31 Jan 73 , Calcutta
Prabhupada: Thank you. Mister Allen, ladies and gentlemen, I thank you very much for your kindly inviting me to speak something about East and West. Of course, I have got considerable experience now because I am wandering East and West, not only once, at least twice, thrice in a year. So far Krsna consciousness movement is concerned, we have no such thing, East and West. Just like the sun rises from the Eastern horizon and sets on the Western horizon, but the sun is the same. You cannot say that Eastern sun and the Western sun. That is not possible. The planet, this Earthly planet is moving and we are considering that the sun is moving from East and West. The sun, sun is in his position. Similarly, this Krsna consciousness movement has no such distinction between East and West. If there is such distinction, it is due to lack of knowledge.
Why this lack of knowledge? Because we are under bodily concept of life. According to Krsna culture, anyone who is going on under the bodily concept of life, he is not considered as a human being. It is said in the Srimad-Bhagavatam:
yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke
sva-dhih kalatradisu bhauma ijya-dhih
yat tirtha-buddhih salile na karhicij
janesu abhijnesu sa eva go-kharah
[SB 10.84.13]
Go-kharah. Go means cow. And kharah means ass. Any person who is accepting this body as himself... Just like generally we say: "What you are?" "I am Mister Such and Such. I am American" or "I am an Indian" or "African." This bodily designation, if I identify my self with this body, yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatu. Kunape means bag. This is a bag. This body is a bag of bones, flesh, urine, blood, and so many other things. You cannot manufacture a living entity by combination of bones, flesh, blood, urine and stool. That is not possible. You are great scientist. You are going to the Moon planet, but if I give you some ingredients like these bones, flesh, stool, urine, can you manufacture a human being? Can you? Can anyone? Is there any scientist in the world who can manufacture a human being by combination of bones, flesh, blood, urine, stool? No. If it is not possible to manufacture, how you are identifying with this body? "I am this body." Do you mean combination of bones and flesh can create such intelligent man?
Just like in your country, George Washington. Many scientists. In our country also, many big leaders, Mahatma Gandhi and others. Do you think that these men are combination of bag, combination-bag of bones and flesh and urine? Therefore, the sastra says: yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke [SB 10.84.13]. Tri-dhatuke. This body is made of three elements, according to Ayur Vedic system, kapha pitta vayu. Mucus, bile and air. So actually, the combination of this body is like that. As soon as the spirit soul goes out of this body, it is nothing but bones, flesh and urine and stool and it has to be thrown away. In every society, as soon as the man is dead... So, while he was living, he was acting so nicely, so intelligently. Now as soon as the soul is gone, immediately everything is gone. So do you think it is a combination of bones and flesh? Any sane man will accept it? If you say that something is wanting for giving impetus of birth of life in this body, therefore the body's called dead, that is not a fact. Because after this body's dead, after the soul is gone out of the body, innumerable microbes will come out, decomposition. You cannot say the ingredients which give impetus to generation of life, that is lacking. It is not lacking. Because it is not lacking, therefore millions of other microbes are coming out. That is not a fact, that this is the ingredient of life substance. There are so many arguments.
So if there is any difference of East and West, this difference. (In) the Eastern part of the world, especially India, the people know that "I am not this body." And the Western part of the world, they do not know that "I am not this body." That is the difference. That is the difference. That is the distinction between East and West. In India, go to a village and you ask him that "What you are?" He will say: "Sir, I am suffering or enjoying according to my past karma." Means: "I was living in the past. So according to my action, I am suffering or enjoying the reaction in this life." He believes in the transmigration of the soul. He believes in the future life also. He is very cautious to commit sin because he knows that "If I commit sin in this life, I'll have to suffer next life." This is Eastern life. And in the Western country, I talked with so many big, big professors, especially in Moscow. I talked with Professor Kotovsky. He said: "Swamiji, after death, then everything finished. After death, everything finished." This is the difference, East and West. In the Eastern country, especially in India, a common man will understand the existence of soul. And in the Western countries, a topmost man, professor, he does not know what is soul. That is the difference.
Otherwise, so far your eating is concerned, it is same, either in Eastern country or Western country. You eat something on plate, or they also eat something. You sleep in nice apartment. They also sleep in something like that. You try to defend with your atomic weapons. They also try to defend. You also, after sex, the East and Western, they are also after sex. Not only Eastern and Western, the animals, they are also after these things. Ahara-nidra-bhaya-maithunam ca samanyam etad pasubhih naranam. Eating, sleeping, sex life and defense. This is common to the animal and to the human being. You may improve the cooking process or eating process but, after all, it is eating. Eating is meant for maintaining your body. That is done by the animals also. These things are not cultural advancement. Real cultural advancement is to know that "I am not this body." "I am spirit soul." Aham brahmasmi. That is the difference.
So this education is in India. This Bhagavad-gita. The beginning of Bhagavad-gita, Krsna says:
dehino 'smin yatha dehe
kaumaram yauvanam jara
tatha dehantaram praptir
dhiras tatra na muhyati
[Bg. 2.13]
This is Eastern gift. So I have gone to the Western countries to give this Eastern gift. And it is being accepted by your children. All these American, European boys, they're accepting it. Not only hundreds, but thousands. People say that "Swamiji, you are doing wonderful." I say I am not doing wonderful. I do not know any magic. I have no mystic power. But I am presenting actually the Eastern culture to the West. That's all. It is not unreasonable. Any child can understand that there is soul. One doctor in Canada Montreal I think... What is the name of that medical prac...?
Devotee: Bigelow.
Another devotee: Bigelow.
Prabhupada: So he is he's now speaking that there is soul. He's a cardiologist.
Devotee: Doctor Bigelow.
Prabhupada: Eh? Tell him, that man.
Tamala Krsna: Doctor Bigelow.
Prabhupada: So I had some correspondence with him, and he admitted: "Swamiji, your people know much about these things than we know." So there is no question of you and me. It is simply education. Just like these boys. Four or fives year, ago, they did not know anything about this Krsna consciousness. But because they have been educated with this Bhagavad-gita, they are also following me. And they are very sound in their conviction in this Western, Eastern culture, Krsna consciousness. Of course from my part of view, I do not think there is any East and West. Any knowledge is meant for the whole world. Any scientific knowledge. Just like Professor Einstein, if he discovered the law of relativity, it is not for the Western people. It is for the Eastern people also. So there is no such question. When there is culture, when there is knowledge, there is no question of Eastern and Western. But the difference is the Eastern people may know something very nicely and the Western people may take some time. Similarly, Western people may know something very nicely, the Eastern people may take little time. Just like for technology, they go to Western countries to learn how machine works. So they also learn it. In Eastern..., in India, they're also learning. So now the time is ripe that we should not think in terms of Eastern and Western. We should be hankering after real knowledge. That is wanted. That is the point of unity.
Now for lack of knowledge, the United Nations, they're also, the Eastern and Western people have gone to make a solution of the world problems. But they're unable. My next headquarter is New York. I go on the First Avenue. Most occasionally I see there is the United Nations Building. But instead of diminishing the flag, they're increasing. They're increasing. I do not know what is the meaning of this United Nations. Why? Big, big brain, big, big politicians, big, big learned scholars, and they are speaking. But why the nations are not united? It is is, it is simply a show only. Because lack of knowledge. It is due to lack of knowledge. What is that lack of knowledge? Yasyatma-buddhih kunape tri-dhatuke [SB 10.84.13]. Everyone is thinking: "I am this body." They have gone to unite together. But their basic principle of knowledge is the same, that "I am this body." American, he's thinking: "I am this body. American." Russian, he's thinking: "I am this body, Russian." And they are fighting. Why the fighting? Due to this body. But if we understand this very simple thing, that I am not this body, everything is united. So the lack of knowledge is there. How we'll be united, culturally or this way? It is not possible. The first lack of knowledge must be eradicated, that why you, why we are missing the point? This is the point.
dehino 'smin yatha dehe
kaumaram yauvanam jara
tatha dehantaram praptir
dhiras tatra na muhyati
[Bg. 2.13]
Asmin dehe, in this body, there is the proprietor of the body. That is soul. Asmin dehe, on this body, there is the proprietor of the body. this proprietor of the body constantly changing different types of bodies. The example is given that kaumaram yauvanam jara. Just like a child is changing his body to boyhood, the boy is changing his body to youthhood, and young man is changing, his body to old body. Similarly when the old man dies, he does not die. He accepts another body. This knowledge. Dhiras tatra na muhyati. One who's actually in knowledge, he's not surprised that a man is dead. He's not dead. And the example is given just you change your dress. Now some of you are present here with a coat, black color. You can change it tomorrow into white color. That does not make any difference, that you are dead. Similarly, when we change our body. Just like I was a baby. Everyone knows. I, I remember that I had a little body. I remember at least. But that body is missing now. I remember that I was young man. I had a very youthful body. But that is missing now. And my elderly person, he may also, he may also know that he has changed his body, but he's not dead. I know that I have changed my body. I have simply changed my body, but I am living. I remember the body. Similarly, when we change our body, it does not mean that I am dead. Tatha dehantaram praptir dhiras tatra na muhyati.
And further explained in the Bhagavad-gita that na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. The living entity, after the annihilation of this body, does not die. How it transmigrates? How the living entity transmigrates from one body to another? By the subtle body. There is a subtle body. This is gross body. The subtle body works when you are asleep. We go outside my bedroom and we see so many things, we work in so many ways. That is subtle body. So after the destruction of this gross body, this subtle body carries me to another gross body. It is a great science. Great science. That is explained very nicely in the Bhagavad-gita and other Vedic literatures. So why the scientists of the Western country do not take this matter seriously? I was invited to speak in Boston, the Massachusetts Technical Institute. So I first inquired all the students: "Where is your technological department, when the body stops, you can again give him vitality and he may work? Where is that technology?" So the students liked it. And we had very nice discussion. So we are very much advanced in technology. But we do not know what is the technology of the soul transmigrating from one body to another. That is ignorance. That is ignorance.
And this ignorance prevails in animals also. The animals do not know. Because they are not advanced in knowledge. But they have got also soul. Their soul is evolving or transmigrating from one body to another. There is a system. Jalaja nava-laksani sthavara laksa vimsati. From the aquatics. Because the whole world was merged into water, devastation. Therefore the beginning of living entities, (is) the aquatics. From the aquatics, they come to the plants, trees. Then from plants, trees, to insect. From insect to birds. Then bird to beast. From beast to human being. Asitim caturas caiva laksams tan jiva-jatisu. They're all mentioned. The evolutionary theory, it is not new thing, as it is stated by Darwin. It is there in the Padma Purana. But it is very perfectly explained there. Darwin has not very perfectly explained. There are so many defects. But real thing is that the living entity, soul, is transmigrating from one body to another and the chance of developed consciousness is human form of life. In this human form of life, if we do not understand "What I am, wherefrom I have come, where I am going next, why I have taken this body, subjected to so much miserable tribulations of life which I do not want?"
Ultimately, all our miserable conditions have been summarized into four, birth, death, old age and disease. Janma-mrtyu-jara-vyadhi-duhkha-dosanudarsanam [Bg. 13.9]. We are trying to have, become happy by our scientific knowledge, by advancement of knowledge, but Krsna says that you cannot make any solution of these four problems. What is that? Birth, death, old age and disease. That is not possible. So we are happy by false happiness. This is called maya. This is culture, this Indian culture. They agree, there is a maya. This is Eastern culture. Maya. Maya means we are falsely happy. We are thinking that "Now I am well situated." But I am not thinking any moment, next moment, I may be kicked out of the situation and everything finished. Why I am being kicked out? I want to stay here permanently. Nobody wants to die. Why he dies? Where is the solution? This is lack of knowledge. But there is solution. There is solution. That is Eastern culture. The Eastern culture knows how to make the solution. Therefore, you'll find so many parties, the karmis, the jnanis, the yogis, the bhaktas, they are all trying to make solution of these four problems, birth, death, old age and disease. That is Eastern gift. So now it is very happy moment that Indo-American Society. I wish that the Indo-American society should give a special stress to know why these four miserable conditions of life cannot be solved. And there is a solution. We can give you the solution. In the Bhagavad-gita there is solution:
janma karma me divyam
yo janati tattvatah
tyaktva deham punar janma
naiti mam eti kaunteya
[Bg. 4.9]
That is culture. That is really business of the human being that "I am put into this material condition of life. I am changing from one kind of body to another. Who knows that I am not going to become a tree next life?" But there is another species of life like tree, like birds, like beasts. There is no guarantee. There is no scientific guarantee that "You are not going to be tree, you are again going to become American." No, there is no guarantee. But there is guarantee. Because the so-called scientists cannot make solution of this problem, they do not believe in next life. That is their defect of knowledge, lack of knowledge. They cannot make any solution. He wants to live permanently, but he cannot live by the laws of nature. Why does he not make a solution of this? But we can give the solution. Everyone does not want to become old. But he becomes forced to become old. Why he does not make any solution? But that solution we can give. This is Eastern culture.
So I request all you ladies and gentlemen to take this Krsna consciousness movement. It is not a sentimental movement. It is a very authorized, scientific movement. You are all educated, advanced ladies and gentlemen. I'll request you to understand this Krsna consciousness movement. The American boys, it is already we are combining East and West socially, politically, religiously, philosophically, economically, everything. There is solution. But if you take it seriously. If you think this is a movement, sentimental move... It is not sentimental movement. It is a most scientific movement. Any scientist come to me. I can convince him that it is a scientific movement. I asked similarly to Professor Kotovsky in Moscow that "My dear Professor, what is the difference between your movement, communist movement, and my movement? You, you have selected Lenin as God. I have selected Krsna as God. Where is the difference of principle? You cannot live without a leader or God. I cannot live without a leader or God. That's a fact. Then where is the difference? Now it is to be judged whether Lenin is good or Krsna is good. That is another thing. But your position is that you have to accept one leader, either Lenin or Jawaharlal Nehru or Hitler or this or Lord (?) Churchill. You have to accept. You cannot work independently. Therefore you have got so many parties. So here is also one party, Krsna party. So where is the difference in philosophy? There is no difference in philosophy. Now let us study whether Krsna party is good or Lenin party is good. Then whole solution is there."
Thank you very much Hare Krsna. [break]
Prabhupada: (Answers questions) ...Yes. (aside:) It is not working. [break] ...eternal soul is there in the Bhagavad-gita that... That I have already explained. Asmin dehe, in this body there is the proprietor of the body. This is conception of soul. Just like whenever we see some apartment or house we can understand that there is a resident or proprietor of this house. Similarly, we can understand, this body, there is some proprietor within this body. Therefore the body is working. If we see one house, nicely cleansed, there is light and everything is in order, we can understand there is resident. Similarly, when the proprietor of the body is there, the body is healthy... [break] ...That is the conception of existence of the soul. Nobody can deny it. [break]
...as soul without the body means ghost. Yes, that's a fact. Ghost means he has got no gross body, but he's working with the subtle body. We have got two kinds of bodies. The gross body is made of five elements, earth, water, air, fire, sky. And the subtle body is made of intelligence, mind and ego. So when a soul does not get a gross body, he has to work with the subtle body, that is ghostly life. So ghostly life is not false. Those who are too, too much sinful, sometimes they are condemned not to get a gross body. Just like if a man commits suicide. So nature gave him this gross body. He misused it. Therefore he's punished sometimes not to get again gross body. He becomes ghost.
Guest: (indistinct question)
Prabhupada: What is that? [break] ...means you accept another body. So long you are under the laws of karma, you have to accept another body.
prakrteh kriyamanani
gunaih karmani sarvasah
ahankara-vimudhatma
kartaham iti manyate
[Bg. 3.27]
Nature. You are desiring so many things in your life. They are recorded. And you have to accept each and every body, one after another. That is nature's gift. Prakrteh kriyamanani. That is the nature's work. As you desire, so you get a body. If you misuse the body, then for sometimes you are restrained not to get a gross body. There are so many scientific problems about this life and transmigration of the soul. You can understand from the authorized Vedic literature, how the soul transmigrates from one body to another. That is also explained. The soul remains with the subtle body which we cannot see, but after destruction of this gross body, the soul is carried to another gross body according to his desire by the subtle body. The example is given: just like the flavor of flower garden is carried by the air, and if you do not, even though you do not see the flower, when you smell the good smell, you can understand wherefrom the air is blowing. Similarly, according to your desire, you get a body and that desire, that capsule of mind, intelligence will carry you to another body. God will give you the chance. This is the process.
Guest: If that is the case, then... [break]
Prabhupada: ...The ultimate goal of the soul is to reach God. That is the process. Na te viduh svartha-gatim hi visnu. They do not know what is the ultimate goal of life. The ultimate goal of life is to reach God. That is really culture. So people do not know it. They think: "My ultimate goal of life is to make some good bank balance." But that is not the ultimate goal of life. The bank balance will be finished as soon as you give up this body. Your skyscraper building and bank balance, everything. Now according to your karma, according to your desire, karma means according to your desire, you'll have to accept another body. So these bodily activities, this possession of this body will be finished with your death. Then you have to begin another chapter. It may be human being, or it may be demigod, or it may be animal. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gita:
yanti deva-vrata devan
pitrn yanti pitr-vratah
bhutejya yanti bhutani
mad-yajino 'pi yanti mam
[Bg. 9.25]
So we have to accept another body. Therefore, our Krsna consciousness movement is giving intelligence to the person that "Here is your ultimate goal of life, Krsna. Come here. Be trained up in Krsna consciousness and go back to home, back to Godhead, Krsna." This is our movement. That is the ultimate goal. [break] ...go somewhere. Because you are eternal. Simply by finishing your body, you will not finish. You have to go. But where you shall go? That you can plan in this life. And if you make this plan, that "I want to go back to home, back to Godhead..." The Bhagavad-gita is there. You study. You cultivate this knowledge. And Krsna says: tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti kaunteya [Bg. 4.9]. "My dear Arjuna, such persons who have developed Krsna consciousness perfectly, after giving up this body, he does not accept any more material body." Tyaktva deham. "After giving up this body..." Tyaktva deham punar janma naiti [Bg. 4.9]. Janma means birth, means accepting another material body. Otherwise, the soul has no birth, no death. Na jayate na mriyate va. The soul never takes birth or never dies. It is the body only. It takes birth and dies according to my karma. So if one becomes Krsna consciousness, Krsna conscious, the ultimate goal of life, then after giving up this body, he does not accept any more any material body. Then what does he do? Mam eti, "He comes to Me." This is the philosophy of Krsna consciousness. This is the ultimate goal of life.
Guest: Can't the (indistinct) attain through any other religion? (indistinct)
Prabhupada: Everyone. Don't you see it is practically? They were all Christians, Jews, Mohammedans. How they are coming to Krsna consciousness?
Guest: So is Krsna consciousness the only method?
Prabhupada: Yes. Krsna conscious... You... Maybe it in otherwise. But the aim is that there is God. We are part and parcel of God. Somehow or other, we are now separated. We must be united again. That is the life's business.
Guest: So any other religion also can give...
Prabhupada: Oh yes. Why not? Any religion. We do not way that "You practice this religion or that religion." We say "Just try to go back to home, back to Godhead." That is our philosophy.
sa vai pumsam paro dharmo
yato bhaktir adhoksaje
ahaituky apratihata
yenatma samprasidati
[SB 1.2.6]
If you want really happiness then you follow such principles by which you can develop your love for God. So it does not mean... If you can do it in Christianity, that's all right. If you can do it by Muhammadan religion, that's all right. But the aim should be to go back to home, back to Godhead. That is our philosophy. (American gives short speech thanking Srila Prabhupada, then Indian man (possibly life member) makes similar speech, but praises bhakti and chanting, quotes Bhagavad-gita, etc. Then kirtana begins) (end)
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Lecture at Indo-American Society "East and West" -- Calcutta, January 31, 1973
© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International. Used with permission.
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Saturday, July 31, 2010
Friday, July 30, 2010
"Classless Society-Impossible"
7 Sept 73 , Stokholm
Prabhupada:By quality and by work, there is, or there must be four divisions of the social structure. Catur-varnyam, first-class, second-class, third-class and fourth-class. That is very natural. Just like in your body, my body is divided into four divisions. The head, head department. In every, I mean to say, unit, there is head department, the first-class department, the second-class department. So we can understand from our own body, there is head department, there is arms department, there is belly department and there is the leg department. So head is first-class. Because if the arms, belly and legs are there and head is cut off, then everything is useless. If the head is there, arm is cut off, you can go on with your business. So there is four divisions everywhere. Krsna says:
na tad asti prthivyam va
divi devesu va punah
sattvam prakrti-jair muktam
yad ebhih syat tribhir gunaih
Krsna says that either on this planet or in other planets in the outer space, or anywhere, the three qualities or three modes of material nature is working. The modes of goodness, the modes of passion, and the modes of ignorance. Everywhere, you'll find these three classes of living entities. Not three classes, four classes. The first-class, goodness. Second-class, passion, third-class, mixed passion and ignorance, and fourth-class ignorance. And below the fourth class, all fifth class, pancama.
So according to these three modes of material nature, there must be division of the society. The first class men are called brahmana, most learned scholar. Learned scholar means, as I was explaining, one who has complete knowledge of God, that is learned scholar. Otherwise, to know how to eat, how to sleep, how to have sexual intercourse and how to defend, this, these knowledge is also there in the animals. They know how to eat. There is no need of university for teaching how to eat or how to sleep or how to have sex life or how to defend. These are animal necessities. But actually human being should be still more advanced in knowledge. That knowledge is not comprising only eating, sleeping, mating and defending. That knowledge is to understand the Absolute Truth, God. That knowledge.
Therefore, the Vedanta-sutra philosophy, that begins with the word athato brahma jijnasa. Now, this life, this human form of life, is meant for inquiring about the Absolute Truth. Athato brahma jijnasa. Brahma means the Absolute Truth. So, that should be the subject matter for studying in human form of life. So Bhagavad-gita is the right book to understand about that brahma, or the Supreme Personality of Godhead, or the Absolute Truth, whatever you call. The Absolute Truth is known in three phases: Brahman, Paramatma and Bhagavan.
vadanti tat tattva-vidas
tattvam yaj jnanam advayam
brahmeti paramatmeti
bhagavan iti sabdyate
[SB 1.2.11]
The Absolute Truth is one, but it is realized from three angles of visions. Some of them are realizing the Absolute Truth as impersonal Brahman, some of them are realizing the Absolute Truth as the localized Paramatma, and some of them are realizing the Absolute Truth as the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Absolute Truth is one, but because we are under different modes of material nature, we are understanding the Absolute Truth in three modes of material nature.
So Krsna says that these three modes of material nature is current all over the universe. Even in the topmost planet down to the lowest planet. Therefore he says: na tad asti prthivyam va divi devesu va punah. Prthivyam means on this earth. Or in the other higher planetary system or even the heavenly planets. Everywhere. Sattvam prakrti-jair muktam. Nowhere, anyone is freed from the influence of these modes of material nature. Sattvam means existence. Sattvam prakrti-jaih. Prakrti-jaih means by the material nature, gunaih, means the modes, this goodness, passion, and ignorance. Yad ebhih syat tribhir gunaih. Everything, everywhere, even amongst the plants life, beast life, there these three gunas are working.
Just like some trees, they're useless. Neither produce any nice fruit nor flower. That is third-class, in ignorance. In animals also. Just like cows, they are first-class animal, in the modes of goodness, supplying so valuable nutritious food, milk. But the cats and dogs, they are third-class animals. This is the calculation of the three modes of material nature. Either human being or animals or trees, birds, everywhere Krsna says, or in the higher planetary system, everywhere, these three modes of material nature is working. Therefore, in the human society, because there are three modes of material nature, the classification should be made scientifically according to these three modes of material nature. And that is explained by Bhagavan, Sri Krsna, in the Bhagavad-gita, catur-varnyam maya srstam: [Bg. 4.13] four classes of men. Brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya and sudra. Brahmana means the most intelligent class of men who can understand even up to the knowledge of Brahman, brahma janati iti brahmana. And the second class are the ksatriyas or the administrative class of men, and the third-class are the mercantile class of men, industrialists, traders, agriculturalists. Everything will be explained. And the fourth-class men means workers. They have no intelligence, but they find out some good master and get some money. That's all. So there are four classes. So here Krsna says,
brahmana-ksatriya-visam
sudranam ca parantapa
karmani pravibhaktani
svabhava-prabhavair gunaih
According to the modes of material nature, the brahmana should be selected, the ksatriya should be selected, the vaisyas or the mercantile people should be selected, and the sudras, the worker class, should be selected.
Then Krsna says, that how the brahminical class should be educated. This should be taken very seriously by educational department of all countries. And it is the duty of the government to see that every man according to his quality is working, is employed. Not that... Secular state does not mean they should be callous about the quality and work of the citizens. There must be department of practical psychology to see the students, in which class he belongs to. Either he belongs to the first-class, brahmana class, or second-class, the ksatriya class, administrator class, and the third-class, mercantile, or business man, and the fourth-class, sudras, worker. If education is given according to the quality and position, then there will be complete system in the whole human society. Take the same example. Just like your body, if your head is working nicely, if your hand is working nicely, if your stomach is working nicely, if your leg is working nicely, then the whole body is to be considered as healthy and working nicely. If any part of this body, either head, leg, or arms or belly, does not work nicely, then the whole body becomes diseased. So that is the instruction of Krsna, Bhagavad-gita. That... Not that...
Now there is a hobby that classless society. Classless society cannot be. That is not possible. So long you are in the material world there must be classes. By nature, there is. Just like even in birds, there are a class of birds known as the crows and there is a class of birds which are called the swans. The swans will try to reside in a place where there is very clean water, flowers, good trees, nice arrangement parking. So they will flock there. Birds of the same feather flock together. And the crows, the will flock... In your country you don't find many crows, but in India there are many crows. They go to the place where all garbages are there. They'll enjoy there. So there is division actually, taste. But one thing is, that the human form of body, although there is natural such division, but one can be raised to the higher position by this Krsna consciousness movement. So far material body is concerned, you cannot change the quality. This is already. One has got the particular type of body by nature's arrangement according to the quality. According to the quality. Now, if you want to change him to the better quality, then you have to accept this Krsna consciousness. Because Krsna consciousness is on the spiritual platform. It has nothing to do with the material platform. From the material platform, you cannot change anyone's quality.
For example, I can tell you, practical example, in United States, America, the government is spending millions of dollars to stop this intoxication habit, LSD habit. Many responsible government officers, they have given us certificate. But they could not control. But in our Krsna consciousness movement, anyone who is coming, even though coming from the LSD-addicted society, still, as soon as he comes to our society he gives us not only LSD or any intoxication, he gives up even drinking tea, coffee and smoking cigarette. You can at once check. Because our principle is: anyone who wants to join seriously this Krsna consciousness movement, just like these boys, they have joined, our first condition is that one must give up these four prohibited things: no illicit sex, no gambling, no meat-eating, no intoxication. So that is being possible. Although they are habituated to all these things from their very beginning of life, but as soon as they take to Krsna consciousness activities, they give up these habits very easily.
So if, practically, the world wants classless society, then one has to take this Krsna consciousness movement. Then there will be classless society. We have got in our society boys and girls from various parts of the world. There are Africans, there are Indians, there are Canadians, Englishmen, American, Australian, but they have forgotten that he is Englishmen or American or Australian or black or white or Indian. No. They have forgotten. They are simply interested in Krsna consciousness. This is the importance of the movement. If you want classless society, actually pure, without any contamination of these material modes of nature, then this Krsna consciousness movement is the prime movement. That is the definition of Krsna consciousness movement, sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam tat-paratvena nirmalam, hrsikena [Cc. Madhya 19.170], anukulyena krsnanusilanam bhaktir uttama [Cc. Madhya 19.167]. Bhakti, devotional service, first-class devotional service can be achieved when one is freed from all designations. So long one feels designated that "I am American," "I am Indian," "I am Englishmen," "I am German," "I am black," "I am white," and, no. You have to feel yourself. Not feeling, practically, training that I am spirit soul, I am eternal part and parcel of the Supreme Lord. When you come to this position, this is called sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam [Cc. Madhya 19.170]. Freed from all designation. These are, the bodily identification is designation.
Just like you are sitting here, so many boys and girls in different dress. Some is dressed in black coat or some in white coat or red coat. If I ask you what you are, if you say "I am black coat," or somebody says, "I am white coat," that is not your identification. Similarly, we living entities, we are neither American or Indian nor African nor Englishman. We are all spirit soul. That is our position. Aham brahmasmi. This is perfect knowledge. Aham brahmasmi, I am spirit soul. When you come to this understanding, aham brahmasmi, sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam [Cc. Madhya 19.170], then your position will be different from this material understanding. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma [Bg. 18.54]. Prasannatma means jubilant. You'll find all our boys and girls, they're always jubilant. Unless they are jubilant, they cannot dance in this way. It is not dancing dogs. They are not dancing dogs. They're feeling jubilant, and therefore they are dancing. This is the position of brahma-bhutah prasannatma [Bg. 18.54]. Prasannatma, unless one is very satisfied he cannot be jubilant. He should be morose, he cannot dance, he cannot chant. That's a fact. So this is sign of brahma-bhutah. Without any material designation. Brahma-bhutah. Everything is there in the Bhagavad-gita. If you study carefully you'll understand everything. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma na socati na kanksati [Bg. 18.54]. How one is jubilant? When one is freed from all anxieties. What are these anxieties? Anxieties mean if I lose something, then I will lament, and if I haven't got anything, something, then I hanker after it.
So far we are concerned, we have no business, we have no profession. We do not know what we shall eat tomorrow. Or in the evening. We are in such a position. But we have no anxiety. You can see practically. We have no anxiety that "what shall I eat in the evening, what shall I eat tomorrow, there is no bank balance, there is no money." No. There is no anxiety. We know certain that as soon as we go, chant Hare Krsna, Krsna will send us everything. That is actually a fact. If you study our activities, you'll see practically it is so. Na socati na kanksati. We have no hankering, no lamentation. Suppose we have got thousand dollars, and somebody takes away. It happens so. Somebody comes and mixes with us and takes away some money. So we are not very much sorry for that. We think: Krsna gave us, and Krsna has taken away. It doesn't matter. Na socati na kanksati. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma na socati kanksati samah sarvesu [Bg. 18.54]. Equal to all living entities. Our philosophy is not like that, that we give protection to the human being and send the cows to the slaughterhouse. No, that is not our philosophy. Samah sarvesu bhutesu. We think on this subject matter, that if a man is killed, as he's put into so difficult position for being killed, the animal also. They also feel. It is nonsense to think that animal has no soul, no. Everyone has got soul. There are 8,400,000 species or forms of life. Everyone has got soul. Even the ant has got soul, or the elephant has got soul, what to speak of other animals. Everyone, even the trees, birds, beasts, plants, everyone has got soul. And in the Bhagavad-gita Krsna says
sarva-yonisu kaunteya
murtayah sambhavanti yah
tasam brahma mahad yonir
aham bija-pradah pita
[Bg. 14.4]
The part and parcel of Krsna or God, the soul, is there everywhere. Don't think that simply human being has got soul. This is not very good philosophy, that the animals have no soul. They have got soul. You can practically examine. What is the symptom of possessing soul? First of all try to understand. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gita: avinasi tu tad viddhi yena sarvam idam tatam: The presence of soul can be perceived when there is consciousness on the body. This is the proof. When you pinch my body, I feel pain, when I pinch your body, you feel pain, when I pinch an animal's body, he also feels pain. Even I pinch even the tree's body he feels pain. It is scientifically proved. Sir Jagadish Candra Bose has proved by machine that when you cut a tree, it feels pain and it is recorded in this statistic machine. So everyone has got the soul. So how you can think...?
When you take the animal to the slaughterhouse for killing, he cries. Why? Because he's feeling pain. He knows that "I'm going to be killed." So there is soul. Soul is there. You don't think that soul is not there: soul is there. Therefore, a Krsna conscious person who has realized God, he is samah sarvesu bhutesu, he's equal to all living entities. He'll feel pain even for cutting a tree. He'll feel pain, he'll feel pain even he traverses over an ant. There is a story that one hunter, he was killing in the forest all kinds of animals and he was killing them half. So they were suffering too much severe pain. So Narada Muni was going in that way. He saw that these animals have been half killed, and they are so much suffering. Who is doing that? So he searched out the hunter. He requested, "Sir you are killing the animals, why don't you kill them all at a time? Why you are killing half? They are suffering. You'll have to suffer in that way." The hunter did not know that killing animals is sinful and he has to suffer again. So he said, "Sir, I am trained like this by my father. This is my profession. I do not know what is sin, but this is the first time I am hearing from you that killing this animal, especially in this way, is very much sinful."
So because he saw a saintly person, he got his sense. He asked him that "How I can get rid of this sinful life?" So Narada Muni suggested, that "I shall give you the way how you can become free from this sinful life." So he made him a disciple and asked him to chant this Hare Krsna mantra and sit down on the bank of the Ganges, and the hunter said, "Sir where shall I get my food?" Narada Muni said, "I'll send you, don't bother. I'll send you food." So the village people, when they understood that the hunter has become a saintly person, so everyone used to come and see him. Somebody was bringing some rice, somebody wheat, somebody some sweets, some fruits, some flower. So huge quantity of foodstuff was coming. So in this way, he became a perfect saintly Vaisnava.
Later on, when Narada Muni came to see him, he was coming to receive the spiritual master jumping over the road. So when the hunter, now he becomes Vaisnava, so Narada Muni and his friend, Parvata Muni asked "Why you are jumping?" He said, "Sir, there are so many ants, so I was trying to save their life." The same hunter who was killing animals one time half-dead and was enjoying, is no more interested to kill even an ant. This is called saintly life. Samah sarvesu bhutesu. Samah, equal to all living entities. Not that simply protection should be given to the human being.
And the Communist philosophy also, there are so many defects. They also think of equal rights for everyone but why not for the animals? What right you have got to kill the animals? Similarly, the animal also kill you. So this is not organized society. The organized society should be that there should be first-class men, brahmana. They would give advice to the second-class men, the administrators. And the administrator class of men, they will see that everyone is following the religious principles. And the third class men or the mercantile class of men, they should produce food. Krsi-go-raksya-vanijyam vaisya-karma svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.44]. You'll find here, I'll read it. So, in this way, there must be classification. Not that everyone is one. No, that cannot be. By nature's division... Just you try to understand from your body. The nature's division is there. Why nature has not made only the head? No leg, no arms. No. They are required. But they should not cooperate. It doesn't matter that one is brahmana, one is ksatriya, one is sudra. Just the same example of the body. The head is there, very important department of this body. But the leg is not unimportant. Although the leg is not as important as the head, still leg is also required. There is necessity. You cannot avoid the leg. Similarly, there should be first-class intelligent men, administrative class of men, mercantile class of men and the worker class of men, but they should cooperate.
Just like in this body, the head, the arms, the belly and the legs, they are cooperating for the proper upkeep of the bodily health. Similarly, if we actually want the human society should be organized, then the intelligent class of men, the administrative class of men, the mercantile class of men, and the worker class of men, they should cooperate for understanding Krsna, or God. Then there will be harmony in the human society. Without God consciousness, everyone will think "I am very important, others are not important. I should be given only protection, not others." No. As soon as you become Krsna conscious, as soon as you become brahma-bhutah, then you'll see samah sarvesu bhutesu. Samah, samah means equality to all kinds of living entities. Not only human being.
How many human beings are there out of 8,400,000 species of life? A few only. Only 400,000 species. This information we get from the sastras, Vedic literature. Bhagavad-gita is the summary of all Vedic literature. Therefore, it is advised here that how the first-class of men should be trained up. How the second-class men should be trained up, how the third-class men should be trained up and how the fourth-class men should be trained up. Not that everyone should become first-class. Even everyone is not first-class, because there is cooperation, there is no distinction between first-class and third-class or fourth-class, the same example. Just like if there is some disease on my leg, it does not mean that I shall neglect, I shall take care of the head only. No. I spend more money to cure the disease of the leg. May not be I don't spend any money for the head. So no part of society is unimportant provided there is cooperation. But there must be division, first-class, second class, third class, fourth-class. There must be division. Without division, as there is division anywhere you go, in office, there are the head department, the directors, they are working in a different atmosphere. There must be division, there is already division, you cannot avoid it. Because the material nature is working in three modes of material nature. So anyone who is in the modes of goodness, he's not equal to the person who is in the modes of ignorance. That is not possible. There is difference, but they should be trained up in such a way that they can cooperate to understand the (this) Absolute Truth. That is first-class society. That is real perfect human society. So here it is said
samo damas tapah saucam
ksantir arjavam eva ca
jnanam vijnanam astikyam
brahma-karma svabhava-jam
[Bg. 18.42]
If you want to train the first-class men then they should be qualified like this. Samah, samah means controlling the senses. Controlling the senses, samah. Damah, controlling the mind. These are very disturbing elements, our senses are very disturbing elements. My eye is dictating, "Please take me to see that naked dance," Yes. "Yes, come on, I'm going." So, the eyes are dictating some way, the tongue is dictating some way, the ear is dictating some way. Therefore, one should be trained up not to be dictated by the senses, but he must be master of the senses. That is called samah. And damah, mind is dictating something. You should not be carried away by the dictation of the mind, but mind should be carried by your dictation. That is called damah. These are the qualities of the first-class man. Not that because I have got some degrees and I'm dictated by my mind and senses. He is not first-class man. He's not first-class man. Because he's the servant of the senses. How he can be first-class man? One must be the master of the senses. Then he is first-class man.
In our, there is one Canakya Pandita, he was a great politician. Perhaps those who have gone to India, New Delhi, there is Canakya-puri where all the ambassadors and foreign diplomats are situated. That Canakya Muni, Canakya Pandita, he was a great learned brahmana and politician. He gave his instruction. So he gives the formula, "Who is a learned scholar?" Who is a learned scholar. He has given three formulas. What is that?
matrvat para-daresu
para-dravyesu lostravat
atmavat sarva-bhutesu
yah pasyati sa panditah
Who is a learned man. He said, "A person who can see all the women of the world, except his wife, as mother." Matrvat-para-daresu. Para-dara means other's wife. If one has learned this art how to see other's wife as mother, and para-dravyesu lostravat, and other's riches, possessions, as garbage in the street. Just like you don't touch the garbage. Similarly, other's property, other's riches, one does not touch or even see to it. And he thinks all woman as mothers except his own wife. And atmavat sarva-bhutesu, and treating everyone equally, as he wants to be treated himself. If by pinching your body or giving pain to your body, if you feel pain, you should not give pain to any living entity. If one has learned these three things: matrvat para-daresu para-dravyesu lostravat atmavat sarva-bhutesu, then he's is learned scholar. It is not that one has got this degree from this university, then he has got. That degree will not help us. Unless one is God consciousness, he cannot have any good qualification. That is the Vedic injunction. Yasyasti bhaktir bhagavaty akincana sarvair gunais tatra samasate surah [SB 5.18.12]. As I have given the example of the hunter: before becoming God conscious, he was a cruel hunter, and after being God conscious, he was not ready to kill even an ant. This is the result. Samah sarvesu bhutesu mad-bhaktim labhate param [Bg. 18.54]. Then he's entered in the devotional service of the Lord. Not abruptly one can become devotee. The symptoms must be there, the qualities must be there. Suppose if somebody comes and says, "I am very rich man." So I shall have to see his symptoms, whether he has got a nice car, nice dress, or, there are so many symptoms. Similarly, simply by speaking that "I am God conscious" will not do. These are the symptoms:
brahma-bhutah prasannatma
na socati na kanksati
samah sarvesu bhutesu
mad-bhaktim labhate param
[Bg. 18.54]
Bhaktya mam abhijanati yavan yas casmi tattvatah [Bg. 18.55]. The God can be realized only by the devotees who have got all these good qualities. These good qualities already mentioned, samah sarvesu bhutesu. That is God consciousness. God consciousness does not mean that I shall be protected, I shall be happy, and let others be unhappy. Let them go to hell. Never mind. No. That is not God consciousness. Therefore, in order to become perfectly God conscious, the first-class men must be there in the society. And that first-class man is described here, samo damas tapah: he is able to control the mind, he is able to control the senses, tapah, he has undergone austerities, tapah. Saucam, he is always clean, outside and inside, saucam ksantih, always peaceful, arjavam, simplicity, and jnanam, full of knowledge, vijnanam, practical application of knowledge in life, jnanam vijnanam astikyam, and firmly convinced about the existence of the Supreme Lord. These are the qualification of the first-class man. Brahma-karma svabhava-jam. These are the qualities.
So there should be educational department to create first-class men by all these qualities. How to become controller of the mind, how to become controller of the senses, how to become cleansed, bahyabhyantaram, inside clean and outside clean. Saucam, titiksa, how to become tolerant, tolerant. One should be not agitated by a single cause. Tolerant, and similarly, simplicity. He should be so simple. It is said simplicity: even the enemy inquires from him some secret thing, he'll say, "Yes, it is like this." Simplicity. And jnanam full knowledge. Full knowledge, what is this world, what I am, what is my relation with this world, what is God, what is my relation with God. Everything full knowledge. And vijnanam, vijnanam means completely application of the knowledge of life. And astikyam, astikyam means full faith in transcendental literature, that is called also astikyam, and full faith in the existence of the Supreme Lord. Astik... These are the brahminical qualifications. So those who are claiming to become first-class, learned men in the society, they must have all these qualifications. This is Bhagavad-gita's teaching. The second-class man, what is that?
sauryam tejo dhrtir daksyam
yuddhe capy apalayanam
danam isvara-bhavas ca
ksatram karma svabhava-jam
[Bg. 18.43]
Administrator class. Ksatriya, ksatriya means those who are in the governmental power. They should be sauryam, very powerful, and very influential. Sauryam tejah. Nowadays, without seeing these qualifications, a third-class, fourth-class man is voted, and therefore we find out that Mr. Nixon, he's attacked now so many... Because he has no ksatriya qualification. These are the ksatriya qualification, administrator. Saucam, sauryam tejo dhrtih. He must be determined, daksyam, he must very expert, yuddhe capy apalayanam, and he should not flee away from fighting. When there is... Nowadays, when there is... the politicians and diplomats, they sit down very safely in their room and poor people, they are, by force, sent to fight. This is not ksatriya, this is not administration. The ksatriya is, he must come forward first of all. Then others will follow. Yuddhe capy apalayanam. And danam, he must be very charitable. That is another qualification of the administrator. Isvara-bhavas ca, and the governing spirit. These are the ksatram karma svabhava-jam. Similarly, this is second class.
The third-class means krsi-go-raksya-vanijyam vaisya-karma svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.44]. Third-class means mercantile traders. They should produce food, enough krsi, agricultural products, and go-raksya. Now we see instead of go-raksya... Go-raksya means protection to the cows. Instead of protection to the cows, they are killing the cows. How you can have perfect society? Cows must be protected. It is so important animal. It is giving the you nectarean food milk, and from milk, you can save your children, you can save your diseased persons. And how it is that you take the cow's milk and send it for slaughterhouse. Oh, this is not, not at all human civilization. Here it is said go-raksya. You should give all protection to this important animal. Krsna does not say that you should protect the pigs and hogs or other animals. He especially meant the cows because cow is very important animal to the human society. If there are meat-eaters, they can kill other animals, but they should not kill the cow. This is, if you want actually perfect society. Krsi-go-raksya-vanijyam [Bg. 18.44]. And these persons, they let them produce enough food grains, and where there is no, there is scarcity of food grain, let them supply there. That is called trade. Vanijyam. Vanijyam.
But at the present moment, there are so many countries, they can produce profuse quantity of food grain. Sometimes they do it and throw it in the ocean for what is called, economic balance. This is not good. Everyone should produce enough quantity of food grains, and if there is shortage, they should send there. In this way, the whole world should cooperate. There is United Nations, but what they are doing? Let them study Bhagavad-gita, how to make United Nations. That will be perfect. Not these short-sighted men, with politics and diplomacy in the heart, they can bring all the nations united. That is not possible. Let them discuss Bhagavad-gita. Let them discuss how perfect society can be established. Then there will be peace. And vaisya-karma svabhava-jam.
And paricaryatmakam karma sudrasyapi svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.44]. And those who are not intelligent, to be trained up as a brahmana or a ksatriya or a vaisya. The fourth class men, let them work these three other classes, let them work. Paricaryatmakam karma sudrasyapi svabhava-jam. In this way the human society should be divided into four divisions, they should cooperate, and they should be trained up. Not a single man should remain unemployed. He must be engaged in some employment as a brahmana, as a ksatriya, as a sudra or as a vaisya. Otherwise, idle brain will be devil's workshop. Therefore, in spite of so much educational propaganda in the Western countries, the young men are coming to become hippies. Because there is no proper training. Here is the hint, Bhagavad-gita gives you. You train the students in that way, then there will be perfect society. Thank you very much. Hare Krsna. (end)
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Bhagavad-gita 18.41 -- Stockholm, September 7, 1973
© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International. Used with permission.
For higher quality audio, you may purchase the MP3s/CDs from www.Krishna.com
Prabhupada:By quality and by work, there is, or there must be four divisions of the social structure. Catur-varnyam, first-class, second-class, third-class and fourth-class. That is very natural. Just like in your body, my body is divided into four divisions. The head, head department. In every, I mean to say, unit, there is head department, the first-class department, the second-class department. So we can understand from our own body, there is head department, there is arms department, there is belly department and there is the leg department. So head is first-class. Because if the arms, belly and legs are there and head is cut off, then everything is useless. If the head is there, arm is cut off, you can go on with your business. So there is four divisions everywhere. Krsna says:
na tad asti prthivyam va
divi devesu va punah
sattvam prakrti-jair muktam
yad ebhih syat tribhir gunaih
Krsna says that either on this planet or in other planets in the outer space, or anywhere, the three qualities or three modes of material nature is working. The modes of goodness, the modes of passion, and the modes of ignorance. Everywhere, you'll find these three classes of living entities. Not three classes, four classes. The first-class, goodness. Second-class, passion, third-class, mixed passion and ignorance, and fourth-class ignorance. And below the fourth class, all fifth class, pancama.
So according to these three modes of material nature, there must be division of the society. The first class men are called brahmana, most learned scholar. Learned scholar means, as I was explaining, one who has complete knowledge of God, that is learned scholar. Otherwise, to know how to eat, how to sleep, how to have sexual intercourse and how to defend, this, these knowledge is also there in the animals. They know how to eat. There is no need of university for teaching how to eat or how to sleep or how to have sex life or how to defend. These are animal necessities. But actually human being should be still more advanced in knowledge. That knowledge is not comprising only eating, sleeping, mating and defending. That knowledge is to understand the Absolute Truth, God. That knowledge.
Therefore, the Vedanta-sutra philosophy, that begins with the word athato brahma jijnasa. Now, this life, this human form of life, is meant for inquiring about the Absolute Truth. Athato brahma jijnasa. Brahma means the Absolute Truth. So, that should be the subject matter for studying in human form of life. So Bhagavad-gita is the right book to understand about that brahma, or the Supreme Personality of Godhead, or the Absolute Truth, whatever you call. The Absolute Truth is known in three phases: Brahman, Paramatma and Bhagavan.
vadanti tat tattva-vidas
tattvam yaj jnanam advayam
brahmeti paramatmeti
bhagavan iti sabdyate
[SB 1.2.11]
The Absolute Truth is one, but it is realized from three angles of visions. Some of them are realizing the Absolute Truth as impersonal Brahman, some of them are realizing the Absolute Truth as the localized Paramatma, and some of them are realizing the Absolute Truth as the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Absolute Truth is one, but because we are under different modes of material nature, we are understanding the Absolute Truth in three modes of material nature.
So Krsna says that these three modes of material nature is current all over the universe. Even in the topmost planet down to the lowest planet. Therefore he says: na tad asti prthivyam va divi devesu va punah. Prthivyam means on this earth. Or in the other higher planetary system or even the heavenly planets. Everywhere. Sattvam prakrti-jair muktam. Nowhere, anyone is freed from the influence of these modes of material nature. Sattvam means existence. Sattvam prakrti-jaih. Prakrti-jaih means by the material nature, gunaih, means the modes, this goodness, passion, and ignorance. Yad ebhih syat tribhir gunaih. Everything, everywhere, even amongst the plants life, beast life, there these three gunas are working.
Just like some trees, they're useless. Neither produce any nice fruit nor flower. That is third-class, in ignorance. In animals also. Just like cows, they are first-class animal, in the modes of goodness, supplying so valuable nutritious food, milk. But the cats and dogs, they are third-class animals. This is the calculation of the three modes of material nature. Either human being or animals or trees, birds, everywhere Krsna says, or in the higher planetary system, everywhere, these three modes of material nature is working. Therefore, in the human society, because there are three modes of material nature, the classification should be made scientifically according to these three modes of material nature. And that is explained by Bhagavan, Sri Krsna, in the Bhagavad-gita, catur-varnyam maya srstam: [Bg. 4.13] four classes of men. Brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya and sudra. Brahmana means the most intelligent class of men who can understand even up to the knowledge of Brahman, brahma janati iti brahmana. And the second class are the ksatriyas or the administrative class of men, and the third-class are the mercantile class of men, industrialists, traders, agriculturalists. Everything will be explained. And the fourth-class men means workers. They have no intelligence, but they find out some good master and get some money. That's all. So there are four classes. So here Krsna says,
brahmana-ksatriya-visam
sudranam ca parantapa
karmani pravibhaktani
svabhava-prabhavair gunaih
According to the modes of material nature, the brahmana should be selected, the ksatriya should be selected, the vaisyas or the mercantile people should be selected, and the sudras, the worker class, should be selected.
Then Krsna says, that how the brahminical class should be educated. This should be taken very seriously by educational department of all countries. And it is the duty of the government to see that every man according to his quality is working, is employed. Not that... Secular state does not mean they should be callous about the quality and work of the citizens. There must be department of practical psychology to see the students, in which class he belongs to. Either he belongs to the first-class, brahmana class, or second-class, the ksatriya class, administrator class, and the third-class, mercantile, or business man, and the fourth-class, sudras, worker. If education is given according to the quality and position, then there will be complete system in the whole human society. Take the same example. Just like your body, if your head is working nicely, if your hand is working nicely, if your stomach is working nicely, if your leg is working nicely, then the whole body is to be considered as healthy and working nicely. If any part of this body, either head, leg, or arms or belly, does not work nicely, then the whole body becomes diseased. So that is the instruction of Krsna, Bhagavad-gita. That... Not that...
Now there is a hobby that classless society. Classless society cannot be. That is not possible. So long you are in the material world there must be classes. By nature, there is. Just like even in birds, there are a class of birds known as the crows and there is a class of birds which are called the swans. The swans will try to reside in a place where there is very clean water, flowers, good trees, nice arrangement parking. So they will flock there. Birds of the same feather flock together. And the crows, the will flock... In your country you don't find many crows, but in India there are many crows. They go to the place where all garbages are there. They'll enjoy there. So there is division actually, taste. But one thing is, that the human form of body, although there is natural such division, but one can be raised to the higher position by this Krsna consciousness movement. So far material body is concerned, you cannot change the quality. This is already. One has got the particular type of body by nature's arrangement according to the quality. According to the quality. Now, if you want to change him to the better quality, then you have to accept this Krsna consciousness. Because Krsna consciousness is on the spiritual platform. It has nothing to do with the material platform. From the material platform, you cannot change anyone's quality.
For example, I can tell you, practical example, in United States, America, the government is spending millions of dollars to stop this intoxication habit, LSD habit. Many responsible government officers, they have given us certificate. But they could not control. But in our Krsna consciousness movement, anyone who is coming, even though coming from the LSD-addicted society, still, as soon as he comes to our society he gives us not only LSD or any intoxication, he gives up even drinking tea, coffee and smoking cigarette. You can at once check. Because our principle is: anyone who wants to join seriously this Krsna consciousness movement, just like these boys, they have joined, our first condition is that one must give up these four prohibited things: no illicit sex, no gambling, no meat-eating, no intoxication. So that is being possible. Although they are habituated to all these things from their very beginning of life, but as soon as they take to Krsna consciousness activities, they give up these habits very easily.
So if, practically, the world wants classless society, then one has to take this Krsna consciousness movement. Then there will be classless society. We have got in our society boys and girls from various parts of the world. There are Africans, there are Indians, there are Canadians, Englishmen, American, Australian, but they have forgotten that he is Englishmen or American or Australian or black or white or Indian. No. They have forgotten. They are simply interested in Krsna consciousness. This is the importance of the movement. If you want classless society, actually pure, without any contamination of these material modes of nature, then this Krsna consciousness movement is the prime movement. That is the definition of Krsna consciousness movement, sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam tat-paratvena nirmalam, hrsikena [Cc. Madhya 19.170], anukulyena krsnanusilanam bhaktir uttama [Cc. Madhya 19.167]. Bhakti, devotional service, first-class devotional service can be achieved when one is freed from all designations. So long one feels designated that "I am American," "I am Indian," "I am Englishmen," "I am German," "I am black," "I am white," and, no. You have to feel yourself. Not feeling, practically, training that I am spirit soul, I am eternal part and parcel of the Supreme Lord. When you come to this position, this is called sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam [Cc. Madhya 19.170]. Freed from all designation. These are, the bodily identification is designation.
Just like you are sitting here, so many boys and girls in different dress. Some is dressed in black coat or some in white coat or red coat. If I ask you what you are, if you say "I am black coat," or somebody says, "I am white coat," that is not your identification. Similarly, we living entities, we are neither American or Indian nor African nor Englishman. We are all spirit soul. That is our position. Aham brahmasmi. This is perfect knowledge. Aham brahmasmi, I am spirit soul. When you come to this understanding, aham brahmasmi, sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam [Cc. Madhya 19.170], then your position will be different from this material understanding. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma [Bg. 18.54]. Prasannatma means jubilant. You'll find all our boys and girls, they're always jubilant. Unless they are jubilant, they cannot dance in this way. It is not dancing dogs. They are not dancing dogs. They're feeling jubilant, and therefore they are dancing. This is the position of brahma-bhutah prasannatma [Bg. 18.54]. Prasannatma, unless one is very satisfied he cannot be jubilant. He should be morose, he cannot dance, he cannot chant. That's a fact. So this is sign of brahma-bhutah. Without any material designation. Brahma-bhutah. Everything is there in the Bhagavad-gita. If you study carefully you'll understand everything. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma na socati na kanksati [Bg. 18.54]. How one is jubilant? When one is freed from all anxieties. What are these anxieties? Anxieties mean if I lose something, then I will lament, and if I haven't got anything, something, then I hanker after it.
So far we are concerned, we have no business, we have no profession. We do not know what we shall eat tomorrow. Or in the evening. We are in such a position. But we have no anxiety. You can see practically. We have no anxiety that "what shall I eat in the evening, what shall I eat tomorrow, there is no bank balance, there is no money." No. There is no anxiety. We know certain that as soon as we go, chant Hare Krsna, Krsna will send us everything. That is actually a fact. If you study our activities, you'll see practically it is so. Na socati na kanksati. We have no hankering, no lamentation. Suppose we have got thousand dollars, and somebody takes away. It happens so. Somebody comes and mixes with us and takes away some money. So we are not very much sorry for that. We think: Krsna gave us, and Krsna has taken away. It doesn't matter. Na socati na kanksati. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma na socati kanksati samah sarvesu [Bg. 18.54]. Equal to all living entities. Our philosophy is not like that, that we give protection to the human being and send the cows to the slaughterhouse. No, that is not our philosophy. Samah sarvesu bhutesu. We think on this subject matter, that if a man is killed, as he's put into so difficult position for being killed, the animal also. They also feel. It is nonsense to think that animal has no soul, no. Everyone has got soul. There are 8,400,000 species or forms of life. Everyone has got soul. Even the ant has got soul, or the elephant has got soul, what to speak of other animals. Everyone, even the trees, birds, beasts, plants, everyone has got soul. And in the Bhagavad-gita Krsna says
sarva-yonisu kaunteya
murtayah sambhavanti yah
tasam brahma mahad yonir
aham bija-pradah pita
[Bg. 14.4]
The part and parcel of Krsna or God, the soul, is there everywhere. Don't think that simply human being has got soul. This is not very good philosophy, that the animals have no soul. They have got soul. You can practically examine. What is the symptom of possessing soul? First of all try to understand. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gita: avinasi tu tad viddhi yena sarvam idam tatam: The presence of soul can be perceived when there is consciousness on the body. This is the proof. When you pinch my body, I feel pain, when I pinch your body, you feel pain, when I pinch an animal's body, he also feels pain. Even I pinch even the tree's body he feels pain. It is scientifically proved. Sir Jagadish Candra Bose has proved by machine that when you cut a tree, it feels pain and it is recorded in this statistic machine. So everyone has got the soul. So how you can think...?
When you take the animal to the slaughterhouse for killing, he cries. Why? Because he's feeling pain. He knows that "I'm going to be killed." So there is soul. Soul is there. You don't think that soul is not there: soul is there. Therefore, a Krsna conscious person who has realized God, he is samah sarvesu bhutesu, he's equal to all living entities. He'll feel pain even for cutting a tree. He'll feel pain, he'll feel pain even he traverses over an ant. There is a story that one hunter, he was killing in the forest all kinds of animals and he was killing them half. So they were suffering too much severe pain. So Narada Muni was going in that way. He saw that these animals have been half killed, and they are so much suffering. Who is doing that? So he searched out the hunter. He requested, "Sir you are killing the animals, why don't you kill them all at a time? Why you are killing half? They are suffering. You'll have to suffer in that way." The hunter did not know that killing animals is sinful and he has to suffer again. So he said, "Sir, I am trained like this by my father. This is my profession. I do not know what is sin, but this is the first time I am hearing from you that killing this animal, especially in this way, is very much sinful."
So because he saw a saintly person, he got his sense. He asked him that "How I can get rid of this sinful life?" So Narada Muni suggested, that "I shall give you the way how you can become free from this sinful life." So he made him a disciple and asked him to chant this Hare Krsna mantra and sit down on the bank of the Ganges, and the hunter said, "Sir where shall I get my food?" Narada Muni said, "I'll send you, don't bother. I'll send you food." So the village people, when they understood that the hunter has become a saintly person, so everyone used to come and see him. Somebody was bringing some rice, somebody wheat, somebody some sweets, some fruits, some flower. So huge quantity of foodstuff was coming. So in this way, he became a perfect saintly Vaisnava.
Later on, when Narada Muni came to see him, he was coming to receive the spiritual master jumping over the road. So when the hunter, now he becomes Vaisnava, so Narada Muni and his friend, Parvata Muni asked "Why you are jumping?" He said, "Sir, there are so many ants, so I was trying to save their life." The same hunter who was killing animals one time half-dead and was enjoying, is no more interested to kill even an ant. This is called saintly life. Samah sarvesu bhutesu. Samah, equal to all living entities. Not that simply protection should be given to the human being.
And the Communist philosophy also, there are so many defects. They also think of equal rights for everyone but why not for the animals? What right you have got to kill the animals? Similarly, the animal also kill you. So this is not organized society. The organized society should be that there should be first-class men, brahmana. They would give advice to the second-class men, the administrators. And the administrator class of men, they will see that everyone is following the religious principles. And the third class men or the mercantile class of men, they should produce food. Krsi-go-raksya-vanijyam vaisya-karma svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.44]. You'll find here, I'll read it. So, in this way, there must be classification. Not that everyone is one. No, that cannot be. By nature's division... Just you try to understand from your body. The nature's division is there. Why nature has not made only the head? No leg, no arms. No. They are required. But they should not cooperate. It doesn't matter that one is brahmana, one is ksatriya, one is sudra. Just the same example of the body. The head is there, very important department of this body. But the leg is not unimportant. Although the leg is not as important as the head, still leg is also required. There is necessity. You cannot avoid the leg. Similarly, there should be first-class intelligent men, administrative class of men, mercantile class of men and the worker class of men, but they should cooperate.
Just like in this body, the head, the arms, the belly and the legs, they are cooperating for the proper upkeep of the bodily health. Similarly, if we actually want the human society should be organized, then the intelligent class of men, the administrative class of men, the mercantile class of men, and the worker class of men, they should cooperate for understanding Krsna, or God. Then there will be harmony in the human society. Without God consciousness, everyone will think "I am very important, others are not important. I should be given only protection, not others." No. As soon as you become Krsna conscious, as soon as you become brahma-bhutah, then you'll see samah sarvesu bhutesu. Samah, samah means equality to all kinds of living entities. Not only human being.
How many human beings are there out of 8,400,000 species of life? A few only. Only 400,000 species. This information we get from the sastras, Vedic literature. Bhagavad-gita is the summary of all Vedic literature. Therefore, it is advised here that how the first-class of men should be trained up. How the second-class men should be trained up, how the third-class men should be trained up and how the fourth-class men should be trained up. Not that everyone should become first-class. Even everyone is not first-class, because there is cooperation, there is no distinction between first-class and third-class or fourth-class, the same example. Just like if there is some disease on my leg, it does not mean that I shall neglect, I shall take care of the head only. No. I spend more money to cure the disease of the leg. May not be I don't spend any money for the head. So no part of society is unimportant provided there is cooperation. But there must be division, first-class, second class, third class, fourth-class. There must be division. Without division, as there is division anywhere you go, in office, there are the head department, the directors, they are working in a different atmosphere. There must be division, there is already division, you cannot avoid it. Because the material nature is working in three modes of material nature. So anyone who is in the modes of goodness, he's not equal to the person who is in the modes of ignorance. That is not possible. There is difference, but they should be trained up in such a way that they can cooperate to understand the (this) Absolute Truth. That is first-class society. That is real perfect human society. So here it is said
samo damas tapah saucam
ksantir arjavam eva ca
jnanam vijnanam astikyam
brahma-karma svabhava-jam
[Bg. 18.42]
If you want to train the first-class men then they should be qualified like this. Samah, samah means controlling the senses. Controlling the senses, samah. Damah, controlling the mind. These are very disturbing elements, our senses are very disturbing elements. My eye is dictating, "Please take me to see that naked dance," Yes. "Yes, come on, I'm going." So, the eyes are dictating some way, the tongue is dictating some way, the ear is dictating some way. Therefore, one should be trained up not to be dictated by the senses, but he must be master of the senses. That is called samah. And damah, mind is dictating something. You should not be carried away by the dictation of the mind, but mind should be carried by your dictation. That is called damah. These are the qualities of the first-class man. Not that because I have got some degrees and I'm dictated by my mind and senses. He is not first-class man. He's not first-class man. Because he's the servant of the senses. How he can be first-class man? One must be the master of the senses. Then he is first-class man.
In our, there is one Canakya Pandita, he was a great politician. Perhaps those who have gone to India, New Delhi, there is Canakya-puri where all the ambassadors and foreign diplomats are situated. That Canakya Muni, Canakya Pandita, he was a great learned brahmana and politician. He gave his instruction. So he gives the formula, "Who is a learned scholar?" Who is a learned scholar. He has given three formulas. What is that?
matrvat para-daresu
para-dravyesu lostravat
atmavat sarva-bhutesu
yah pasyati sa panditah
Who is a learned man. He said, "A person who can see all the women of the world, except his wife, as mother." Matrvat-para-daresu. Para-dara means other's wife. If one has learned this art how to see other's wife as mother, and para-dravyesu lostravat, and other's riches, possessions, as garbage in the street. Just like you don't touch the garbage. Similarly, other's property, other's riches, one does not touch or even see to it. And he thinks all woman as mothers except his own wife. And atmavat sarva-bhutesu, and treating everyone equally, as he wants to be treated himself. If by pinching your body or giving pain to your body, if you feel pain, you should not give pain to any living entity. If one has learned these three things: matrvat para-daresu para-dravyesu lostravat atmavat sarva-bhutesu, then he's is learned scholar. It is not that one has got this degree from this university, then he has got. That degree will not help us. Unless one is God consciousness, he cannot have any good qualification. That is the Vedic injunction. Yasyasti bhaktir bhagavaty akincana sarvair gunais tatra samasate surah [SB 5.18.12]. As I have given the example of the hunter: before becoming God conscious, he was a cruel hunter, and after being God conscious, he was not ready to kill even an ant. This is the result. Samah sarvesu bhutesu mad-bhaktim labhate param [Bg. 18.54]. Then he's entered in the devotional service of the Lord. Not abruptly one can become devotee. The symptoms must be there, the qualities must be there. Suppose if somebody comes and says, "I am very rich man." So I shall have to see his symptoms, whether he has got a nice car, nice dress, or, there are so many symptoms. Similarly, simply by speaking that "I am God conscious" will not do. These are the symptoms:
brahma-bhutah prasannatma
na socati na kanksati
samah sarvesu bhutesu
mad-bhaktim labhate param
[Bg. 18.54]
Bhaktya mam abhijanati yavan yas casmi tattvatah [Bg. 18.55]. The God can be realized only by the devotees who have got all these good qualities. These good qualities already mentioned, samah sarvesu bhutesu. That is God consciousness. God consciousness does not mean that I shall be protected, I shall be happy, and let others be unhappy. Let them go to hell. Never mind. No. That is not God consciousness. Therefore, in order to become perfectly God conscious, the first-class men must be there in the society. And that first-class man is described here, samo damas tapah: he is able to control the mind, he is able to control the senses, tapah, he has undergone austerities, tapah. Saucam, he is always clean, outside and inside, saucam ksantih, always peaceful, arjavam, simplicity, and jnanam, full of knowledge, vijnanam, practical application of knowledge in life, jnanam vijnanam astikyam, and firmly convinced about the existence of the Supreme Lord. These are the qualification of the first-class man. Brahma-karma svabhava-jam. These are the qualities.
So there should be educational department to create first-class men by all these qualities. How to become controller of the mind, how to become controller of the senses, how to become cleansed, bahyabhyantaram, inside clean and outside clean. Saucam, titiksa, how to become tolerant, tolerant. One should be not agitated by a single cause. Tolerant, and similarly, simplicity. He should be so simple. It is said simplicity: even the enemy inquires from him some secret thing, he'll say, "Yes, it is like this." Simplicity. And jnanam full knowledge. Full knowledge, what is this world, what I am, what is my relation with this world, what is God, what is my relation with God. Everything full knowledge. And vijnanam, vijnanam means completely application of the knowledge of life. And astikyam, astikyam means full faith in transcendental literature, that is called also astikyam, and full faith in the existence of the Supreme Lord. Astik... These are the brahminical qualifications. So those who are claiming to become first-class, learned men in the society, they must have all these qualifications. This is Bhagavad-gita's teaching. The second-class man, what is that?
sauryam tejo dhrtir daksyam
yuddhe capy apalayanam
danam isvara-bhavas ca
ksatram karma svabhava-jam
[Bg. 18.43]
Administrator class. Ksatriya, ksatriya means those who are in the governmental power. They should be sauryam, very powerful, and very influential. Sauryam tejah. Nowadays, without seeing these qualifications, a third-class, fourth-class man is voted, and therefore we find out that Mr. Nixon, he's attacked now so many... Because he has no ksatriya qualification. These are the ksatriya qualification, administrator. Saucam, sauryam tejo dhrtih. He must be determined, daksyam, he must very expert, yuddhe capy apalayanam, and he should not flee away from fighting. When there is... Nowadays, when there is... the politicians and diplomats, they sit down very safely in their room and poor people, they are, by force, sent to fight. This is not ksatriya, this is not administration. The ksatriya is, he must come forward first of all. Then others will follow. Yuddhe capy apalayanam. And danam, he must be very charitable. That is another qualification of the administrator. Isvara-bhavas ca, and the governing spirit. These are the ksatram karma svabhava-jam. Similarly, this is second class.
The third-class means krsi-go-raksya-vanijyam vaisya-karma svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.44]. Third-class means mercantile traders. They should produce food, enough krsi, agricultural products, and go-raksya. Now we see instead of go-raksya... Go-raksya means protection to the cows. Instead of protection to the cows, they are killing the cows. How you can have perfect society? Cows must be protected. It is so important animal. It is giving the you nectarean food milk, and from milk, you can save your children, you can save your diseased persons. And how it is that you take the cow's milk and send it for slaughterhouse. Oh, this is not, not at all human civilization. Here it is said go-raksya. You should give all protection to this important animal. Krsna does not say that you should protect the pigs and hogs or other animals. He especially meant the cows because cow is very important animal to the human society. If there are meat-eaters, they can kill other animals, but they should not kill the cow. This is, if you want actually perfect society. Krsi-go-raksya-vanijyam [Bg. 18.44]. And these persons, they let them produce enough food grains, and where there is no, there is scarcity of food grain, let them supply there. That is called trade. Vanijyam. Vanijyam.
But at the present moment, there are so many countries, they can produce profuse quantity of food grain. Sometimes they do it and throw it in the ocean for what is called, economic balance. This is not good. Everyone should produce enough quantity of food grains, and if there is shortage, they should send there. In this way, the whole world should cooperate. There is United Nations, but what they are doing? Let them study Bhagavad-gita, how to make United Nations. That will be perfect. Not these short-sighted men, with politics and diplomacy in the heart, they can bring all the nations united. That is not possible. Let them discuss Bhagavad-gita. Let them discuss how perfect society can be established. Then there will be peace. And vaisya-karma svabhava-jam.
And paricaryatmakam karma sudrasyapi svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.44]. And those who are not intelligent, to be trained up as a brahmana or a ksatriya or a vaisya. The fourth class men, let them work these three other classes, let them work. Paricaryatmakam karma sudrasyapi svabhava-jam. In this way the human society should be divided into four divisions, they should cooperate, and they should be trained up. Not a single man should remain unemployed. He must be engaged in some employment as a brahmana, as a ksatriya, as a sudra or as a vaisya. Otherwise, idle brain will be devil's workshop. Therefore, in spite of so much educational propaganda in the Western countries, the young men are coming to become hippies. Because there is no proper training. Here is the hint, Bhagavad-gita gives you. You train the students in that way, then there will be perfect society. Thank you very much. Hare Krsna. (end)
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Bhagavad-gita 18.41 -- Stockholm, September 7, 1973
© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International. Used with permission.
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Thursday, July 29, 2010
"Business and Brahminical culture"
30 Jan 73 , Calcutta
Prabhupada:Mr. President, Ladies and Gentlemen, I thank you very much for kindly inviting me. I'll serve you to my capacity. Today's subject matter is "Culture and Business. So business, we mean business means the occupational duty. According to our Vedic culture, there are different types of businesses. As it is described in the Bhagavad-gita, catur-varnyam maya srstam guna-karma-vibhagasah [Bg. 4.13] -- the four divisions of social system, namely the brahmana, the ksatriya, the vaisya and the sudra. Before doing business, there must be a division who can do what kind of business. There are different businesses. Now we have taken that everyone should take everyone's business. That is not very scientifical division. Therefore there is cultural division. Just like the whole body. The whole body's one unit, but there are different departments also -- just like the head department, the arms department, the belly department and the leg department. This is scientific. The head department is called the brahmana. In the society... And the arms department is called the ksatriyas, and the belly department is called the vaisyas, and the leg department is called the sudras. This is scientific division of business. Although the head department is most important department, because without head, other departments, the arms departments, the belly department and the leg department will be finished. If the arms department is lacking, still business can go on. If the leg department is lacking, the business may go on. But if the head department is not there, if the, your head is cut off from the body, then in spite of having all these arms, legs and bellies, they all become useless. So the head department is meant for culture. Without culture... Just like without head, the arms department, the belly department, the leg department are all useless. Similarly without culture, all these businesses, they creates confusion and chaos. That is the position at the present moment, because there is intermingling of different businesses. There must be one section of people, head department, who should give advice to the other departments. The brahmanas, they're intelligent. They are qualified. Satya sama dama titiksa arjava jnanam vijnanam astikyam brahma-karma svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.42].
So culture means that one should know what is the aim of life. Without understanding the aim of life, a man without aim is ship without, a ship without rudder. That is an English proverb. So at the present moment, we are missing the goal of life because there is no head department. The whole human society is lacking now real brahmanas who can give advice to the other departments. Just like Arjuna was fighting. He was a military man. His business was to fight. He was engaged in his business, but he was taking at the same time advice of, the advice of the Brahmana deva, Krsna.
namo brahmanya-devaya
go-brahmana-hitaya ca
jagad-dhitaya krsnaya
govindaya namo namah
So the brahmana department, or the adviser department, is described in this verse: namo brahmanya-devaya go-brahmana-hitaya ca. The first thing is taken into consideration, go-brahmana. Why these two things are stressed upon? Because in a society where there is no brahminical culture and where there is no cow protection, it is not human society. So in a chaotic condition, any business you do, it will never be perfect. But in a systematized, systematic, cultural society, you do business. That is perfect. That is the instruction of Srimad-Bhagavata, Bhagavatam. In a meeting in Naimisaranya, where many learned scholars and brahmanas assembled, and Srila Suta Gosvami was giving instruction, he said: atah pumbhir dvija-srestha varnasrama-vibhagasah. The varnasrama is stressed. The Vedic culture means four varnas and four asramas: brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sudra; brahmacari, grhastha, vanaprastha and sannyasa. Unless we take to this institution of varnasrama dharma, the whole society will be in chaotic condition.
And the purpose of varnasrama dharma is to satisfy the Supreme Lord. As it is stated in the Visnu Purana:
varnasramacaravata
purusena parah puman
visnur aradhyate pumsam
nanyat tat-tosa-karanam
[Cc. Madhya 8.58]
Just like in a state, you have to satisfy your government; then you are good citizen. Similarly in the cosmic state, taking altogether this whole material creation, if you do not satisfy the Supreme Lord, the proprietor of everything, then it will be chaotic condition. Our Vedic culture means whatever you do, it doesn't matter. You must satisfy the Supreme Lord. That is culture. Sva-karmana tam abhyarcya samsiddhim labhate narah [Bg. 18.46]. You can do any business. Any business means the brahmana's business, the ksatriya's business, the vaisya's business and the sudra's business. That is business. Otherwise you can do any business. But business means there are different classes of business. So Bhagavad-gita it is said that one should satisfy by his own business the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Yena sarvam idam tatam. In the Srimad-Bhagavatam also it is said: culture means... Atah pumbhir dvija-srestha varnasrama-vibhagasah. The, there are different businesses according to different divisions of human society. But their aim should be svanusthitasya dharmasya. Business means dharma. Another... Dharma means occupational duty. So svanusthitasya dharmasya samsiddhir. One must find out the perfection of his business. That is culture. Culture and business means you may do whatever business you are doing, according to your division, or according to your capacity or according to your qualification. You may be a, a merchant, you may be a professional man, you may be legal adviser, medical man. Whatever you may, it doesn't matter. But if you want perfection in your business, then you must try to satisfy the Supreme Personality of Godhead. That is culture. Otherwise you are simply wasting your time. In the Bhagavad-gita it is said, yajnarthe karma. Yajna. Yajna means Visnu, the Supreme Lord. For Him you have to work. Yajnarthe karma. Anyatra karma-bandhana. Otherwise you become bound up by the acts, by the reaction of your activities. Karma-bandhana. And so long you are in the bondage of karma, you have to transmigrate from one body to another.
Unfortunately at the present moment, people do not know that there is soul and the soul transmigrates from one body to another. As it is stated in the Bhagavad-gita, tatha dehantaram praptir dhiras tatra na muhyati [Bg. 2.13]. Big, big professors... I've talked with big, big scientists, professors, but they do not know that there is life after death. They do not know. But according to our Vedic information, we know. And we can ex..., experience in this present life. It is very common thing. Just like a baby has got a body of a boy. The boy has got a body again of a youth, young man. The young man has got a body again of a old man. So similarly, old man, after annihilation of this body, he'll get another body. It is very, quite natural, logical. And we change our body. Although this gross body's destroyed, we change our body by the subtle body. The subtle body is made of mind, intelligence and ego. Just like we forget about this body at night, and the subtle body works. We dream. We are taken away from our home, from our bed, to some other place, and completely forget this body. And when the sleep is over, we forget about the dream and we become attached to this gross body. This is going on -- in our daily experience. So I am the observer. I am sometimes in this gross body and sometimes in the subtle body. But it is changing. But I am the observer. Therefore the inquiry should be that "What is my position? At night I forget my gross body, and during daytime I forget my subtle body. Then what is my real body?" These are the questions.
So this is culture. You may do your business. Just like Arjuna: Arjuna was doing his business. He was a fighter, ksatriya, but he did not forget his culture, hearing Gita from the master. That is culture. If you simply do business and do not cultivate your spiritual life, then it is useless waste of time. Srama eva hi kevalam [SB 1.2.8], the sastra says. Svanusthitasya dharmasya samsiddhir hari-tosanam [SB 1.2.13]. Atah pumbhir dvija-srestha varnasrama-vibhagasah. So our Krsna consciousness movement is being spread up that "Do not forget your cultural life." We do not say that you stop your business and become a sannyasi like me and give up everything. We do not say. Neither Krsna said that. Krsna never said Arjuna that "You give up your business." "You are ksatriya. You are declining fighting. Oh, it is very abominable. You should not say like that. You must fight." That was Krsna's instruction. So similarly, we Krsna conscious people, we are also advising everyone that "You do not give up your business." Caitanya Mahaprabhu said also: sthane sthitah sruti-gatam tanu-van-manobhih. Caitanya Mahaprabhu never said that "You give up your position." Position, giving up is not very difficult. But to cultivate spiritual knowledge, that is required. Tasyaiva hetoh prayateta kovidah na labhyate yad bhramatam upary adhah [1.5.18]. Now the animal life, there is no cultivation of spiritual life. That is not possible. The animal cannot cultivate this knowledge. The human beings, if they do not cultivate spiritual knowledge, they're exactly like animals. Dharmena hina pasubhih samanah. So we should be very conscious about our eternal existence. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. Nityah sasvato 'yam. We, spirit soul, we are eternal. We are not going to die after the annihilation of this body. This is the cultivation of knowledge. This is called brahma-jijnasa, to know about one's self. Caitanya Mahaprabhu's first disciple, Sanatana Gosvami, he was minister, finance minister in the government of Nawab Hussein Shah, and he retired and approached Caitanya Mahaprabhu. And he humbly inquired that "These people call me pandita." Because he was brahmana by caste. Naturally we call a brahmana "pandita." So Sanatana Gosvami placed this: "My dear Lord, these people call me pandita, but I am such a pandita that I do not know who I..., what I am." So that is the position of everyone. We may be businessman. We may be in other profession. But if we do not know what I am, wherefrom I have come, why I am under the tribulation of these material laws of nature and where I am going, what is my next life -- if we do not know this, then whatever we are doing, srama eva hi kevalam. Visvaksena-kathasu notpadayed ratim yadi, visvaksena-kathasu yah srama eva hi kevalam [SB 1.2.8].
So our request to everyone that you can be engaged in whatever business, in whatever position Krsna has posted you. Do your duty nicely. But do not forget to cultivate Krsna knowledge. Krsna knowledge means God consciousness. God consciousness means we must know that we are part and parcel. Mamaivamso jiva-loke jiva-bhutah sanatanah [Bg. 15.7]. We are eternal part and parcel of Krsna, or God, but we are struggling here, manah-sasthani indriyani prakrti-sthani karsati. Why this struggle for existence? We must know... We have got eternal life. This temporary... Suppose in this temporary life I become Birla or some big businessman for, say, twenty years or fifty years, utmost, hundred years. Next life there is no guarantee that I'm going to be Birla or this man, Tata. No. There is no such guarantee. That we do not take care. We are taking care of the small span of life, but we are not taking care of our life eternal. That is mistake. Suppose in this life I am a very great businessman. Next life, by my karma, if I become something else... There are 8,400,000 species of life, forms of life. Jalaja nava-laksani sthavara laksa-vimsati. Nine lakhs of forms of life in the water. Then there are insects. Sthavara laksa... There are trees, plants, two million forms of trees and plants. Krmayo rudra-sankhyakah. Eleven lakhs' species of insects, reptiles. Then birds. Paksinam dasa-laksanam. In this way, we fulfill eight millions of different forms of life. Then we come to the form of human life. Therefore Prahlada Maharaja said that kaumara acaret prajno dharman bhagavatan iha, durlabham manusam janma [SB 7.6.1]. This manusam janma is very, very rare. We should not be satisfied only becoming a very big businessman. We must know what is next life, what I am going to be.
So there are different kinds of men. Some of them are called the karmis, and some of them are called the jnanis, and some of them are called the yogis, and some of them are called the bhaktas. The karmis, they are after material happiness. In this life, also, they want the highest, the best comfort of material life, and after death also they want to be elevated to the heavenly planets. Similarly jnanis, they also want, they being fed up of this material way of life, they want to, they want to merge into the existence of Brahman. That is jnani. The yogis, they also want mystic power. And the bhaktas, they want simply service of the Lord. So unless one understands what is Lord, how he can render service to the Lord? This culture is the highest culture. The karmis' culture, the jnanis' culture, the yogis' culture and the bhaktas' culture -- there are different cultures. So all of them are called yogis if they are doing sincerely their duty. Karma-yogi, jnana-yogi, dhyana-yogi, bhakta-yogi. But Krsna says,
yoginam api sarvesam
mad-gata antaratmana
sraddhavan bhajate yo mam
sa me yuktatamo matah
[Bg. 6.47]
He's first-class yogi. Who is that man? Now, yoginam api sarvesam mad-gata antaratmana: "Who is always thinking of Me." That means Krsna conscious. Krsna says, "Who is always thinking of Me." Yoginam api sarvesam. There are different yogis -- karma-yogi, jnana-yogi, dhyana-yogi. But the best yogi is he who's always thinking of Krsna within himself. Yoginam api sarvesam mad-gatena-antaratmana sraddhavan bhajate yo mam. Sraddhavan. With faith and love, one who is giving rendering service to the Lord, he's first-class yogi.
There are other verses in the Bhagavad-gita. [break] ...of cousin-brothers, the Pandavas and the Kauravas. They met there for fighting. That's a historical fact, Mahabharata, Greater India. Mahabharata means Greater, History of Greater India. So everything is there. But we do not take advantage of this great book of knowledge. So we request that everyone should cultivate... Should try to know what he is, what is Krsna, what is their relationship with Krsna, and what is their real life, what is the goal of life. Unless we do cultivate all this knowledge, then it is simply we are wasting our time, this valuable life of human form of life. It is very, very valuable. Durlabham manusam janma tad api adhruvam arthadam. Although everybody will die, that's a fact, but one who dies after knowing all these things, he is benefited. His life is successful. Just like Krsna says, tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti kaunteya [Bg. 4.9]. This is wanted. Everyone... The cat will die, dogs will die, everyone will die. That's a fact. But one who dies knowing Krsna, oh, that is successful death. Because Krsna says,
janma karma me divyam
yo janati tattvatah
tyaktva deham punar janma
naiti mam eti kaunteya
[Bg. 4.9]
This is success.
So our only request is, wherever we go all over the world, we request only that "You try to understand Krsna. Then your life is successful." It doesn't matter what you do. We have to do something. Krsna says, sarira-yatrapi te prasiddhyet akarmanah. If you stop working, your living condition will be hampered. That is not the question. Everyone has to do his duty. Arjuna also did his duty. He was ksatriya. His business was to acquire kingdom. Because the ksatriyas, they cannot beg. They must have some land. Their business is to levy tax. That is enjoined in the sastras. Brahmanas, they should live by pathana pathana yajana yajana. Ksatriyas should live by giving protection to the people. Vaisyas should live by trade, agriculture, protection of cows. And the sudras should live under the protection of brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sud..., three higher castes. This is the injunction. So one has to do something for his livelihood, but, at the same time, he has to cultivate knowledge for his perfection of life. So this is perfection of life, simple thing. Simple thing we are prescribing all over the world. You try to understand Krsna. Simple. And it is not very difficult. You read Bhagavad-gita as it is. You understand Krsna. Krsna is explaining everything. If the neophytes, one who cannot, cannot understand Krsna, Krsna is prescribing like this: raso 'ham apsu kaunteya, prabhasmi sasi-suryayoh: [Bg. 7.8] "My dear Kaunteya, I am the taste of the water." So there is no need of saying that "I cannot see God. I have not seen God." Here is God. The taste of water is God. Everyone is drinking water. And who is not tasting it? He's seeing God. Why do you say that "I do not see God"? You see, as it is directed by God. Then gradually you'll see Him. If you simply remember this instruction, this one instruction of Bhagavad-gita, raso 'ham apsu kaunteya prabhasmi sasi-suryayoh, "I am the taste of water. I am the shining illumination of sun and moon..." Who has not seen the sunlight? Who has not seen the moonlight? Who has not tasted water? Then why do you say, "I have not seen God"? If you simply practice this bhakti-yoga, as soon as you drink water and taste and be satisfied, "Oh, here is Krsna." So immediately you remember Krsna. As soon as you see sunshine, you remember, "Oh, here is Krsna." As soon as you see moonshine, you remember, "Eh, here is..." As soon as you see something wonderful, paurusam nrsu sabdah khe, as soon as you hear in the sky some sound, so if you remember, "Here is Krsna," that means you are remembering Krsna in every step of your life. And if you're remembering Krsna in every step of life, then you become the topmost yogi. Because Krsna says,
yoginam api sarvesam
mad-gata antaratmana
sraddhavan bhajate...
[Bg. 6.47]
Mad-gata antaratmana. If you feel Krsna in every step of life... It is not very difficult. And, above that, if you practice the chanting -- Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare... There is no tax. Your..., there is no loss of your business. You are all businessmen. But if you chant Hare Krsna mantra, if you remember Krsna while drinking water, what is your loss? Why don't you try it? This is cultivation of knowledge, if you cultivate this knowledge, at the same time go on doing your business, your life will be successful.
Thank you very much. (applause) [break]
Guest (1): How we can come over the ego?
Prabhupada: You cannot come over. Now you are in false ego. You have to come to the real ego. Now you are thinking, "I am Indian. I am Hindu. I am businessman." These are all false ego. When you come to your real ego, that "I am part and parcel of Krsna, eternal servant of Krsna," that is your real... Ego, you cannot give up. But this is your false ego. You have to give up your false ego, come to the real ego. That's... Purify your ego. That is required. [break] ...dhi-vinirmuktam tat-paratvena nirmalam [Cc. Madhya 19.170]. Upadhi. At the present moment, I am thinking like that. "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am brahmana," "I am sudra," "I am black," "I am white" -- these are the egoism of this body. But I'm not this body. Aham brahmasmi. So when you come to that stage... Brahma-bhutah prasannatma [Bg. 18.54]. When you come to your real ego, then you become happy. And because you are in false ego, you are unhappy. So ego cannot be changed. Because you are eternal, how you can be, ego can be changed? Just like people say, "Give up desires." How can you desire..., give up desires of a living entity? That is not possible. But I have to purify my desires. That is wanted. Just like if you have got some disease. So if you, some, the physician, they say "Pluck out your eyes," that is not good treatment. But you treat the eyes nicely and the sight may be good. That is wanted. So this bhakti-marga means sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam. That is bhakti-marga. You have to give up your false ego. Sarva upadhi. This is upadhi: "I am this, I am that, and..." This upadhi has created trouble in the world. So we have to come to the real ego. Jivera svarupa haya nitya krsna dasa [Cc. Madhya 20.108-109]. That is mukti. Mukti hitva anyatha rupam svarupena vyavasthitih. Now hitva anyatha rupam. My ego is going on in a different way. Unnecessarily I am spoiling my life with these designations. But we have to come to the point of our real identity. So nothing can be given up. As living entity, I must be egoistic. Law of identity. How can I say that "I am not"? I am. I am existing. But now I am existing with designations. If I give up my designations, if I become purified, that is my real ego. Sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam tat-paratvena nirmalam [Cc. Madhya 19.170]. One has to become nirmala. And when you become nirmala... Hrsikena hrsikesa sevanam bhaktir ucyate. That is bhakti. So your senses are there. Now with my senses I am thinking that "I am the head of this familyman," "I am head of this community," or "I am..., I have to serve. I have to engage my hand in this way, my eyes in this way, my nose in this way." Senses are engaged in a upadhi, designated. But when this is, designation is taken away, when you become nirmala, the senses remain, the dress of the senses taken away, at that time, your senses are engaged in the service of the Lord, and that is called bhakti.
Bhavananda: Are there are any other questions? [break]
Prabhupada: ...service to the humanity. Now you are thinking service to the humanity means a section of humanity. And why should you stick your service to the humanity? When one is serving his own countrymen, Indian, he does not care for the Englishman. So don't speak of humanity. Nobody can serve the whole humanity in the present way. But if you spread Krsna consciousness, that is the best service to the humanity. Just like we are doing. We have no discrimination, that "These are Indians. These are Americans. They are Hindus. They are Muslims. They are Christians." No. Or "They're cats or dogs." That oneness you can see only when you are Brahman-realized. Samah sarvesu bhutesu. Why humanity? Why not the cats and dogs and cows? You are very much anxious to give service to the humanity, but you are sending animals to the slaughterhouse. Why? (indistinct) the lack of knowledge. You do not (indistinct) is part and parcel of God. You cannot select this part and... Therefore the sastra says, yatha taror mula-nisecanena trpyanti tat-skandha-bhujopasakhah [SB 4.31.14]. Just like by watering the root, you can water automatically the branches, the trunks, the twigs, the flowers, the fruits, the leaves -- everything is watered. Sarvarhanam acyutejya. Or by supplying foodstuff to the stomach, you serve all the senses of the body perfectly. Similarly, when you begin to serve Krsna, then not only to the human society, to the animal society, to the tree society. Every society will be served. That is perfect service. And if you simply limit your service, that is, may be good, but that is not good. According to sastra... Just like you simply water the leaves, the leaves will not live. They'll dry. But if you supply water to the root, everything will be protected. So actual service will begin when you are Krsna conscious. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma na socati na kanksati [Bg. 18.54], samah sarve... That is samah sarvesu. And so long you limit, that is limited service. That is not perfect service.
Guest (1): (indistinct)
Prabhupada: [break] ...immoral(?) generation means godlessness. It is said in the sastra, yasyasti bhaktir bhagavaty akincana sarvaih gunaih tatra samasate surah. If you have unflinching faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, then all the good qualities of demigods will develop unto you. It is not story. It is fact. Just like these European and American students. They, in their previous life, before becoming Krsna consciousness, according to our standard, they were all immoral. Our, in India, illicit sex life still, it is admitted, if it is not followed, to have sex relation with other's wife or other woman except one's wife, that is called immoral or sinful. So in Western countries these things are not immoral or sinful. It is very daily affair. But now, because they have come to Krsna consciousness, they have given up all these things. No illicit sex life. Unless one is married, he must remain brahmacari or vanaprastha or sannyasi. Only grhastha, duly married wife, he can have sex. This is morality. And you should not kill the animals unnecessarily. That is immoral. You are already intoxicated by the influence of maya. You should not be more intoxicated. This is immoral. You should not indulge in gambling. These are immoral. So as soon as you become Krsna consciousness, then all these immoralities vanish immediately. That is the only. Yasyasti bhaktir bhagavaty akincana, sarvaih gunaih tatra samasate su..., harav abhaktsya kuto mahad-guna. One who is not Krsna..., he cannot have any good quality or any morality. That is the decision of the sastra. So if you want to revive the morality of the society, you must take up this Krsna consciousness. Then everything will come.
Guest (1): Sir, this..., why we did not have a world with universal brotherhood, universal love?
Prabhupada: Because you don't want it. Because you don't want it. You do not want. That, that, that is explained in the previous verse, that Krsna says,
sarva-dharman parityajya
mam ekam saranam vraja
aham tvam sarva-papebhyo
moksayisyami...
[Bg. 18.66]
These miserable conditions are there because we are all sinful. So Krsna gives protection that "You surrender unto Me, and I give you protection from the reaction of all sinful life." So who wants Krsna? You do not want. Krsna says, canvassing, but who is accepting? Then how you can get, I mean to say, liberty or liberation from these sinful activities? Aham tvam sarva-papebhyo. People suffer on account of sinful activities. There are two things, papa and punya. So if you follow the path of papa, then you must suffer. Just like state laws. If you become criminal, you must suffer. You must go to the prison house. You, you cannot argue that "Why government has created the prison house? Why?" Can you argue like that? Yes, there is necessity. The government knows that there will be some rascals who will commit criminal activities; therefore there must be prison house. So this material world is prison house. Every one of us, we are member of the prison house-first class, second class, third class. Just like in the prison house there are different classes. Duhkhalayam asasvatam [Bg. 8.15]. You cannot expect treatment in the prison house just like son-in-law. No. That is not possible. You must suffer. Otherwise, what is the meaning of prison house? Similarly, Krsna says, although Krsna has created this world, He says this is duhkhalayam asasvatam, this is the place of misery. And asasvatam. You cannot make any arrangement. "All right, Sir, let it be duhkhalayam. Let me remain here." No. That also you cannot remain. You'll be kicked out. This is the place like that. But Krsna gives you the idea how you can be happy, how you can get out of this. He says, mam upetya kaunteya duhkhalayam asasvatam napnuvanti [Bg. 8.15].
janma karma me divyam
yo janati tattvatah
tyaktva deham punar janma
naiti mam eti...
[Bg. 4.9]
Krsna is canvassing you that "You try to understand Me. Come back." But you do not want it. So how Krsna can save you? You have got the independence. Krsna said to Arjuna, "Now I (have) explained to you everything. Yathecchasi tatha kuru [Bg. 18.63]. Now, whatever you like, you do." So we have got that little independence because we are part and parcel of God. God has got supreme independence and we, being part and parcel... Just like you are all big businessmen. You have got supreme independence in business. Similarly, your sons, they have got also some independence, although subjected. Similarly, we, being part and parcel of God, sons of God, we have got little independence. If we misuse that independence, then we become subjected to all these tribulations. But if we do not misuse... As Krsna says, mam eva ye prapadyante mayam etam taranti te. So it is up to you. If you want to remain in this world of duhkhalayam asasvatam [Bg. 8.15], you can do so. But if you want to get out of it, you can do so. That is up to you. It is not Krsna's fault. Krsna has given you liberty, little independence, whatever. Yathecchasi tatha kuru [Bg. 18.63]. He's given you chance. You want to do this -- "All right, do it." You want to do this? "Do this." He's giving you chance. There is a verse, sarvasya caham hrdi sannivisto mattah smrtir jnanam apohanam ca [Bg. 15.15]. He's situated in everyone's heart. He's understanding what you want, and He's giving you all chance: "All right, have it. Enjoy it." But His instruction is that "This will not make you happy." Sarva-dharman parityaja mam ekam. You do not do it. You must suffer. That is not Krsna's fault. That is your fault.
Guest (1): A small thing. Will Your Reverence have... [break]
Prabhupada: So you have no right to do so.
Guest (1): Say instead of Hare Rama Hare Rama, we say Visva ramane rahim, or something like that, will you have no objection to that?
Prabhupada: No objection.
Guest (1): And will you say...
Prabhupada: But that is no objection.
Guest (1): ...that efficacy will be the same?
Prabhupada: Yes. If Bismillah means Hare Krsna... It is a question of language. So if meaning the same thing, Hare Krsna... Hare Krsna means we are addressing the Supreme Lord and His energy. Hara means the energy of the Supreme Lord, and Krsna means the Supreme Lord. So we are addressing, "My dear Lord, my dear the energy of Lord..." Because Lord and His energy, they are, they are always existing. Just like sun and the sunshine, they're always existing. Sunshine is the energy, but sun is the energetic. Similarly, the Lord is there and His energy's also there. So we are praying both to the energy and to the Lord: "Please engage me in Your service. I am serving maya. I am not happy. Therefore, please engage me in Your..." My, my constitutional position is to serve. Just like you're all sitting here. Every one of you are servant. If you consider that you are master, that is a mistake. That is maya. Every one of you are servant. So "I am serving, but now I am serving maya. I'm not happy. Let me serve You." This is the meaning of Hare Krsna. So if it means that, there is no objection. It is a question of language. It does mean (indistinct). Of course, Caitanya Mahaprabhu says, namnam akari bahudha nija-sarva-saktis tatrarpita niyamitah smarane na kalah. Caitanya Mahaprabhu says the, the person whose name we chant, holy name, in each, in each holy Allah, or something like that, that is not objected if it is actually meaning the Supreme. If it is meaning something else, that is another thing. This question... Just like water or jala. It (is) the same thing. It is simply a different name. If I ask water, you'll give me the water actually, and if I say, jala, you'll give me the same. So if the meaning is all right, then there is no objection. If the meaning is different, then there is objection. We are not fighting with the language. We are not concerned with the language.
Guest (2): Why God created sinful activities?
Prabhupada: You have created. God has not created. You have created. Yes.
Guest (1): In what respect?
Prabhupada: You have created.
Guest (1): In what respect I have created?
Prabhupada: You want to kill animals. God does not say that "You kill animals." So you have created sinful activities.
Guest (1): I am a part and parcel of the almighty God.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Guest (1): So when animals are butchered, why the butcher does not get pain?
Prabhupada: Butcher does not get pain? Do you know that? There is a Sanskrit verse that vyadha ma jiva, ma mara: "My dear butcher, you don't live, don't die." Do you think this butcher, that butchering work is very palatable work? Can you see it, before you, a man is killed, an animal is killed? So he has become accustomed. It pains him. But that work is so abominable that he should not live for executing that work. But what is the benefit of dying? Because after death, he will be butchered. Therefore the sastra says, ma jiva ma mara: "Don't live, don't die." Yes.
Indian man: There is some difference. When we do some good, we consider it as God-inspired, but when we do something bad, then we can't say that it is also God-inspired after we have done it?
Prabhupada: I do not follow what he says.
Guest (2): He says that the inspiration comes from the God for the all works.
Prabhupada: God inspiration comes for every work. That's a fact. But we deny... Just like... You take this simple exam, example. Just like a thief. From within, he's forbidden: "Don't commit theft." But he does it. He does it. You have got all experience about these things. God says from within, "Don't do it," but we do it. That is the defect of without being Krsna consciousness. Just like a thief. He knows that for his criminal activities he'll be punished. He has seen it, that a thief is arrested and he's taken to the prison house. And he has heard from the sastra and from lawbooks that committing theft is not good. Why does he commit it? He knows and he has seen it. Why does he do it? Can you answer? He knows that it is not good, and he has heard it from sastra and from learned lawyers. But why does he do it? This is the influence of nature. As he associated with the nature, ignorance, dark ignorance. He cannot check it. Therefore the best service to humanity is to give him knowledge. Because everyone is in ignorance. Parabhavas tavad abodha-jata yavan na jijnasata atma-tattvam. Everyone is being defeated out of this ignorance. Therefore one should come to the platform of inquiring about the self. That is the best service, athato brahma jijnasa, To revive, invoke people to inquire about Brahman, and that will solve all the questions.
Thank you very much. Hare Krsna. (end)
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Lecture at Bharata Chamber of Commerce "Culture and Business" -- Calcutta, January 30, 1973
© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International. Used with permission.
Prabhupada:Mr. President, Ladies and Gentlemen, I thank you very much for kindly inviting me. I'll serve you to my capacity. Today's subject matter is "Culture and Business. So business, we mean business means the occupational duty. According to our Vedic culture, there are different types of businesses. As it is described in the Bhagavad-gita, catur-varnyam maya srstam guna-karma-vibhagasah [Bg. 4.13] -- the four divisions of social system, namely the brahmana, the ksatriya, the vaisya and the sudra. Before doing business, there must be a division who can do what kind of business. There are different businesses. Now we have taken that everyone should take everyone's business. That is not very scientifical division. Therefore there is cultural division. Just like the whole body. The whole body's one unit, but there are different departments also -- just like the head department, the arms department, the belly department and the leg department. This is scientific. The head department is called the brahmana. In the society... And the arms department is called the ksatriyas, and the belly department is called the vaisyas, and the leg department is called the sudras. This is scientific division of business. Although the head department is most important department, because without head, other departments, the arms departments, the belly department and the leg department will be finished. If the arms department is lacking, still business can go on. If the leg department is lacking, the business may go on. But if the head department is not there, if the, your head is cut off from the body, then in spite of having all these arms, legs and bellies, they all become useless. So the head department is meant for culture. Without culture... Just like without head, the arms department, the belly department, the leg department are all useless. Similarly without culture, all these businesses, they creates confusion and chaos. That is the position at the present moment, because there is intermingling of different businesses. There must be one section of people, head department, who should give advice to the other departments. The brahmanas, they're intelligent. They are qualified. Satya sama dama titiksa arjava jnanam vijnanam astikyam brahma-karma svabhava-jam [Bg. 18.42].
So culture means that one should know what is the aim of life. Without understanding the aim of life, a man without aim is ship without, a ship without rudder. That is an English proverb. So at the present moment, we are missing the goal of life because there is no head department. The whole human society is lacking now real brahmanas who can give advice to the other departments. Just like Arjuna was fighting. He was a military man. His business was to fight. He was engaged in his business, but he was taking at the same time advice of, the advice of the Brahmana deva, Krsna.
namo brahmanya-devaya
go-brahmana-hitaya ca
jagad-dhitaya krsnaya
govindaya namo namah
So the brahmana department, or the adviser department, is described in this verse: namo brahmanya-devaya go-brahmana-hitaya ca. The first thing is taken into consideration, go-brahmana. Why these two things are stressed upon? Because in a society where there is no brahminical culture and where there is no cow protection, it is not human society. So in a chaotic condition, any business you do, it will never be perfect. But in a systematized, systematic, cultural society, you do business. That is perfect. That is the instruction of Srimad-Bhagavata, Bhagavatam. In a meeting in Naimisaranya, where many learned scholars and brahmanas assembled, and Srila Suta Gosvami was giving instruction, he said: atah pumbhir dvija-srestha varnasrama-vibhagasah. The varnasrama is stressed. The Vedic culture means four varnas and four asramas: brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sudra; brahmacari, grhastha, vanaprastha and sannyasa. Unless we take to this institution of varnasrama dharma, the whole society will be in chaotic condition.
And the purpose of varnasrama dharma is to satisfy the Supreme Lord. As it is stated in the Visnu Purana:
varnasramacaravata
purusena parah puman
visnur aradhyate pumsam
nanyat tat-tosa-karanam
[Cc. Madhya 8.58]
Just like in a state, you have to satisfy your government; then you are good citizen. Similarly in the cosmic state, taking altogether this whole material creation, if you do not satisfy the Supreme Lord, the proprietor of everything, then it will be chaotic condition. Our Vedic culture means whatever you do, it doesn't matter. You must satisfy the Supreme Lord. That is culture. Sva-karmana tam abhyarcya samsiddhim labhate narah [Bg. 18.46]. You can do any business. Any business means the brahmana's business, the ksatriya's business, the vaisya's business and the sudra's business. That is business. Otherwise you can do any business. But business means there are different classes of business. So Bhagavad-gita it is said that one should satisfy by his own business the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Yena sarvam idam tatam. In the Srimad-Bhagavatam also it is said: culture means... Atah pumbhir dvija-srestha varnasrama-vibhagasah. The, there are different businesses according to different divisions of human society. But their aim should be svanusthitasya dharmasya. Business means dharma. Another... Dharma means occupational duty. So svanusthitasya dharmasya samsiddhir. One must find out the perfection of his business. That is culture. Culture and business means you may do whatever business you are doing, according to your division, or according to your capacity or according to your qualification. You may be a, a merchant, you may be a professional man, you may be legal adviser, medical man. Whatever you may, it doesn't matter. But if you want perfection in your business, then you must try to satisfy the Supreme Personality of Godhead. That is culture. Otherwise you are simply wasting your time. In the Bhagavad-gita it is said, yajnarthe karma. Yajna. Yajna means Visnu, the Supreme Lord. For Him you have to work. Yajnarthe karma. Anyatra karma-bandhana. Otherwise you become bound up by the acts, by the reaction of your activities. Karma-bandhana. And so long you are in the bondage of karma, you have to transmigrate from one body to another.
Unfortunately at the present moment, people do not know that there is soul and the soul transmigrates from one body to another. As it is stated in the Bhagavad-gita, tatha dehantaram praptir dhiras tatra na muhyati [Bg. 2.13]. Big, big professors... I've talked with big, big scientists, professors, but they do not know that there is life after death. They do not know. But according to our Vedic information, we know. And we can ex..., experience in this present life. It is very common thing. Just like a baby has got a body of a boy. The boy has got a body again of a youth, young man. The young man has got a body again of a old man. So similarly, old man, after annihilation of this body, he'll get another body. It is very, quite natural, logical. And we change our body. Although this gross body's destroyed, we change our body by the subtle body. The subtle body is made of mind, intelligence and ego. Just like we forget about this body at night, and the subtle body works. We dream. We are taken away from our home, from our bed, to some other place, and completely forget this body. And when the sleep is over, we forget about the dream and we become attached to this gross body. This is going on -- in our daily experience. So I am the observer. I am sometimes in this gross body and sometimes in the subtle body. But it is changing. But I am the observer. Therefore the inquiry should be that "What is my position? At night I forget my gross body, and during daytime I forget my subtle body. Then what is my real body?" These are the questions.
So this is culture. You may do your business. Just like Arjuna: Arjuna was doing his business. He was a fighter, ksatriya, but he did not forget his culture, hearing Gita from the master. That is culture. If you simply do business and do not cultivate your spiritual life, then it is useless waste of time. Srama eva hi kevalam [SB 1.2.8], the sastra says. Svanusthitasya dharmasya samsiddhir hari-tosanam [SB 1.2.13]. Atah pumbhir dvija-srestha varnasrama-vibhagasah. So our Krsna consciousness movement is being spread up that "Do not forget your cultural life." We do not say that you stop your business and become a sannyasi like me and give up everything. We do not say. Neither Krsna said that. Krsna never said Arjuna that "You give up your business." "You are ksatriya. You are declining fighting. Oh, it is very abominable. You should not say like that. You must fight." That was Krsna's instruction. So similarly, we Krsna conscious people, we are also advising everyone that "You do not give up your business." Caitanya Mahaprabhu said also: sthane sthitah sruti-gatam tanu-van-manobhih. Caitanya Mahaprabhu never said that "You give up your position." Position, giving up is not very difficult. But to cultivate spiritual knowledge, that is required. Tasyaiva hetoh prayateta kovidah na labhyate yad bhramatam upary adhah [1.5.18]. Now the animal life, there is no cultivation of spiritual life. That is not possible. The animal cannot cultivate this knowledge. The human beings, if they do not cultivate spiritual knowledge, they're exactly like animals. Dharmena hina pasubhih samanah. So we should be very conscious about our eternal existence. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire [Bg. 2.20]. Nityah sasvato 'yam. We, spirit soul, we are eternal. We are not going to die after the annihilation of this body. This is the cultivation of knowledge. This is called brahma-jijnasa, to know about one's self. Caitanya Mahaprabhu's first disciple, Sanatana Gosvami, he was minister, finance minister in the government of Nawab Hussein Shah, and he retired and approached Caitanya Mahaprabhu. And he humbly inquired that "These people call me pandita." Because he was brahmana by caste. Naturally we call a brahmana "pandita." So Sanatana Gosvami placed this: "My dear Lord, these people call me pandita, but I am such a pandita that I do not know who I..., what I am." So that is the position of everyone. We may be businessman. We may be in other profession. But if we do not know what I am, wherefrom I have come, why I am under the tribulation of these material laws of nature and where I am going, what is my next life -- if we do not know this, then whatever we are doing, srama eva hi kevalam. Visvaksena-kathasu notpadayed ratim yadi, visvaksena-kathasu yah srama eva hi kevalam [SB 1.2.8].
So our request to everyone that you can be engaged in whatever business, in whatever position Krsna has posted you. Do your duty nicely. But do not forget to cultivate Krsna knowledge. Krsna knowledge means God consciousness. God consciousness means we must know that we are part and parcel. Mamaivamso jiva-loke jiva-bhutah sanatanah [Bg. 15.7]. We are eternal part and parcel of Krsna, or God, but we are struggling here, manah-sasthani indriyani prakrti-sthani karsati. Why this struggle for existence? We must know... We have got eternal life. This temporary... Suppose in this temporary life I become Birla or some big businessman for, say, twenty years or fifty years, utmost, hundred years. Next life there is no guarantee that I'm going to be Birla or this man, Tata. No. There is no such guarantee. That we do not take care. We are taking care of the small span of life, but we are not taking care of our life eternal. That is mistake. Suppose in this life I am a very great businessman. Next life, by my karma, if I become something else... There are 8,400,000 species of life, forms of life. Jalaja nava-laksani sthavara laksa-vimsati. Nine lakhs of forms of life in the water. Then there are insects. Sthavara laksa... There are trees, plants, two million forms of trees and plants. Krmayo rudra-sankhyakah. Eleven lakhs' species of insects, reptiles. Then birds. Paksinam dasa-laksanam. In this way, we fulfill eight millions of different forms of life. Then we come to the form of human life. Therefore Prahlada Maharaja said that kaumara acaret prajno dharman bhagavatan iha, durlabham manusam janma [SB 7.6.1]. This manusam janma is very, very rare. We should not be satisfied only becoming a very big businessman. We must know what is next life, what I am going to be.
So there are different kinds of men. Some of them are called the karmis, and some of them are called the jnanis, and some of them are called the yogis, and some of them are called the bhaktas. The karmis, they are after material happiness. In this life, also, they want the highest, the best comfort of material life, and after death also they want to be elevated to the heavenly planets. Similarly jnanis, they also want, they being fed up of this material way of life, they want to, they want to merge into the existence of Brahman. That is jnani. The yogis, they also want mystic power. And the bhaktas, they want simply service of the Lord. So unless one understands what is Lord, how he can render service to the Lord? This culture is the highest culture. The karmis' culture, the jnanis' culture, the yogis' culture and the bhaktas' culture -- there are different cultures. So all of them are called yogis if they are doing sincerely their duty. Karma-yogi, jnana-yogi, dhyana-yogi, bhakta-yogi. But Krsna says,
yoginam api sarvesam
mad-gata antaratmana
sraddhavan bhajate yo mam
sa me yuktatamo matah
[Bg. 6.47]
He's first-class yogi. Who is that man? Now, yoginam api sarvesam mad-gata antaratmana: "Who is always thinking of Me." That means Krsna conscious. Krsna says, "Who is always thinking of Me." Yoginam api sarvesam. There are different yogis -- karma-yogi, jnana-yogi, dhyana-yogi. But the best yogi is he who's always thinking of Krsna within himself. Yoginam api sarvesam mad-gatena-antaratmana sraddhavan bhajate yo mam. Sraddhavan. With faith and love, one who is giving rendering service to the Lord, he's first-class yogi.
There are other verses in the Bhagavad-gita. [break] ...of cousin-brothers, the Pandavas and the Kauravas. They met there for fighting. That's a historical fact, Mahabharata, Greater India. Mahabharata means Greater, History of Greater India. So everything is there. But we do not take advantage of this great book of knowledge. So we request that everyone should cultivate... Should try to know what he is, what is Krsna, what is their relationship with Krsna, and what is their real life, what is the goal of life. Unless we do cultivate all this knowledge, then it is simply we are wasting our time, this valuable life of human form of life. It is very, very valuable. Durlabham manusam janma tad api adhruvam arthadam. Although everybody will die, that's a fact, but one who dies after knowing all these things, he is benefited. His life is successful. Just like Krsna says, tyaktva deham punar janma naiti mam eti kaunteya [Bg. 4.9]. This is wanted. Everyone... The cat will die, dogs will die, everyone will die. That's a fact. But one who dies knowing Krsna, oh, that is successful death. Because Krsna says,
janma karma me divyam
yo janati tattvatah
tyaktva deham punar janma
naiti mam eti kaunteya
[Bg. 4.9]
This is success.
So our only request is, wherever we go all over the world, we request only that "You try to understand Krsna. Then your life is successful." It doesn't matter what you do. We have to do something. Krsna says, sarira-yatrapi te prasiddhyet akarmanah. If you stop working, your living condition will be hampered. That is not the question. Everyone has to do his duty. Arjuna also did his duty. He was ksatriya. His business was to acquire kingdom. Because the ksatriyas, they cannot beg. They must have some land. Their business is to levy tax. That is enjoined in the sastras. Brahmanas, they should live by pathana pathana yajana yajana. Ksatriyas should live by giving protection to the people. Vaisyas should live by trade, agriculture, protection of cows. And the sudras should live under the protection of brahmana, ksatriya, vaisya, sud..., three higher castes. This is the injunction. So one has to do something for his livelihood, but, at the same time, he has to cultivate knowledge for his perfection of life. So this is perfection of life, simple thing. Simple thing we are prescribing all over the world. You try to understand Krsna. Simple. And it is not very difficult. You read Bhagavad-gita as it is. You understand Krsna. Krsna is explaining everything. If the neophytes, one who cannot, cannot understand Krsna, Krsna is prescribing like this: raso 'ham apsu kaunteya, prabhasmi sasi-suryayoh: [Bg. 7.8] "My dear Kaunteya, I am the taste of the water." So there is no need of saying that "I cannot see God. I have not seen God." Here is God. The taste of water is God. Everyone is drinking water. And who is not tasting it? He's seeing God. Why do you say that "I do not see God"? You see, as it is directed by God. Then gradually you'll see Him. If you simply remember this instruction, this one instruction of Bhagavad-gita, raso 'ham apsu kaunteya prabhasmi sasi-suryayoh, "I am the taste of water. I am the shining illumination of sun and moon..." Who has not seen the sunlight? Who has not seen the moonlight? Who has not tasted water? Then why do you say, "I have not seen God"? If you simply practice this bhakti-yoga, as soon as you drink water and taste and be satisfied, "Oh, here is Krsna." So immediately you remember Krsna. As soon as you see sunshine, you remember, "Oh, here is Krsna." As soon as you see moonshine, you remember, "Eh, here is..." As soon as you see something wonderful, paurusam nrsu sabdah khe, as soon as you hear in the sky some sound, so if you remember, "Here is Krsna," that means you are remembering Krsna in every step of your life. And if you're remembering Krsna in every step of life, then you become the topmost yogi. Because Krsna says,
yoginam api sarvesam
mad-gata antaratmana
sraddhavan bhajate...
[Bg. 6.47]
Mad-gata antaratmana. If you feel Krsna in every step of life... It is not very difficult. And, above that, if you practice the chanting -- Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare... There is no tax. Your..., there is no loss of your business. You are all businessmen. But if you chant Hare Krsna mantra, if you remember Krsna while drinking water, what is your loss? Why don't you try it? This is cultivation of knowledge, if you cultivate this knowledge, at the same time go on doing your business, your life will be successful.
Thank you very much. (applause) [break]
Guest (1): How we can come over the ego?
Prabhupada: You cannot come over. Now you are in false ego. You have to come to the real ego. Now you are thinking, "I am Indian. I am Hindu. I am businessman." These are all false ego. When you come to your real ego, that "I am part and parcel of Krsna, eternal servant of Krsna," that is your real... Ego, you cannot give up. But this is your false ego. You have to give up your false ego, come to the real ego. That's... Purify your ego. That is required. [break] ...dhi-vinirmuktam tat-paratvena nirmalam [Cc. Madhya 19.170]. Upadhi. At the present moment, I am thinking like that. "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am brahmana," "I am sudra," "I am black," "I am white" -- these are the egoism of this body. But I'm not this body. Aham brahmasmi. So when you come to that stage... Brahma-bhutah prasannatma [Bg. 18.54]. When you come to your real ego, then you become happy. And because you are in false ego, you are unhappy. So ego cannot be changed. Because you are eternal, how you can be, ego can be changed? Just like people say, "Give up desires." How can you desire..., give up desires of a living entity? That is not possible. But I have to purify my desires. That is wanted. Just like if you have got some disease. So if you, some, the physician, they say "Pluck out your eyes," that is not good treatment. But you treat the eyes nicely and the sight may be good. That is wanted. So this bhakti-marga means sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam. That is bhakti-marga. You have to give up your false ego. Sarva upadhi. This is upadhi: "I am this, I am that, and..." This upadhi has created trouble in the world. So we have to come to the real ego. Jivera svarupa haya nitya krsna dasa [Cc. Madhya 20.108-109]. That is mukti. Mukti hitva anyatha rupam svarupena vyavasthitih. Now hitva anyatha rupam. My ego is going on in a different way. Unnecessarily I am spoiling my life with these designations. But we have to come to the point of our real identity. So nothing can be given up. As living entity, I must be egoistic. Law of identity. How can I say that "I am not"? I am. I am existing. But now I am existing with designations. If I give up my designations, if I become purified, that is my real ego. Sarvopadhi-vinirmuktam tat-paratvena nirmalam [Cc. Madhya 19.170]. One has to become nirmala. And when you become nirmala... Hrsikena hrsikesa sevanam bhaktir ucyate. That is bhakti. So your senses are there. Now with my senses I am thinking that "I am the head of this familyman," "I am head of this community," or "I am..., I have to serve. I have to engage my hand in this way, my eyes in this way, my nose in this way." Senses are engaged in a upadhi, designated. But when this is, designation is taken away, when you become nirmala, the senses remain, the dress of the senses taken away, at that time, your senses are engaged in the service of the Lord, and that is called bhakti.
Bhavananda: Are there are any other questions? [break]
Prabhupada: ...service to the humanity. Now you are thinking service to the humanity means a section of humanity. And why should you stick your service to the humanity? When one is serving his own countrymen, Indian, he does not care for the Englishman. So don't speak of humanity. Nobody can serve the whole humanity in the present way. But if you spread Krsna consciousness, that is the best service to the humanity. Just like we are doing. We have no discrimination, that "These are Indians. These are Americans. They are Hindus. They are Muslims. They are Christians." No. Or "They're cats or dogs." That oneness you can see only when you are Brahman-realized. Samah sarvesu bhutesu. Why humanity? Why not the cats and dogs and cows? You are very much anxious to give service to the humanity, but you are sending animals to the slaughterhouse. Why? (indistinct) the lack of knowledge. You do not (indistinct) is part and parcel of God. You cannot select this part and... Therefore the sastra says, yatha taror mula-nisecanena trpyanti tat-skandha-bhujopasakhah [SB 4.31.14]. Just like by watering the root, you can water automatically the branches, the trunks, the twigs, the flowers, the fruits, the leaves -- everything is watered. Sarvarhanam acyutejya. Or by supplying foodstuff to the stomach, you serve all the senses of the body perfectly. Similarly, when you begin to serve Krsna, then not only to the human society, to the animal society, to the tree society. Every society will be served. That is perfect service. And if you simply limit your service, that is, may be good, but that is not good. According to sastra... Just like you simply water the leaves, the leaves will not live. They'll dry. But if you supply water to the root, everything will be protected. So actual service will begin when you are Krsna conscious. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma na socati na kanksati [Bg. 18.54], samah sarve... That is samah sarvesu. And so long you limit, that is limited service. That is not perfect service.
Guest (1): (indistinct)
Prabhupada: [break] ...immoral(?) generation means godlessness. It is said in the sastra, yasyasti bhaktir bhagavaty akincana sarvaih gunaih tatra samasate surah. If you have unflinching faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, then all the good qualities of demigods will develop unto you. It is not story. It is fact. Just like these European and American students. They, in their previous life, before becoming Krsna consciousness, according to our standard, they were all immoral. Our, in India, illicit sex life still, it is admitted, if it is not followed, to have sex relation with other's wife or other woman except one's wife, that is called immoral or sinful. So in Western countries these things are not immoral or sinful. It is very daily affair. But now, because they have come to Krsna consciousness, they have given up all these things. No illicit sex life. Unless one is married, he must remain brahmacari or vanaprastha or sannyasi. Only grhastha, duly married wife, he can have sex. This is morality. And you should not kill the animals unnecessarily. That is immoral. You are already intoxicated by the influence of maya. You should not be more intoxicated. This is immoral. You should not indulge in gambling. These are immoral. So as soon as you become Krsna consciousness, then all these immoralities vanish immediately. That is the only. Yasyasti bhaktir bhagavaty akincana, sarvaih gunaih tatra samasate su..., harav abhaktsya kuto mahad-guna. One who is not Krsna..., he cannot have any good quality or any morality. That is the decision of the sastra. So if you want to revive the morality of the society, you must take up this Krsna consciousness. Then everything will come.
Guest (1): Sir, this..., why we did not have a world with universal brotherhood, universal love?
Prabhupada: Because you don't want it. Because you don't want it. You do not want. That, that, that is explained in the previous verse, that Krsna says,
sarva-dharman parityajya
mam ekam saranam vraja
aham tvam sarva-papebhyo
moksayisyami...
[Bg. 18.66]
These miserable conditions are there because we are all sinful. So Krsna gives protection that "You surrender unto Me, and I give you protection from the reaction of all sinful life." So who wants Krsna? You do not want. Krsna says, canvassing, but who is accepting? Then how you can get, I mean to say, liberty or liberation from these sinful activities? Aham tvam sarva-papebhyo. People suffer on account of sinful activities. There are two things, papa and punya. So if you follow the path of papa, then you must suffer. Just like state laws. If you become criminal, you must suffer. You must go to the prison house. You, you cannot argue that "Why government has created the prison house? Why?" Can you argue like that? Yes, there is necessity. The government knows that there will be some rascals who will commit criminal activities; therefore there must be prison house. So this material world is prison house. Every one of us, we are member of the prison house-first class, second class, third class. Just like in the prison house there are different classes. Duhkhalayam asasvatam [Bg. 8.15]. You cannot expect treatment in the prison house just like son-in-law. No. That is not possible. You must suffer. Otherwise, what is the meaning of prison house? Similarly, Krsna says, although Krsna has created this world, He says this is duhkhalayam asasvatam, this is the place of misery. And asasvatam. You cannot make any arrangement. "All right, Sir, let it be duhkhalayam. Let me remain here." No. That also you cannot remain. You'll be kicked out. This is the place like that. But Krsna gives you the idea how you can be happy, how you can get out of this. He says, mam upetya kaunteya duhkhalayam asasvatam napnuvanti [Bg. 8.15].
janma karma me divyam
yo janati tattvatah
tyaktva deham punar janma
naiti mam eti...
[Bg. 4.9]
Krsna is canvassing you that "You try to understand Me. Come back." But you do not want it. So how Krsna can save you? You have got the independence. Krsna said to Arjuna, "Now I (have) explained to you everything. Yathecchasi tatha kuru [Bg. 18.63]. Now, whatever you like, you do." So we have got that little independence because we are part and parcel of God. God has got supreme independence and we, being part and parcel... Just like you are all big businessmen. You have got supreme independence in business. Similarly, your sons, they have got also some independence, although subjected. Similarly, we, being part and parcel of God, sons of God, we have got little independence. If we misuse that independence, then we become subjected to all these tribulations. But if we do not misuse... As Krsna says, mam eva ye prapadyante mayam etam taranti te. So it is up to you. If you want to remain in this world of duhkhalayam asasvatam [Bg. 8.15], you can do so. But if you want to get out of it, you can do so. That is up to you. It is not Krsna's fault. Krsna has given you liberty, little independence, whatever. Yathecchasi tatha kuru [Bg. 18.63]. He's given you chance. You want to do this -- "All right, do it." You want to do this? "Do this." He's giving you chance. There is a verse, sarvasya caham hrdi sannivisto mattah smrtir jnanam apohanam ca [Bg. 15.15]. He's situated in everyone's heart. He's understanding what you want, and He's giving you all chance: "All right, have it. Enjoy it." But His instruction is that "This will not make you happy." Sarva-dharman parityaja mam ekam. You do not do it. You must suffer. That is not Krsna's fault. That is your fault.
Guest (1): A small thing. Will Your Reverence have... [break]
Prabhupada: So you have no right to do so.
Guest (1): Say instead of Hare Rama Hare Rama, we say Visva ramane rahim, or something like that, will you have no objection to that?
Prabhupada: No objection.
Guest (1): And will you say...
Prabhupada: But that is no objection.
Guest (1): ...that efficacy will be the same?
Prabhupada: Yes. If Bismillah means Hare Krsna... It is a question of language. So if meaning the same thing, Hare Krsna... Hare Krsna means we are addressing the Supreme Lord and His energy. Hara means the energy of the Supreme Lord, and Krsna means the Supreme Lord. So we are addressing, "My dear Lord, my dear the energy of Lord..." Because Lord and His energy, they are, they are always existing. Just like sun and the sunshine, they're always existing. Sunshine is the energy, but sun is the energetic. Similarly, the Lord is there and His energy's also there. So we are praying both to the energy and to the Lord: "Please engage me in Your service. I am serving maya. I am not happy. Therefore, please engage me in Your..." My, my constitutional position is to serve. Just like you're all sitting here. Every one of you are servant. If you consider that you are master, that is a mistake. That is maya. Every one of you are servant. So "I am serving, but now I am serving maya. I'm not happy. Let me serve You." This is the meaning of Hare Krsna. So if it means that, there is no objection. It is a question of language. It does mean (indistinct). Of course, Caitanya Mahaprabhu says, namnam akari bahudha nija-sarva-saktis tatrarpita niyamitah smarane na kalah. Caitanya Mahaprabhu says the, the person whose name we chant, holy name, in each, in each holy Allah, or something like that, that is not objected if it is actually meaning the Supreme. If it is meaning something else, that is another thing. This question... Just like water or jala. It (is) the same thing. It is simply a different name. If I ask water, you'll give me the water actually, and if I say, jala, you'll give me the same. So if the meaning is all right, then there is no objection. If the meaning is different, then there is objection. We are not fighting with the language. We are not concerned with the language.
Guest (2): Why God created sinful activities?
Prabhupada: You have created. God has not created. You have created. Yes.
Guest (1): In what respect?
Prabhupada: You have created.
Guest (1): In what respect I have created?
Prabhupada: You want to kill animals. God does not say that "You kill animals." So you have created sinful activities.
Guest (1): I am a part and parcel of the almighty God.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Guest (1): So when animals are butchered, why the butcher does not get pain?
Prabhupada: Butcher does not get pain? Do you know that? There is a Sanskrit verse that vyadha ma jiva, ma mara: "My dear butcher, you don't live, don't die." Do you think this butcher, that butchering work is very palatable work? Can you see it, before you, a man is killed, an animal is killed? So he has become accustomed. It pains him. But that work is so abominable that he should not live for executing that work. But what is the benefit of dying? Because after death, he will be butchered. Therefore the sastra says, ma jiva ma mara: "Don't live, don't die." Yes.
Indian man: There is some difference. When we do some good, we consider it as God-inspired, but when we do something bad, then we can't say that it is also God-inspired after we have done it?
Prabhupada: I do not follow what he says.
Guest (2): He says that the inspiration comes from the God for the all works.
Prabhupada: God inspiration comes for every work. That's a fact. But we deny... Just like... You take this simple exam, example. Just like a thief. From within, he's forbidden: "Don't commit theft." But he does it. He does it. You have got all experience about these things. God says from within, "Don't do it," but we do it. That is the defect of without being Krsna consciousness. Just like a thief. He knows that for his criminal activities he'll be punished. He has seen it, that a thief is arrested and he's taken to the prison house. And he has heard from the sastra and from lawbooks that committing theft is not good. Why does he commit it? He knows and he has seen it. Why does he do it? Can you answer? He knows that it is not good, and he has heard it from sastra and from learned lawyers. But why does he do it? This is the influence of nature. As he associated with the nature, ignorance, dark ignorance. He cannot check it. Therefore the best service to humanity is to give him knowledge. Because everyone is in ignorance. Parabhavas tavad abodha-jata yavan na jijnasata atma-tattvam. Everyone is being defeated out of this ignorance. Therefore one should come to the platform of inquiring about the self. That is the best service, athato brahma jijnasa, To revive, invoke people to inquire about Brahman, and that will solve all the questions.
Thank you very much. Hare Krsna. (end)
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Lecture at Bharata Chamber of Commerce "Culture and Business" -- Calcutta, January 30, 1973
© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International. Used with permission.
Wednesday, July 28, 2010
"Brahma Samhita"
6 Sept 73 , Stockholm
Prabhupada: I'll sing from Vedic literature the description of the spiritual world. (chants verses from the Brahma-samhita with devotees) So there are about thirty-five verse like this in the Brahma-samhita describing the tran... [break] ...place of the Lord. It takes time. I have cited about a dozen only. Let me try to explain some of them. Because I have already taken much time. So one verse in these we find:
advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam
adyam purana-purusam nava-yauvanam ca
vedesu durlabham adurlabham atma-bhaktau
govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami
[Bs. 5.33]
The Lord is one, without a second, advaita. Acyuta: the Lord never falls down. The distinction between Lord and ourself... We are also eternal living entities, and the Lord is also eternal. He's also a living entity, a person, just like us, but His name is Acyuta. He never falls from His position. But we living entities, sometimes we fall down. Just our material condition of life. This is our falldown. Therefore He's called advaitam acyutam anadim. And He has no beginning. He is the beginning of everything. The creation is from Him, but He has no creator. So advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam [Bs. 5.33]. And He has got multi-forms. He can expand Himself. The one expansion is that isvarah sarva-bhutanam hrd-dese arjuna tisthati [Bg. 18.61]. He has expanded Himself to live with you within your heart. Isvarah sarva-bhutanam. Not only that; another place it is described, eko 'py asau racayitum jagad-anda-koti. One portion of the Lord... That is confirmed in the Bhagavad-gita: ekamsena sthito jagat [Bg. 10.42]. Jagat means this material world. That is being maintained by one of His plenary portions, which is called Paramatma. Or Garbhodakasayi Visnu, or Ksirodakasayi Visnu. So one portion of His plenary portion, He is within the material world. A material world means within the universe. Andantara-stham. Anda, brahmanda means this universe. This is not only one universe, but there are many millions of universes. So He's there. Advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam [Bs. 5.33]. And andantara-stham: He is within the universe. Andantara-stha-paramanu-cayantara-stham: [Bs. 5.35] and He is within the atom also. Just, just imagine expansion of God. So advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam adyam purana-purusam nava-yauvanam ca. Although He's the oldest of all, you'll find Krsna always a young man. He's, from His face, we'll find a young boy, twenty to twenty-five years. Nava-yauvanam ca. Vedesu durlabham. If you want to search out God by studying Vedas, it will be very difficult. Adurlabham atma-bhaktau. But He's very easily available from His devotee. This is the description.
Then, in another place,
ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhis
tabhir ya eva nija-rupataya kalabhih
goloka eva nivasaty akhilatma-bhuto...
[Bs. 5.37]
The Lord... Everything is not material. That is sac-cid-ananda-vigraha [Bs. 5.1]. Krsna is sac-cid-ananda-vigraha. His form is eternity, blissful and full of knowledge. So all His paraphernalia in the Goloka Vrndavana, that is His expansion of that quality, eternity, blissfulness and knowledge. Ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhis. His gopis, His consorts, His father, His mother, His friends, His trees, His flowers, His calves and cows -- everything is spiritual, expansion from Him. Everything... The... We are also expansion from Him. We are marginal potency. And this is spiritual potency. So everything is expansion. Therefore the Vedic literatures say, sarvam khalv idam brahma: "Everything is Brahman." We are now combination of two energies, marginal energy and the external energy. But in the spiritual world, everything is only spiritual energy. So we are constitutionally spiritual energy. Somehow or other we have been entangled with this material energy. So if we try in this human form of life, we can get out of this material energy and again go back to the spiritual energy. That is the opportunity. Ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhis tabhir ya eva nija-rupataya kalabhih [Bs. 5.37].
Another sloka is to explain: angani yasya sakalendriya-vrtti-manti [Bs. 5.32]. The spiritual body is equally qualified for doing everything. Just like with our hand, we can touch only. We cannot do... Or we can pick up something. But by simply having hand, or with the hand, we cannot eat. For eating we shall have to use this mouth, we have to use the stomach. But in the spiritual world, Krsna, about Him is described: angani yasya sakalendriya-vrtti-manti [Bs. 5.32]. Each and every limb of Krsna has got the potency of other limbs. He can eat by His eyes. He can hear from His eyes. And anything, all the parts of the limbs, because they are spiritual, you can use it for any purpose. This is not understandable in this material condition of life, but it is possible. These things are there.
angani yasya sakalendriya-vrtti-manti
pasyanti panti kalayanti ciram jaganti
ananda-cinmaya-sad-ujjvala-vigrahasya
govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami
[Bs. 5.32]
So His spiritual world, this, His planet, is described that cintamani-prakara-sadmasu kalpa-vrksa-laksavrtesu surabhir abhipalayantam [Bs. 5.29]. In His planet, there are many trees, many palaces, but they're all spiritual. Cintamani means spiritual. The houses, they're made of touchstone. Just like here the houses are made of bricks and wood; there the houses are also spiritual. The touchstone... It is described in the sastra that if there is any touchstone in this material world, the touchstone can turn the iron into gold. So anyway, the houses... There are houses also. Big, big palaces, like here. Cintamani-prakara-sadmasu kalpa-vrksa. And the trees are kalpa-vrksa. Kalpa-vrksa means where you can get fruit, one kind of fruit from one tree, but there, any fruit you want, you can get any tree. That is spiritual world. Prakara-sadmasu kalpa-vrksa. Kalpa-vrksa means that. And surabhir abhipalayantam [Bs. 5.29]. And Krsna is very fond of tending cows. And what are those cows? Surabhi. Surabhi means you can take as much milk as you like and as many times as you like. Here in this material world you have got cows, but you can take milk, limited quantity. And also once or twice. That is the difference.
In this way, if you read Brahma-samhita, you'll get complete description of the spiritual world, the spiritual entities, the Supreme Lord, His associates. His country, His pastimes, everything, very nicely described. And if we become attached to such place, then we can try, we can try, we can prepare ourself for going back to home, back to Godhead. That is the perfection of life. That is the mission of Krsna consciousness movement.
Thank you very much. Hare Krsna. (end)
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Sri Brahma-samhita, Verse 33 -- Stockholm, September 6, 1973, Upsala University
© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International. Used with permission.
For higher quality audio, you may purchase the MP3s/CDs from www.Krishna.com
Prabhupada: I'll sing from Vedic literature the description of the spiritual world. (chants verses from the Brahma-samhita with devotees) So there are about thirty-five verse like this in the Brahma-samhita describing the tran... [break] ...place of the Lord. It takes time. I have cited about a dozen only. Let me try to explain some of them. Because I have already taken much time. So one verse in these we find:
advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam
adyam purana-purusam nava-yauvanam ca
vedesu durlabham adurlabham atma-bhaktau
govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami
[Bs. 5.33]
The Lord is one, without a second, advaita. Acyuta: the Lord never falls down. The distinction between Lord and ourself... We are also eternal living entities, and the Lord is also eternal. He's also a living entity, a person, just like us, but His name is Acyuta. He never falls from His position. But we living entities, sometimes we fall down. Just our material condition of life. This is our falldown. Therefore He's called advaitam acyutam anadim. And He has no beginning. He is the beginning of everything. The creation is from Him, but He has no creator. So advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam [Bs. 5.33]. And He has got multi-forms. He can expand Himself. The one expansion is that isvarah sarva-bhutanam hrd-dese arjuna tisthati [Bg. 18.61]. He has expanded Himself to live with you within your heart. Isvarah sarva-bhutanam. Not only that; another place it is described, eko 'py asau racayitum jagad-anda-koti. One portion of the Lord... That is confirmed in the Bhagavad-gita: ekamsena sthito jagat [Bg. 10.42]. Jagat means this material world. That is being maintained by one of His plenary portions, which is called Paramatma. Or Garbhodakasayi Visnu, or Ksirodakasayi Visnu. So one portion of His plenary portion, He is within the material world. A material world means within the universe. Andantara-stham. Anda, brahmanda means this universe. This is not only one universe, but there are many millions of universes. So He's there. Advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam [Bs. 5.33]. And andantara-stham: He is within the universe. Andantara-stha-paramanu-cayantara-stham: [Bs. 5.35] and He is within the atom also. Just, just imagine expansion of God. So advaitam acyutam anadim ananta-rupam adyam purana-purusam nava-yauvanam ca. Although He's the oldest of all, you'll find Krsna always a young man. He's, from His face, we'll find a young boy, twenty to twenty-five years. Nava-yauvanam ca. Vedesu durlabham. If you want to search out God by studying Vedas, it will be very difficult. Adurlabham atma-bhaktau. But He's very easily available from His devotee. This is the description.
Then, in another place,
ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhis
tabhir ya eva nija-rupataya kalabhih
goloka eva nivasaty akhilatma-bhuto...
[Bs. 5.37]
The Lord... Everything is not material. That is sac-cid-ananda-vigraha [Bs. 5.1]. Krsna is sac-cid-ananda-vigraha. His form is eternity, blissful and full of knowledge. So all His paraphernalia in the Goloka Vrndavana, that is His expansion of that quality, eternity, blissfulness and knowledge. Ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhis. His gopis, His consorts, His father, His mother, His friends, His trees, His flowers, His calves and cows -- everything is spiritual, expansion from Him. Everything... The... We are also expansion from Him. We are marginal potency. And this is spiritual potency. So everything is expansion. Therefore the Vedic literatures say, sarvam khalv idam brahma: "Everything is Brahman." We are now combination of two energies, marginal energy and the external energy. But in the spiritual world, everything is only spiritual energy. So we are constitutionally spiritual energy. Somehow or other we have been entangled with this material energy. So if we try in this human form of life, we can get out of this material energy and again go back to the spiritual energy. That is the opportunity. Ananda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhavitabhis tabhir ya eva nija-rupataya kalabhih [Bs. 5.37].
Another sloka is to explain: angani yasya sakalendriya-vrtti-manti [Bs. 5.32]. The spiritual body is equally qualified for doing everything. Just like with our hand, we can touch only. We cannot do... Or we can pick up something. But by simply having hand, or with the hand, we cannot eat. For eating we shall have to use this mouth, we have to use the stomach. But in the spiritual world, Krsna, about Him is described: angani yasya sakalendriya-vrtti-manti [Bs. 5.32]. Each and every limb of Krsna has got the potency of other limbs. He can eat by His eyes. He can hear from His eyes. And anything, all the parts of the limbs, because they are spiritual, you can use it for any purpose. This is not understandable in this material condition of life, but it is possible. These things are there.
angani yasya sakalendriya-vrtti-manti
pasyanti panti kalayanti ciram jaganti
ananda-cinmaya-sad-ujjvala-vigrahasya
govindam adi-purusam tam aham bhajami
[Bs. 5.32]
So His spiritual world, this, His planet, is described that cintamani-prakara-sadmasu kalpa-vrksa-laksavrtesu surabhir abhipalayantam [Bs. 5.29]. In His planet, there are many trees, many palaces, but they're all spiritual. Cintamani means spiritual. The houses, they're made of touchstone. Just like here the houses are made of bricks and wood; there the houses are also spiritual. The touchstone... It is described in the sastra that if there is any touchstone in this material world, the touchstone can turn the iron into gold. So anyway, the houses... There are houses also. Big, big palaces, like here. Cintamani-prakara-sadmasu kalpa-vrksa. And the trees are kalpa-vrksa. Kalpa-vrksa means where you can get fruit, one kind of fruit from one tree, but there, any fruit you want, you can get any tree. That is spiritual world. Prakara-sadmasu kalpa-vrksa. Kalpa-vrksa means that. And surabhir abhipalayantam [Bs. 5.29]. And Krsna is very fond of tending cows. And what are those cows? Surabhi. Surabhi means you can take as much milk as you like and as many times as you like. Here in this material world you have got cows, but you can take milk, limited quantity. And also once or twice. That is the difference.
In this way, if you read Brahma-samhita, you'll get complete description of the spiritual world, the spiritual entities, the Supreme Lord, His associates. His country, His pastimes, everything, very nicely described. And if we become attached to such place, then we can try, we can try, we can prepare ourself for going back to home, back to Godhead. That is the perfection of life. That is the mission of Krsna consciousness movement.
Thank you very much. Hare Krsna. (end)
>>> Ref. VedaBase => Sri Brahma-samhita, Verse 33 -- Stockholm, September 6, 1973, Upsala University
© 2001 The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust International. Used with permission.
For higher quality audio, you may purchase the MP3s/CDs from www.Krishna.com
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