If that mentality is developed, that "In India we were born, we have got the greatest culture, recognized by all the world. So I must make my life successful by taking this culture and distribute it to the whole world," that is real Indian culture. If... They are thinking that they are poverty-stricken. Poverty-stricken because they have given their own culture; therefore poverty-stricken. Otherwise, there is no question of poverty-stricken. So anyway this is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's message, that every Indian should take advantage of the great culture, Vedic culture, and make his life successful, and after acquiring mature knowledge he should distribute the knowledge throughout the whole world. This is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's...
Indian man: (indistinct) How can we (indistinct)?
Prabhupada: By preaching. If you preach, then you'll meet with so many obstacles, and you have to prepare yourself how to meet the obstacles. Then you become strong preacher. Resistance. There is no difficulty, but if there is difficulty, atheist class of men, and it is very difficult, so take innocent, those who are actually eager to know. Everyone should be. That is the human life. Athato brahma jijnasa. That is human civilization. Everyone should be inquisitive to know about the Absolute Truth, Brahman, but education is different nowadays. People are interested with hammer, how to play on hammer, that's all, technology. There is no question of Brahman. Let Brahman go to hell, now take out the hammer. That Russian emblem? Hammer? And scythe? That's all. Yes?
Indian man: Prabhupada, the basic confusion is that the Mayavadis take Bhagavad-gita, they can recite the same Sanskrit words and interpret it in their way and convince someone that the ultimate Brahman is impersonal and the (indistinct) Brahman, Krsna is only a technique.
Prabhupada: That means they misinterpret and they misguide. So people should be intelligent enough that they are impersonalists but Bhagavad-gita means Krsna, the person, He is teaching. Where is the impersonalist? But nobody has any common sense even that Krsna says aham adir hi bhutanam. Aham sarvasya prabhavo [Bg. 10.8]. This aham is person, so how He can be imperson? And He's talking personally with Arjuna. So how He is imperson? Can the air talk with you? Air is imperson. Sky is imperson. Can he talk with you? What do you think? No, sometimes talks. (laughter) So we should have common sense, that where is the question of... And Krsna says in the Second Chapter that "My dear Arjuna, both you, Me and all these soldiers and kings who are assembled here, we existed in the past, we are now existing, and we shall continue to exist in the future." So three things: first person, second person and third person. I am first person, you are second person and all others third person. So they existed individually in the past, they are existing now, and they will continue to exist like that. Then where is imperson? There are three things, three different phases, past, present and future. In all the times, if they are individual, where is imperson? Rather, Krsna has condemned, avyaktam vyaktim apannam manyante mam abuddhayah [Bg. 7.24]. Those who are rascals, they think avyaktam, impersonal. Now He has become person. Avyaktam vyaktim apannam manyante mam. Mam means individual person. Abuddhayah: he has no intelligence. So how He can be imperson? So we have to take the words of Bhagavad-gita and then we understand. Why we should be misled by these so-called interpreters?
Indian man: They say that if you develop pure love of Krsna, then you'll see only Krsna. Your own personality is...
Prabhupada: But anyway, but Krsna, if you think of Krsna, the Krsna person, He's not imperson.
Indian man: No, but they..., they say that has happened.
Prabhupada: They say that if you think of Krsna. Krsna is a person. So you have to begin with person.
Indian man: But they also say one can go directly to Brahman.
Prabhupada: Never says, Krsna never says in the Bhagavad-gita.
Indian man: This is my basic confusion.
Prabhupada: Confusion... How you should be confused? Where is Krsna says? The basic (indistinct) is in person? Krsna's teaching personally. Where is the imperson? Why you should be misled unless you are also one of them. Krsna is always person. He's always speaking aham. Sarva-dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja [Bg. 18.66]. Person. Aham adir hi devanam [Bg 10.2]. Mattah parataram nanyat kincid asti dhananjaya [Bg. 7.7]. Mattah. This, aham-sabdah, is used. So they misinterpret just to mislead people; therefore whole India has become godless. This is the misfortune of India. On account of these impersonalists, Mayavadis, India is now godless. Very difficult position. So don't be misled by these rascals. Take real Bhagavad-gita as it is. Then you'll be benefited. That's all. (end)
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Madhya-lila 20.100 -- Washington, D.C., July 5, 1976
